This technology is absolutely gonna conquer the world in the next couple years. I just bought a Vision Pro and it's totally replaced my phone (while at home). Once it's a little smaller I can...
This technology is absolutely gonna conquer the world in the next couple years. I just bought a Vision Pro and it's totally replaced my phone (while at home). Once it's a little smaller I can totally see it replacing my phone while away from home.
Besides the everyday phone-replacement uses, I have big hopes for VR tech in the entertainment industries (more than just video games I mean). I've been saying it for years and I hope it becomes...
Besides the everyday phone-replacement uses, I have big hopes for VR tech in the entertainment industries (more than just video games I mean). I've been saying it for years and I hope it becomes possible (and accessible) soon, but it would be awesome to watch movies or shows or sports in VR. Like imagine a movie filmed with 360-degree cameras in such a way that you're in there, present in the movie's universe rather than just watching it in a 2D screen. Like the characters are in a car and you're in the back seat, or there's a big action sequence and you're literally dodging projectiles and debris. Or with sports, imagine 'riding' along with one of the drivers in F1, or watching a football/soccer game from the side of the pitch. I think it could be as big a leap as tv was to radio, or color tv to black and white tv. I hope it goes in that direction rather than fizzling off like 3D TVs did.
I feel like VR videos this has the same problem as 3D TVs did though -- not enough content to be sustainable, so it just stays as a gimmick and eventually dies as no more content is created for...
I feel like VR videos this has the same problem as 3D TVs did though -- not enough content to be sustainable, so it just stays as a gimmick and eventually dies as no more content is created for it.
Having watched a some VR videos, it's neat for certain nature stuff, but I never saw anything that would be a "killer app" for the tech
Edit: Ack, I failed at reading comprehension and missed your own comparison to 3D TV at the end, sorry
FWIW, Apple just updated Vision OS to 2.0 and added the ability to convert regular 2D photos to "Spatial" photos via entirely on-device processing. The result feels like magic; like looking...
FWIW, Apple just updated Vision OS to 2.0 and added the ability to convert regular 2D photos to "Spatial" photos via entirely on-device processing. The result feels like magic; like looking through a window through time. Even photos I took in high school on my cheap Samsung look incredible.
What really made my jaw drop, though, was converting my professional wedding photos. You can go "fullscreen" and zoom the photo until it fills your entire field of view. I can look at my wife wearing her wedding dress and holding her bouquet and it's like she's standing in the room in front of me.
I have spent hours over the last week or so converting old photos. Vacations, college, my childhood home, it all looks so incredible converted to 3D. I'm not surprised Apple has changed their store demos to let users experience their own photos like this.
Lol no worries. I think the key difference between VR and 3D TVs is video games. VR already has a perfectly valid use case in the world of VR gaming whereas 3D TVs pretty much always felt like an...
Lol no worries. I think the key difference between VR and 3D TVs is video games. VR already has a perfectly valid use case in the world of VR gaming whereas 3D TVs pretty much always felt like an expensive gimmick. So hopefully that video game VR market can continue developing the tech, making it cheaper and more efficient until we get to the point where it's not just video games that can take advantage of it but other forms of entertainment too. I haven't looked up the exact years but my gut tells me that VR has already outlasted the 3D TV's life cycle as a valid medium for consuming content. Those TVs came and went pretty fast, while VR has been around for a while and seems to get better each year, especially now that these tech giants are getting on board (though they are focusing on the social aspect of it, but hey it's development nonetheless).
Sports and documentary like stuff, yes. On Oculus TV there's two highly produced documentaries that comes into mind. The soloist VR is about Alex Honnold, the guy from Free Solo. And, well, we can...
it would be awesome to watch movies or shows or sports in VR.
Sports and documentary like stuff, yes. On Oculus TV there's two highly produced documentaries that comes into mind.
The soloist VR is about Alex Honnold, the guy from Free Solo. And, well, we can see him free soloing stuff in the Italian Alps. That's breathtaking and we can really get an incredible sense of scale from that point of view. There's a particular drone shot that's 110% flex from the cinematographer.
The other is Space Explorer The ISS Explorer. They put 360 camera in and around the frigging International Space Station , and it's awesome.
