I realize that many people will not exercise no matter what, however I think it would be a health revolution if medicine could find a way to reverse joint damage from osteo and rheumatoid...
I realize that many people will not exercise no matter what, however I think it would be a health revolution if medicine could find a way to reverse joint damage from osteo and rheumatoid arthritis. I know so many people who would walk miles a day, but their knees, hips, backs will start to hurt.
I spend about 4 months of every year unable to exercise due to injury - usually an irritation of a pelvis injury i got when I was 17. I would kill to be able to push hard at all of my favorite...
I spend about 4 months of every year unable to exercise due to injury - usually an irritation of a pelvis injury i got when I was 17. I would kill to be able to push hard at all of my favorite sports/hobbies but even in my mid-thirties I've come to terms with the fact that I am in the maintenance period of my life due to past injuries.
My left leg is absolutely a land mine, and though I've been working to improve it, my sense of balance now adjusts my course leftward. I'm hoping for a treadmill.
My left leg is absolutely a land mine, and though I've been working to improve it, my sense of balance now adjusts my course leftward. I'm hoping for a treadmill.
My right leg is a mess; i fell on my bent knee in my 20s, sprained it a dozen times, and later had big metal spring go through it near my shin. It is Jacked Up. I've been doing a very simple yoga...
My right leg is a mess; i fell on my bent knee in my 20s, sprained it a dozen times, and later had big metal spring go through it near my shin. It is Jacked Up.
I've been doing a very simple yoga routine since December, and its like night and day. My sense of balance, proprioception (which I've always struggled with), everything is better, but i hadn't noticed how little i moved my right leg at all. The difference is staggering! I cannot recommend it enough. Do it for yourself, i feel like a useful leg grew back in place of my old beat up one.
I hope it helps! I have some nerve damage from the impalement injury & a pretty noticeable groove where the muscle didn't come back quite right, so it can still be helpful even with permanent...
I hope it helps! I have some nerve damage from the impalement injury & a pretty noticeable groove where the muscle didn't come back quite right, so it can still be helpful even with permanent damage/imperfect muscle function.
I would kill to be able to even walk as much as I used to be able to even 5 years ago. I'm 32 and my chronic pain has basically killed my ability to do much more than suffer. Any time I try to get...
I would kill to be able to even walk as much as I used to be able to even 5 years ago. I'm 32 and my chronic pain has basically killed my ability to do much more than suffer. Any time I try to get even a gentle workout/exercise routine going, I have either a major pain flare (my last one is still going, and it's been a month), or I have an injury, like the ankle sprain in March.
I've been considering a life-altering surgery to help with the back pain, but before anyone will even consider it, I need to drop a significant amount of weight. Weight that was brought on because of the chronic pain and reinjury. I'm not going to give a specific number, but it's literally a quarter of my body weight.
Hi, Sorry if this comment comes off as unneeded advice that’s super obvious, but I don’t know anything about your personal situation. But I would recommend, as a taller guy, who used to be very...
Hi,
Sorry if this comment comes off as unneeded advice that’s super obvious, but I don’t know anything about your personal situation.
But I would recommend, as a taller guy, who used to be very heavy (I lost over 25% of my body weight in fat at one point), some strength training.
You can probably do some relatively low impact strength training with low weights, and it might help your situation a lot.
I myself have essentially eliminated all of my back pain by doing exercises that target my back, such as bent over rows.
Now like I said, I don’t know about your personal situation, and if this is applicable to you. But even some small weights of just a few pounds could be a great place to start and they might help you out a lot.
I appreciate the advice! I'm a short lady, but I used to be a professional dancer. Weight training was part of my routine then. I should add some more weight training back in, I just have a lot of...
I appreciate the advice! I'm a short lady, but I used to be a professional dancer. Weight training was part of my routine then.
I should add some more weight training back in, I just have a lot of restrictions right now because bending over feels like tearing my lower back muscles apart. Starting slowly if the way to go though!
I wonder if there are some modified weight training things I can do laying in bed (where I don't experience any pain lol).
Seeing a good physiotherapist is probably a good first step! I have a type of inflammatory arthritis and at one point could barely walk from couch to kitchen without extreme pain. Now I can run...
Seeing a good physiotherapist is probably a good first step! I have a type of inflammatory arthritis and at one point could barely walk from couch to kitchen without extreme pain. Now I can run again! There were meds involved too, but I equally credit my amazing physios for getting me strong and moving again. I started working with them one-on-one, and then moved on to Pilates classes run at the Physio office - so more personalised to my specific issues rather than a large class of everyone doing the same moves. While that would be the ideal, any Pilates class might also be helpful as it focuses on the smaller supporting muscles which are often imbalanced when we have an injury or chronic pain.
