Sure, that's a general truism, but I wouldn't go so far as to accuse Opera of lying about not keeping logs without any evidence, especially since I get the distinct impression that they are...
They say no logs, but if it's free you're the product.
Sure, that's a general truism, but I wouldn't go so far as to accuse Opera of lying about not keeping logs without any evidence, especially since I get the distinct impression that they are treating the "free VPN" (technically just a proxy) as a loss leader. They may lose money on that particular aspect of their business, but since it gets more people to use their browser, it ultimately makes them more money elsewhere, e.g. their licensing, advertising and search engine deals, which is where the majority of their revenue comes from:
In 2017, our top two largest business partners in aggregate contributed approximately 56.1% of our operating revenue, with Google and Yandex accounting for 43.2% and 12.9% of our operating revenue, respectively.”
The rest is ads and licensing deals. You may have noticed that Opera’s speed dial is pre-populated with websites by default, such as Booking.com or eBay. Those are advertising partners. Some phone manufacturers and telecom companies also pre-install Opera browsers on their devices. The company is getting some revenue from that too.
Another thing to keep in mind is that Opera Software AS is a Norwegian company, and SurfEasy (the VPN they acquired a few years ago to offer this new service) is a Canadian company. And while I can't speak to Norwegian laws, since I don't live there, I do know that Canada has pretty reasonable consumer protection, truth in advertising, and privacy laws... so I doubt Opera and SurfEasy would straight up lie about not logging your traffic data, as that would open them up to all sorts of potential lawsuits, and privacy commissioner fines for violating the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act.
The "you're the product" meme grates for me too, but on second thought I think it should be read as "I don't know anything in particular but I am suspicious of free stuff." We probably should be...
The "you're the product" meme grates for me too, but on second thought I think it should be read as "I don't know anything in particular but I am suspicious of free stuff."
We probably should be more suspicious of free stuff and either investigate it or avoid it. This doesn't need to be seen as a specific accusation but rather as general wariness of strangers. Do we put too much trust in brand names? Probably.
We should probably be wary of purchases too, though. Lots of low-security electronics are being sold, not to mention counterfeits.
Unfortunately this leaves us being suspicious of everything. Maybe we should have more sympathy for people who trust brands, for lack of alternatives? It's unclear how as consumers we can make informed decisions when we know so little about the supply chains we rely on and many of the things we are worried about are invisible.
I dislike most applications of the word "truism". It is frequently used to end a discussion that requires more nuance than it seems. There are many situations in which obvious statements are not...
that's a general truism
I dislike most applications of the word "truism". It is frequently used to end a discussion that requires more nuance than it seems. There are many situations in which obvious statements are not only useful but required.
Some features would be nice even for a regular browser, such as: native ad-blocker easier native theming easier video pop-out bandwidth limits Resource usage limits (2 and 3 probably doesn't help...
Some features would be nice even for a regular browser, such as:
native ad-blocker
easier native theming
easier video pop-out
bandwidth limits
Resource usage limits (2 and 3 probably doesn't help with that)
integrated messengers (especially if they come with a bunch of keybindings - they probably won't)
But I can't think of any situation where browser sound effects would be a plus, and I doubt GX Corner will see widespread use. To be frank, even with some interesting features, few people would give up the support and flexibility of Chrome or Firefox for a specialized browser. Unless it's bundled with something like Steam.
Also: I'm on Linux and the download button serves me a Windows exe.
The bandwidth limits would be great. I’d love to designate certain sites on a whitelist where they’re allowed to hog RAM (media streaming, mostly) and force everyone else to make do. Too much...
The bandwidth limits would be great. I’d love to designate certain sites on a whitelist where they’re allowed to hog RAM (media streaming, mostly) and force everyone else to make do. Too much scripted up nonsense on the web today.
For sure. When I upgraded my build to ryzen a couple years ago, it was impossible to find an am4 x370 board without RGB. I had to settle on the MSI Gaming Pro Carbon.
For sure. When I upgraded my build to ryzen a couple years ago, it was impossible to find an am4 x370 board without RGB. I had to settle on the MSI Gaming Pro Carbon.
It's also "early access". Hopefully they'll release Mac and Linux versions once it's a finished product, but I understand why they would focus on a single platform at this stage.
I understand the lack of Linux support though. I doubt many Linux users would want to use this.
It's also "early access". Hopefully they'll release Mac and Linux versions once it's a finished product, but I understand why they would focus on a single platform at this stage.
At first I laughed but in all honesty, it doesn't seem that bad? Like regular Opera, it's based on Chromium, which has its upsides and downsides, but most importantly that any Chrome addon is...
At first I laughed but in all honesty, it doesn't seem that bad?
Like regular Opera, it's based on Chromium, which has its upsides and downsides, but most importantly that any Chrome addon is gonna work here as well. This means RES, uBlock Origin, etc. all that good stuff.
I honestly dig the design. It's not the typical gam3r look, it's just nice deep black with an accent colour you can pick.
I like the functions like integrated messengers/Twitch, even though I probably wouldn't use them that much (Signal ftw!). The fact that you can limit resource usage is also very nice, although it'd probably only be useful for budget gamers or people on a slow connection.
The only really sketchy thing is the VPN. Either they're banking on it being free and later they'll introduce a paid tier, or they'll collect your data. Probably the latter, as Opera was sold to a Chinese company in 2015.
Not necessarily. If their cost from providing a user free VPN is lower than their income from providing that user a pre-installed search engine and bookmarks, it might be worth giving it away no...
The only really sketchy thing is the VPN. Either they're banking on it being free and later they'll introduce a paid tier, or they'll collect your data. Probably the latter, as Opera was sold to a Chinese company in 2015.
Not necessarily. If their cost from providing a user free VPN is lower than their income from providing that user a pre-installed search engine and bookmarks, it might be worth giving it away no strings attached to attract more users.
Unless you're in China, what good does the CCP get from your personal data? I'd rather them have it than a company under US jurisdiction, since I actually live in the US and can face repercussions...
Unless you're in China, what good does the CCP get from your personal data? I'd rather them have it than a company under US jurisdiction, since I actually live in the US and can face repercussions here, whereas the CCP can't do shit to me here.
Obviously business data is a different beast entirely, and there I feel the mistrust of Chinese companies is much more applicable to those of us in the West.
Probably the same reason the NSA collects everyone's data like crazy: Cause of some internal reasoning ultimately they only know. All we know is that they definitely do it though (thanks,...
Probably the same reason the NSA collects everyone's data like crazy: Cause of some internal reasoning ultimately they only know. All we know is that they definitely do it though (thanks, Snowden).
Sure, the CCP can't hurt you right now. Data doesn't decay, it stays on properly stored HDDs forever. Political climates change.
Would you give a stranger the key to your house, even if it's illegal for them to enter withour your consent, solely relying on the police to keep you safe? Probably not, so why do the same with your data?
Huh. I went into this assuming it was going to be shit, but it actually has a bit of appeal. I'm not hardcore enough to need most of those features, but I can see the use for a specific sort of...
Huh. I went into this assuming it was going to be shit, but it actually has a bit of appeal. I'm not hardcore enough to need most of those features, but I can see the use for a specific sort of person.
After playing around with it, it really seems like a browser built for home theatre PC use as opposed to regular PC use. A lot of the features here remind me of Steam Big Picture. Additionally,...
After playing around with it, it really seems like a browser built for home theatre PC use as opposed to regular PC use. A lot of the features here remind me of Steam Big Picture.
Additionally, this is the first browser I've noticed where it lets you use your desktop wallpaper as the New Tab background and that's actually pretty neat.
The inclusion of a free VPN is spooky. They say no logs, but if it's free you're the product.
Opera is owned by a Chinese consortium, they're definitely getting all that sweet sweet data.
Source
Sure, that's a general truism, but I wouldn't go so far as to accuse Opera of lying about not keeping logs without any evidence, especially since I get the distinct impression that they are treating the "free VPN" (technically just a proxy) as a loss leader. They may lose money on that particular aspect of their business, but since it gets more people to use their browser, it ultimately makes them more money elsewhere, e.g. their licensing, advertising and search engine deals, which is where the majority of their revenue comes from:
Another thing to keep in mind is that Opera Software AS is a Norwegian company, and SurfEasy (the VPN they acquired a few years ago to offer this new service) is a Canadian company. And while I can't speak to Norwegian laws, since I don't live there, I do know that Canada has pretty reasonable consumer protection, truth in advertising, and privacy laws... so I doubt Opera and SurfEasy would straight up lie about not logging your traffic data, as that would open them up to all sorts of potential lawsuits, and privacy commissioner fines for violating the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act.
The "you're the product" meme grates for me too, but on second thought I think it should be read as "I don't know anything in particular but I am suspicious of free stuff."
We probably should be more suspicious of free stuff and either investigate it or avoid it. This doesn't need to be seen as a specific accusation but rather as general wariness of strangers. Do we put too much trust in brand names? Probably.
We should probably be wary of purchases too, though. Lots of low-security electronics are being sold, not to mention counterfeits.
Unfortunately this leaves us being suspicious of everything. Maybe we should have more sympathy for people who trust brands, for lack of alternatives? It's unclear how as consumers we can make informed decisions when we know so little about the supply chains we rely on and many of the things we are worried about are invisible.
Aggregating data and tossing out exact connection logs would technically be "no log" IMO. Each VPN user could have a hidden profile out there.
I dislike most applications of the word "truism". It is frequently used to end a discussion that requires more nuance than it seems. There are many situations in which obvious statements are not only useful but required.
I'm not saying this is necessarily the case here.
Some features would be nice even for a regular browser, such as:
2and3probably doesn't help with that)But I can't think of any situation where browser sound effects would be a plus, and I doubt GX Corner will see widespread use. To be frank, even with some interesting features, few people would give up the support and flexibility of Chrome or Firefox for a specialized browser. Unless it's bundled with something like Steam.
Also: I'm on Linux and the download button serves me a Windows
exe.Seriously. I want all these features without the 1337 g4m3r design language.
Obviously I'm just not the target audience but when things are marketed as "Gamer (x)" I sort of instinctively turn off.
The regular Opera browser has most of these features, except for the bandwith/resource limits and the Twitch integration.
The bandwidth limits would be great. I’d love to designate certain sites on a whitelist where they’re allowed to hog RAM (media streaming, mostly) and force everyone else to make do. Too much scripted up nonsense on the web today.
Same with laptop hardware, lol.
For sure. When I upgraded my build to ryzen a couple years ago, it was impossible to find an am4 x370 board without RGB. I had to settle on the MSI Gaming Pro Carbon.
It's also "early access". Hopefully they'll release Mac and Linux versions once it's a finished product, but I understand why they would focus on a single platform at this stage.
It's only avaliable for windows and Mac
At first I laughed but in all honesty, it doesn't seem that bad?
Like regular Opera, it's based on Chromium, which has its upsides and downsides, but most importantly that any Chrome addon is gonna work here as well. This means RES, uBlock Origin, etc. all that good stuff.
I honestly dig the design. It's not the typical gam3r look, it's just nice deep black with an accent colour you can pick.
I like the functions like integrated messengers/Twitch, even though I probably wouldn't use them that much (Signal ftw!). The fact that you can limit resource usage is also very nice, although it'd probably only be useful for budget gamers or people on a slow connection.
The only really sketchy thing is the VPN. Either they're banking on it being free and later they'll introduce a paid tier, or they'll collect your data. Probably the latter, as Opera was sold to a Chinese company in 2015.
Not necessarily. If their cost from providing a user free VPN is lower than their income from providing that user a pre-installed search engine and bookmarks, it might be worth giving it away no strings attached to attract more users.
They can do both. And I will never trust a Chinese-owned firm with my data, as every Chinese company is under the thumb of the CCP.
Unless you're in China, what good does the CCP get from your personal data? I'd rather them have it than a company under US jurisdiction, since I actually live in the US and can face repercussions here, whereas the CCP can't do shit to me here.
Obviously business data is a different beast entirely, and there I feel the mistrust of Chinese companies is much more applicable to those of us in the West.
Probably the same reason the NSA collects everyone's data like crazy: Cause of some internal reasoning ultimately they only know. All we know is that they definitely do it though (thanks, Snowden).
Sure, the CCP can't hurt you right now. Data doesn't decay, it stays on properly stored HDDs forever. Political climates change.
Would you give a stranger the key to your house, even if it's illegal for them to enter withour your consent, solely relying on the police to keep you safe? Probably not, so why do the same with your data?
Huh. I went into this assuming it was going to be shit, but it actually has a bit of appeal. I'm not hardcore enough to need most of those features, but I can see the use for a specific sort of person.
After playing around with it, it really seems like a browser built for home theatre PC use as opposed to regular PC use. A lot of the features here remind me of Steam Big Picture.
Additionally, this is the first browser I've noticed where it lets you use your desktop wallpaper as the New Tab background and that's actually pretty neat.