But for fiction, it's definitely more challenging to do something good. The art of cinema is as much about what you're not showing as it is what your showing. Having a such a good wide field of view makes ut difficult to make your viewer focus on what you deem important. You can't do tight close up of someone face during an emotional moment without it being awkward. In some sense it's a bit like a theatrical performance except you're in the middle of the arena and the performer are all around. It's probably doable but I assume you're losing a lot of option that you can with regular cinema. I mean, it would be hard to have a Wes Anderson of VR.
Maybe that's what they should do? Make recordings of live concerts, stage plays, and sports. Just show it from one viewpoint, or let you switch between a few different seats. You can look around...
Maybe that's what they should do? Make recordings of live concerts, stage plays, and sports. Just show it from one viewpoint, or let you switch between a few different seats. You can look around for yourself; the point is to make it like being there in the audience.
After getting back to basics, they can innovate from there.
I can't personally recommend them because they're not my thing, but I can share some links. I only used a VR headset for beatsaber, and don't have it anymore due to Facebook account requirements...
I can't personally recommend them because they're not my thing, but I can share some links. I only used a VR headset for beatsaber, and don't have it anymore due to Facebook account requirements and space constraints.
Here are links to popular VR experiences for Nekopara, Spice and Wolf, Hatsune Miku, and Hololive (vtubers):
I'm not sure a 360 point of view of a sport is that much value added compared to a 2D view with specialised equipment. Meaning : I would prefer to watch tennis or football on TV with a team of...
I'm not sure a 360 point of view of a sport is that much value added compared to a 2D view with specialised equipment. Meaning : I would prefer to watch tennis or football on TV with a team of cameraman with high powered zoom and slow motion than being in the court/field.
That said, I'm not against a 3D reconstruction of the whole field (turning the playfield into the largest mocap studio ever) , so that we can put a virtual camera anywhere. But while VR would be probably the best way to experience this, nothing prevents you to consume this from a flat screen.
I think a lot of the shots done on TV would likely induce motion sickness for VR? Maybe they need to start with a more chill experience. I’m not actually a sports fan, though. I’m more interested...
I think a lot of the shots done on TV would likely induce motion sickness for VR? Maybe they need to start with a more chill experience.
I’m not actually a sports fan, though. I’m more interested in concerts. Let’s say the VR concert gives you the experience of a tiny desk concert happening in your living room. Some musician is playing their instrument right in front of you. What camera angles do you really need when you could walk around or move your chair? If you sit too close it would just feel creepy.
(Many living rooms won’t be big enough, so maybe instead it looks like one wall has been knocked out and replaced with a larger rehearsal space for the musicians.)
I agree that none of this seems necessary; watching video on a TV or tablet is usually good enough.
Wow, super cool recommendations! Didn't know about them but I'll check em out, thanks! And yeah the fiction side is definitely still some ways off, but it seems like something that should be...
Wow, super cool recommendations! Didn't know about them but I'll check em out, thanks!
And yeah the fiction side is definitely still some ways off, but it seems like something that should be possible in the somewhat near future if things keep developing as they are. File sizes will probably be astronomically higher than what we're used to now, lol, but I think it will happen in our lifetimes. Currently, video games in VR already exist, so it seems like it wouldn't take a huge leap in progress to get some animated shorts or even a movie (though I'm sure it'll take tons of work to get the angles and positioning right, like you mention).
And as for live action, I think the sports thing will happen before full-blown TV shows and movies. Maybe to start it'll be just the biggest events, like the World Cup Final or the Super Bowl. Then maybe gradually it gets expanded until it becomes more prevalent throughout various sports. This helps develop the tech, including VR cameras, headsets, and large file transferring and broadcasting. Then some director will get the idea to make a rebooted movie franchise in VR to try and build hype due to the novelty of it. Like 2052, Marvel has run out of ideas and no one wants to watch superhero movies anymore, so they say 'well you haven't seen one in VR yet!' and greenlight Spiderman: Home is Where the Heart Is that is shot exclusively in VR so you can feel like you're zipping around like Spiderman.
This is what I was thinking too. Not to mention the fact that creating a 360 degree set would be impractical for almost everything. Where do you put the cameras, sound crews, etc? Maybe you could...
But for fiction, it's definitely more challenging to do something good. The art of cinema is as much about what you're not showing as it is what your showing.
This is what I was thinking too. Not to mention the fact that creating a 360 degree set would be impractical for almost everything. Where do you put the cameras, sound crews, etc? Maybe you could have AI "filling in" the rest of the bubble, but I'm mostly negative on AI-produced content, so I'm not sure that would be something I want.
Superhot VR is pretty stationary as far as VR games go, is there anything in particular that sets it off for you? There may be something to taking the 3D that's already in a film, and putting you...
Superhot VR is pretty stationary as far as VR games go, is there anything in particular that sets it off for you?
There may be something to taking the 3D that's already in a film, and putting you into a theater environment with more depth of field. That's what immediate use case, but is it more convenient than a TV or a phone or some form of monitor that most everyone already has?
Well, I guess they removed it from the game now so it's not really a spoiler - the part where you jump off the building. Lots of "fast" movement without any real movement from me. Also have to...
Well, I guess they removed it from the game now so it's not really a spoiler - the part where you jump off the building. Lots of "fast" movement without any real movement from me. Also have to close my eyes on H3VRs ziplines.
Yeah I think the nausea in VR comes from the dissociation of you 'moving' around in the game but staying stationary in real life. Like the falling and ziplines you mention (you're not actually...
Yeah I think the nausea in VR comes from the dissociation of you 'moving' around in the game but staying stationary in real life. Like the falling and ziplines you mention (you're not actually falling or ziplining IRL). But if your VR avatar is stationary it's usually not as bad. So fixed camera angles (like sitting in a car) might be okay as long as the car isn't swerving all over the place. You'll be stationary in real life and also stationary inside the virtual car.
But of course everyone's tolerance is different, so I'm sure it'll be a problem for some. But I can see this nausea problem being somewhat sidestepped by creative directors who will find clever solutions and camera angles that give us plenty of action without a ton of movement. The same way that directors 100 years ago had to get creative with their camera angles to hide special effects and stunts from the audience.
I’ve loved VR since the first time I tried a Rift DK1 and got that same feeling I did moving from 16-bit 2D games to the PlayStation all those years before, I’ve got a couple of headsets, I’ve...
Once it's a little smaller I can totally see it replacing my phone while away from home.
I’ve loved VR since the first time I tried a Rift DK1 and got that same feeling I did moving from 16-bit 2D games to the PlayStation all those years before, I’ve got a couple of headsets, I’ve even played around with some very rudimentary development for them - but it’s only in the last six months or so I’ve started thinking of it as something that might actually be a really useful part of my day to day life/workflow as well as an exciting novelty.
My real need is something I can throw in my work bag, plug into my laptop, and use to comfortably replicate the big multi-monitor setup I have at home while I’m travelling. Between the Vision Pro’s focus on resolution and passthrough quality, and the Bigscreen Beyond’s tiny size and weight, I’m thinking we’re maybe one hardware generation away from that being almost as good as the real thing.
Do you just wear it all day? I bought a Vision Pro several months ago and just sold it last week. Having used a few other AR/VR headsets over the years, there are quite a few areas of Vision Pro...
Do you just wear it all day?
I bought a Vision Pro several months ago and just sold it last week. Having used a few other AR/VR headsets over the years, there are quite a few areas of Vision Pro is light years ahead of almost everyone else. There are also a few that make it very obvious that it’s very much a first generation product. In terms of the complete package though, it’s incredible.
But I just don’t see how I can use it as my daily computer. The apps just aren’t there. And as high resolution as those micro OLED screens are, they just aren’t good enough for mirroring a Mac screen at native resolution.
This technology is absolutely gonna conquer the world in the next couple years. I just bought a Vision Pro and it's totally replaced my phone (while at home). Once it's a little smaller I can totally see it replacing my phone while away from home.
Besides the everyday phone-replacement uses, I have big hopes for VR tech in the entertainment industries (more than just video games I mean). I've been saying it for years and I hope it becomes possible (and accessible) soon, but it would be awesome to watch movies or shows or sports in VR. Like imagine a movie filmed with 360-degree cameras in such a way that you're in there, present in the movie's universe rather than just watching it in a 2D screen. Like the characters are in a car and you're in the back seat, or there's a big action sequence and you're literally dodging projectiles and debris. Or with sports, imagine 'riding' along with one of the drivers in F1, or watching a football/soccer game from the side of the pitch. I think it could be as big a leap as tv was to radio, or color tv to black and white tv. I hope it goes in that direction rather than fizzling off like 3D TVs did.
I feel like VR videos this has the same problem as 3D TVs did though -- not enough content to be sustainable, so it just stays as a gimmick and eventually dies as no more content is created for it.
Having watched a some VR videos, it's neat for certain nature stuff, but I never saw anything that would be a "killer app" for the tech
Edit: Ack, I failed at reading comprehension and missed your own comparison to 3D TV at the end, sorry
FWIW, Apple just updated Vision OS to 2.0 and added the ability to convert regular 2D photos to "Spatial" photos via entirely on-device processing. The result feels like magic; like looking through a window through time. Even photos I took in high school on my cheap Samsung look incredible.
What really made my jaw drop, though, was converting my professional wedding photos. You can go "fullscreen" and zoom the photo until it fills your entire field of view. I can look at my wife wearing her wedding dress and holding her bouquet and it's like she's standing in the room in front of me.
I have spent hours over the last week or so converting old photos. Vacations, college, my childhood home, it all looks so incredible converted to 3D. I'm not surprised Apple has changed their store demos to let users experience their own photos like this.
How does spatial photo/video compares to light fields photos and videos. I always felt that this was the endgame of VR photography.
Lol no worries. I think the key difference between VR and 3D TVs is video games. VR already has a perfectly valid use case in the world of VR gaming whereas 3D TVs pretty much always felt like an expensive gimmick. So hopefully that video game VR market can continue developing the tech, making it cheaper and more efficient until we get to the point where it's not just video games that can take advantage of it but other forms of entertainment too. I haven't looked up the exact years but my gut tells me that VR has already outlasted the 3D TV's life cycle as a valid medium for consuming content. Those TVs came and went pretty fast, while VR has been around for a while and seems to get better each year, especially now that these tech giants are getting on board (though they are focusing on the social aspect of it, but hey it's development nonetheless).
Sports and documentary like stuff, yes. On Oculus TV there's two highly produced documentaries that comes into mind.
The soloist VR is about Alex Honnold, the guy from Free Solo. And, well, we can see him free soloing stuff in the Italian Alps. That's breathtaking and we can really get an incredible sense of scale from that point of view. There's a particular drone shot that's 110% flex from the cinematographer.
The other is Space Explorer The ISS Explorer. They put 360 camera in and around the frigging International Space Station , and it's awesome.
But for fiction, it's definitely more challenging to do something good. The art of cinema is as much about what you're not showing as it is what your showing. Having a such a good wide field of view makes ut difficult to make your viewer focus on what you deem important. You can't do tight close up of someone face during an emotional moment without it being awkward. In some sense it's a bit like a theatrical performance except you're in the middle of the arena and the performer are all around. It's probably doable but I assume you're losing a lot of option that you can with regular cinema. I mean, it would be hard to have a Wes Anderson of VR.
Maybe that's what they should do? Make recordings of live concerts, stage plays, and sports. Just show it from one viewpoint, or let you switch between a few different seats. You can look around for yourself; the point is to make it like being there in the audience.
After getting back to basics, they can innovate from there.
There are plenty of Japanese idol concerts in this style, but the lowest common denominator of vertical video streams still wins out...
I’m wondering what this looks like. Are there any in particular that you would recommend?
I can't personally recommend them because they're not my thing, but I can share some links. I only used a VR headset for beatsaber, and don't have it anymore due to Facebook account requirements and space constraints.
Here are links to popular VR experiences for Nekopara, Spice and Wolf, Hatsune Miku, and Hololive (vtubers):
Thanks!
It's not really my thing either. Maybe Anime isn't a great fit for VR? Drawings don't get better as you zoom in.
The simple art style works fine, and some of the models are...very detailed in questionable ways. Lack of detail isn't an issue in Superhot.
I'm not sure a 360 point of view of a sport is that much value added compared to a 2D view with specialised equipment. Meaning : I would prefer to watch tennis or football on TV with a team of cameraman with high powered zoom and slow motion than being in the court/field.
That said, I'm not against a 3D reconstruction of the whole field (turning the playfield into the largest mocap studio ever) , so that we can put a virtual camera anywhere. But while VR would be probably the best way to experience this, nothing prevents you to consume this from a flat screen.
I think a lot of the shots done on TV would likely induce motion sickness for VR? Maybe they need to start with a more chill experience.