Sorry if this is obvious first-line advice! It’s just really helped me so wanted to share in case.
(In the extremely small chance that you happen to live in sydney I’ll send you their name because they actually happen to be dance physios!)
I had a really amazing PT. Then my insurance decided they didn't want to continue to provide me weekly aquatic PT and that I have to come back in house (Kaiser) and only be seen every other week....
I had a really amazing PT. Then my insurance decided they didn't want to continue to provide me weekly aquatic PT and that I have to come back in house (Kaiser) and only be seen every other week. My PT used to give me a 20 minute massage and do my exercises with me and make sure I am doing them correctly, and altering in action. My current PT gives me exercises and tells me show me you know what they are and then sends me on my way, despite telling him this isn't what works for me, and Kaiser doesn't let me be seen more frequently. I was doing really well with the other PT and in three months, I'm back to where I was before the aquatic PT last year with Kaiser's in-house PT nonsense.
To be clear, I fully blame Kaiser for this and for me becoming more disabled in the last 6 years (my original L4/L5 injury was in 2011).
I'm so glad that you're doing so much better now! I hope you stay this way!
Ah I’m so sorry to hear that, insurance in America sounds like a nightmare to navigate. On the other hand, here you have to pay full price so it is less accessible for some - I’m lucky that I’ve...
Ah I’m so sorry to hear that, insurance in America sounds like a nightmare to navigate. On the other hand, here you have to pay full price so it is less accessible for some - I’m lucky that I’ve been able to afford it.
I hope your situation improves. Chronic pain is a misery that most can never understand (luckily for them!)
There may be, I’m not sure of your exact situation but I’m sure if you could consult with a physical therapist they’d be able to point you in the right direction.
There may be, I’m not sure of your exact situation but I’m sure if you could consult with a physical therapist they’d be able to point you in the right direction.
Not in bed, but might be worth taking a look at hybrid calisthenics on YouTube,and looking through the free routines he posits on his website. He puts a lot of effort into trying to come up with...
Not in bed, but might be worth taking a look at hybrid calisthenics on YouTube,and looking through the free routines he posits on his website. He puts a lot of effort into trying to come up with modified versions of every exercise he demonstrates, and is very encouraging around the idea that you do what you can in terms of reps, and build slowly. Might not be a good fit at all, I don't know your exact situation, but I hope you might be able to find some that help.
Thanks for the recommendation! I appreciate it. I'll take a look through his channel and see if there's something that sparks for me. Any other resources you want to throw my way, I'll be happy to...
Thanks for the recommendation! I appreciate it. I'll take a look through his channel and see if there's something that sparks for me. Any other resources you want to throw my way, I'll be happy to take a look.
I'd be interested in hearing about your strength training, especially what targets the lower back. I've dropped an embarrassing amount (triple digits of pounds) of weight by diet and cycling. My...
I'd be interested in hearing about your strength training, especially what targets the lower back.
I've dropped an embarrassing amount (triple digits of pounds) of weight by diet and cycling. My legs are amazing but everything else is weak. The back pain hasn't really gotten much better..
I generally try to do a full body workout, but the exercise I’ve found most helps my lower back is pull up and bent over rows. Lots of good resources online for getting started in weight training....
I generally try to do a full body workout, but the exercise I’ve found most helps my lower back is pull up and bent over rows.
Lots of good resources online for getting started in weight training. I think anything that targets your core or back would be really helpful. (Pull ups, rows, deadlifts, Supermans).
Cycling can help. I have two trauma induced osteoarthritic ankles. The more I bike, the more they work the way they are supposed to (i.e. pain free miles of walking). Barefooting also helps a lot.
Cycling can help. I have two trauma induced osteoarthritic ankles. The more I bike, the more they work the way they are supposed to (i.e. pain free miles of walking).
I always wonder how much barefooting help with walking/running exercises. I am debating whether I should get a barefoot walking shoe. I'm also worried about whether the barefoot movement is a sham...
I always wonder how much barefooting help with walking/running exercises. I am debating whether I should get a barefoot walking shoe. I'm also worried about whether the barefoot movement is a sham or not.
I can say this about my experience so far. There is a lot of sensation, and it forces me to slow down and breathe, which can only be good. It seems to help with foot function, and increase ankle...
I can say this about my experience so far. There is a lot of sensation, and it forces me to slow down and breathe, which can only be good. It seems to help with foot function, and increase ankle mobility, very good for me as I have two broken ankles that didn’t quite heal right.
I might go for a pair for my day to day walking shoe, just to try it out. Something to replace my toms that is slowly falling apart. My feet and legs are pretty strong from hiking, but I wouldn't...
I might go for a pair for my day to day walking shoe, just to try it out. