I don’t know if I am right to be upset
Canadian Thanksgiving is just around the corner. My wife and I usually host a small gathering for my wife’s immediate (mom, dad, sister, and grandparents) family at my house. Last year my sister-in-law asked whether she could bring her fiancé, which we were absolutely happy to have him over.
This year however, things are weird. They just got married within the last month, and I got a text from my SIL letting me know that she invited her mother-in-law to my house. I don’t have any problems with the woman, but I found it to be really rude for her to invite someone over to my house without even asking if it was okay.
My SIL is very self-centred most of the time. She expects people to just do whatever she wants to do, and rarely contributes anything. Usually for Thanksgiving I will cook the turkey and a couple of sides, and everyone else is responsible for bringing something (sides, dessert, buns, appies… anything they feel like bringing). She never brings anything except a container to bring leftovers home with her. She is like this with many other things. She has come camping with us and not brought any food for herself, because she is just assuming that we are going to feed her.
I love my wife’s family, but my SIL drives me insane. I find it incredibly rude that she just decided to invite someone to my house without asking. I don’t know what to do though. I feel like I need to call her out on it, but I also don’t want to ruin Thanksgiving.
I guess I have two questions:
Am I wrong to be upset about this?
If I’m not wrong, then what do I do about it?
Nothing right or wrong with being upset, that's just how you feel. It's what you'll do in response to this that could be right or wrong.
I agree that your SIL shouldn't have invited someone else to your house without asking you first.
Have you spoken with your wife about this incident and/or previous incidents wherein you felt that your SIL wasn't being considerate? This is your wife's family so she should generally be the one managing relationships with them, and any issues you have with them should be discussed with her first. And you and your wife should be on the same page on this. If you handle it a way that your wife disagrees with, that's a bigger problem than your SIL's behavior.
Also, have you been clear with all your guests that the event is potluck? When I host a meal at home and invite people over, I never assume that they'll bring anything; I'm the one inviting them to a meal at my place so I expect to be responsible for feeding them. If they contribute anything that's great; if not that's ok. If I want them to contribute something then I'll make it clear beforehand that it's potluck.
Since other people have been bringing food to your Thanksgiving meal, I'm not sure if it's something you've discussed with them beforehand or if that's just how it's always been done... your wife should have been the one to tell her sister that she's expected to contribute something too.
This is the best response: talk to your wife, then ask which two dishes her and her MIL will be bringing
My wife is also upset about the whole thing. I do like the approach of just simply asking which dishes they are bringing though. It is tradition for guests to offer to bring dishes to every family gathering. In the event where food is ordering pizza for example, everyone chips in money. This approach just solidifies the tradition.
I wouldn't ask, but instead tell them what you expect them to bring. That's how it works in our larger family gatherings. Too difficult to coordinate based on wants, and telling them means you control what you want their responsibilities to be. That way you can assign a less important item that you're ok being without should they fail.
My wife is also frustrated/upset about it. In my wife’s family, every family gathering is considered a “potluck” to some extent. It is customary that the host of the meal invites whichever people are going to attend, and in showing appreciation for the host, each guest offers to bring a food item. Hosting duties usually are split between my wife and her mother, as all of the grandparents are not in the greatest condition health wise these days.
It’s not expected that someone randomly bring something. It’s the thought that counts though, and offering is a big thing.
Oh ok, since it's a family tradition it's a bit strange that the sister doesn't know about it? Or doesn't follow it? It seems like someone in your wife's family should have already spoken to her about it?
Anyway, it's great that you and your wife feel the same way about it. You'll be able to figure out the approach together. I hope the issues can be communicated clearly to the sister and I hope she listens and changes. If no one has tried speaking to her about this before then maybe she's just really oblivious.
Edit - sorry, just read another comment you made on this thread saying that it hasn't gone well whenever SIL would be confronted about her behavior in the past. Sounds difficult! :( I don't know if it might be more effective to just directly ask your SIL to bring food, and to tell her to ask first before inviting someone. Without explaining anymore why her behavior is problematic. Like just going straight to the requests.
Some people are just incredibly selfish like that. I have a close relative who seems to be exactly the same as the person described and we all gave up on reasoning with her about this sort of thing, since she sees herself as an eternal victim (she isn't). She's not dim-witted by any means - she's actually above average intelligence, I think - and she does have flashes of understanding sometimes which result in brief attempts to change her behavior, but for the most part, even though we try to keep her close out of kindness (she's almost certainly older than OP's SIL and has ruined every single one of her friendships by now) sometimes we just need to take breaks, for our own sanity.
She's your wife's sister, right? What is your wife's opinion on all of this? What's been her involvement in the situation so far? How did she react to the previous occasions where her sister did not contribute anything?
These questions lead to the key point imo. Your wife is likely to be in a better position to talk to her sister than you are. And whatever happens, it's going to go better if you and your wife are on the same page going in.
Sorry you have to deal with the SIL. Selfish in the way you describe usually comes as a package deal with a lot of other pettiness.
Yes it does. Every time we have called her out for shitty behaviour, it usually ends in there being a rift in the family. My SIL talks to her parents, and my MIL tries to smooth things over because she doesn’t like conflict. The problem is that she knows how my SIL is, and that she never apologizes for anything. So the end result is usually my MIL trying to get my wife to apologize to her sister, even when my MIL fully admits that she knows my SIL is in the wrong.
It’s family, we have loads of issues that go well beyond this current situation.
My wife has the same mindset regarding the whole thing. A large portion of my frustration regarding this stems from her frustration. My wife is more frustrated that her sister never contributes anything and just takes all of the time. I’m more frustrated that my SIL felt it was okay to invite someone into my house without asking me first. My SIL never hosts any family gatherings, but I can assume she would be rather pissed if I invited my mom without asking her permission.
Has there ever been a come-to-Jesus moment about her sister’s selfishness in the past? Or is the strategy to just ignore it rather than cause even more of a fuss?
If your wife agrees that something needs to be said, it's probably best that she be the one to say it. She's the one with the stronger connection.
I agree with these questions.
It doesn't really matter what anyone else feels about this. What matters are the people that make up the nucleus of that particular home.
Not that I am against getting some outside perspectives on a situation that likely seems confusing.
Remember that it is not only okay, but human to be able to hold multiple opinions on something at once. Even conflicting opinions.
If you're upset, you're upset. Wrong and right has nothing to do with it.
You don't know why your SIL invited this extra person. You assume it's because she's self-centered, but you should make a good faith effort to understand her side of the story. Her situation could be a lot more complicated than you realize.
You already know that "calling her out" will not be productive. If you say nothing, she'll assume that everything is okay, and that's just as bad. Just talk to her and explain that you were surprised by her text, and ask that she not to invite guests over in the future without asking. If she had some reason for not asking you, listen and try to understand her position. You don't need to label her behavior as rude to make that ask. And you don't need to agree with her reasoning to empathize with her.
Others have covered the situation with the SIL's MIL, so I wanted to talk about addressing the issue with the SIL not bringing food to the event. It's clear that this bothers you (and I understand why), and I suspect you think you have to put up with it now, because you didn't say anything the last X times.
But you really don't. Thanksgiving has its traditions, but traditions change when they don't work anymore in a family. As with everything prior commenters said, it's valuable if your wife can be part of the conversation or handle it, but if you're the main cook, it is 100% normal for you to have this talk if she won't.
At least a couple of weeks before the event, I'd contact the SIL and anyone else whose contributions haven't worked well with your event in the past, e.g., the uncle who brings some awful dish no one but him touches. Say something like, "we'd like to formalize who brings what to make sure we can cover all the bases for the meal. This year, would you be able to bring specific item X or specific item Y?"
There's nothing rude about doing this. You're hosting a traditional dinner, and you need to make sure you don't wind up with four green bean casseroles and nothing else to eat. I'd offer at least one option that can easily be bought in case the person doesn't have the cooking skills, planning skills, or time to pull off a great version to bring. If you suspect SIL isn't bringing food because she can't/doesn't like to cook, rather than because she's selfish, suggest something like dinner rolls or cranberry sauce. Those are good options if the person may have limited funds, too.
If you allow them to bring the MIL, I'd clearly assign her a specific item to bring, too. I'd ask SIL's husband, who is related to the MIL, what she can/wants to bring. Maybe the MIL has a wonderful specialty dish and will make a great addition to the meal. In fact, including the husband on the conversation above is a good idea if you can swing it. If your belief that your SIL is "self-centered" is accurate, the husband may well be more invested in maintaining positive relations and/or not committing social faux pas with his wife's family, of which you're a part.
That seems like a good reason to be annoyed. However, maybe that is not enough reason to remain annoyed after the initial shock. Only you can tell.
Good luck!
You are not wrong to be upset about that. It's to be expected that you ask before inviting someone, event if the way you ask more or less compels the other party (e.g. "my mom will be in town for Thanksgiving, is it all right if she comes over?"--it's not like you can say "no, leave your mom at home").
I don't think you should always accept the type of behavior you have described. In this case, I don't think there's anything you can really do beyond trying to make the best of it.
That does make me wonder where the cutoff would be, though. Your wife's sister is family, which makes her husband family, so his mom has to be family, too. So then her new husband has to be family...so his 13-year-old daughter must be family, too, right? Do you just keep accepting people until you physically cannot support any more?
I'm going to throw one out for "calling her out." I think the other answers here are probably more correct in general for this particular situation, and your wife needs to be 100% on the same page before doing this. Calling out shouldn't be taken lightly, and should be reserved for instances when you want improved behavior at any cost. But passively tolerating behavior is how you end up passively tolerating behavior forever.
A ruined Thanksgiving is better than hating every Thanksgiving for the rest of your life.
In retrospect, I could have been happier for a whole extra decade if I cut my parents out when I first should have, rather than passively tolerating their shittiness. Their relationship with my siblings is better as well, as they now keep their worst behavior in line knowing that one of their kids cut them out, another might too.
I called a friend out on shitty behavior. And while we are curently not speaking, I'm hoping they come around after more introspection. But if they don't I'll be happier not having shitty behavior around me.
So yea, bare minimum this is a thing that should be discussed. The uninvited guest as well as general self-centeredness. With your wife, in isolation first. Ruining a Thanksgiving to do it might actually affect behavioral change, because being called out in front of everyone will be much more impactful than doing it seperately later.
You're not wrong to be annoyed. As a host, it's stressful (and expensive) to accommodate last minute guests! But it's your wife's family. She will get shit for anything you do. Even if you help, I think your wife needs to "sign off" on it.
If you think your SIL is selfish, stingy, and self-serving, then the +1 situation is in line with expectations. On the surface, it seems like you should be able to shrug it off. A crappy person acting crappy? Life will go on.
You said there are loads of family issues extending beyond this one situation. Maybe you're fed up with the injustice of it all, and with how poorly your wife is treated by her own family. Why does SIL get to be the exception at every family gathering while everyone else must follow the rules of social decorum? Why must your wife apologize to SIL for trying to teach her manners? That's not even supposed to be her job. Sorry, but your wife probably can't trust her parents (and most of her extended family) to have her back when it comes to disagreements with her sister.
Has your wife taken the time to process this? She might not be ready for a results-oriented discussion until then. She probably has years of resentment to unload! Otherwise, I think you could strategize different scenarios together. You can't predict what will happen once you start rocking the boat, but it helps to have a plan. Ideas of escalating severity include:
Honestly, I like to do things personally.
I know many suggested talking to your wife first. Maybe do that, but ask her how you should handle the situation with your SIL instead and don't ask your wife to talk with her or so.
Then take your SIL aside (don't be the guy who complains about her in front of her family/acquaintances) and calmly tell her that you found it unfair that she invited someone without asking you and you would appreciate better communication between you and her. To calm down the situation, you could maybe add that you're not resentful or so. Just be nice about it. If she reacts confused or gives you a testy reply, stay calm and tell her you don't want to be on bad terms with her, it's just about proper communication.
If your wife tells you to handle things differently from what I would do though, do that. She knows her, I don't.
You're not wrong. Communication is extremely important in such situations.
I pretty much agree with what others have said here. You're not wrong, your sister-in-law is wrong, and either you or your wife confronting her about it might help with your justified angry feelings.
But it also sounds like this isn't going to change. I also have some drama with my family, and I've learned that the best thing to do is to do nothing. Accept that this is how your sister-in-law is, that she doesn't care about your feelings or anyone else's, and that every time you get together, she's going to do something to hurt you. When you invite her, you're inviting everything she is. And that is someone who will hurt you.
I'd just try to ignore it. That's not easy, because her actions absolutely affect you. But I would make it your job to learn to disregard her as much as you can.
I am reminded of something I studied long ago: a particular line of The Yoga Sutras of Patañjali. I had to search around to find it again, but I guess it's part of book one, sutra 33 (I found this translation here, though I haven't read beyond that brief bit I copied and pasted):
I'm not saying that your sister-in-law is "wicked." I sure don't feel that way about problematic people in my family. But it sounds like it might be wise for you to disregard her as much as possible in that way. She's going to do hurtful things no matter what you do. Maybe someday she'll change and you can have an open conversation about how she's hurt you in the past, but she needs to make that change herself. Until then, she's not worth your concern.
In the short term doing nothing is OP's only option. [Edit: Based OP's comments] if they try to have any meaningful discussion with their SIL then its going to blow up in OP's face and MIL will ask OP to apologize for nothing. Any meaningful change needs to start with OP's MIL and will be long term work.
One thing I would caution OP about, there is a good chance that SIL's behaviour will get worse. Also, one day OP's FIL and MIL will die... if MIL has reinforced this behaviour up until that point she will be an unbelievable PITA to deal with.
Well I'm East Asian but I think only very poorly raised Hong Kongers would pull this kind of thing. Usually we're taught not to "bring two bunches of bananas" (ie: don't come empty handed) even if it's for yourself only, and bringing extra guests, even your own boyfriend, can't just be assumed. Value of your contribution also needs to proportionally go up. If the host super stress that we mustn't bring anything at all, then we bring fruit or other ,"last beyond today" gifts.