I’m not actually a sports fan, though. I’m more interested in concerts. Let’s say the VR concert gives you the experience of a tiny desk concert happening in your living room. Some musician is playing their instrument right in front of you. What camera angles do you really need when you could walk around or move your chair? If you sit too close it would just feel creepy.
(Many living rooms won’t be big enough, so maybe instead it looks like one wall has been knocked out and replaced with a larger rehearsal space for the musicians.)
I agree that none of this seems necessary; watching video on a TV or tablet is usually good enough.
Wow, super cool recommendations! Didn't know about them but I'll check em out, thanks!
And yeah the fiction side is definitely still some ways off, but it seems like something that should be possible in the somewhat near future if things keep developing as they are. File sizes will probably be astronomically higher than what we're used to now, lol, but I think it will happen in our lifetimes. Currently, video games in VR already exist, so it seems like it wouldn't take a huge leap in progress to get some animated shorts or even a movie (though I'm sure it'll take tons of work to get the angles and positioning right, like you mention).
And as for live action, I think the sports thing will happen before full-blown TV shows and movies. Maybe to start it'll be just the biggest events, like the World Cup Final or the Super Bowl. Then maybe gradually it gets expanded until it becomes more prevalent throughout various sports. This helps develop the tech, including VR cameras, headsets, and large file transferring and broadcasting. Then some director will get the idea to make a rebooted movie franchise in VR to try and build hype due to the novelty of it. Like 2052, Marvel has run out of ideas and no one wants to watch superhero movies anymore, so they say 'well you haven't seen one in VR yet!' and greenlight Spiderman: Home is Where the Heart Is that is shot exclusively in VR so you can feel like you're zipping around like Spiderman.
This is what I was thinking too. Not to mention the fact that creating a 360 degree set would be impractical for almost everything. Where do you put the cameras, sound crews, etc? Maybe you could have AI "filling in" the rest of the bubble, but I'm mostly negative on AI-produced content, so I'm not sure that would be something I want.
I can already feel my motion sickness from Superhot VR coming back up. 3D... Like, full 3D VR movies would be an absolute vomit fest.
Superhot VR is pretty stationary as far as VR games go, is there anything in particular that sets it off for you?
There may be something to taking the 3D that's already in a film, and putting you into a theater environment with more depth of field. That's what immediate use case, but is it more convenient than a TV or a phone or some form of monitor that most everyone already has?
Well, I guess they removed it from the game now so it's not really a spoiler - the part where you jump off the building. Lots of "fast" movement without any real movement from me. Also have to close my eyes on H3VRs ziplines.
Yeah I think the nausea in VR comes from the dissociation of you 'moving' around in the game but staying stationary in real life. Like the falling and ziplines you mention (you're not actually falling or ziplining IRL). But if your VR avatar is stationary it's usually not as bad. So fixed camera angles (like sitting in a car) might be okay as long as the car isn't swerving all over the place. You'll be stationary in real life and also stationary inside the virtual car.
But of course everyone's tolerance is different, so I'm sure it'll be a problem for some. But I can see this nausea problem being somewhat sidestepped by creative directors who will find clever solutions and camera angles that give us plenty of action without a ton of movement. The same way that directors 100 years ago had to get creative with their camera angles to hide special effects and stunts from the audience.
I’ve loved VR since the first time I tried a Rift DK1 and got that same feeling I did moving from 16-bit 2D games to the PlayStation all those years before, I’ve got a couple of headsets, I’ve even played around with some very rudimentary development for them - but it’s only in the last six months or so I’ve started thinking of it as something that might actually be a really useful part of my day to day life/workflow as well as an exciting novelty.
My real need is something I can throw in my work bag, plug into my laptop, and use to comfortably replicate the big multi-monitor setup I have at home while I’m travelling. Between the Vision Pro’s focus on resolution and passthrough quality, and the Bigscreen Beyond’s tiny size and weight, I’m thinking we’re maybe one hardware generation away from that being almost as good as the real thing.
Do you just wear it all day?
I bought a Vision Pro several months ago and just sold it last week. Having used a few other AR/VR headsets over the years, there are quite a few areas of Vision Pro is light years ahead of almost everyone else. There are also a few that make it very obvious that it’s very much a first generation product. In terms of the complete package though, it’s incredible.
But I just don’t see how I can use it as my daily computer. The apps just aren’t there. And as high resolution as those micro OLED screens are, they just aren’t good enough for mirroring a Mac screen at native resolution.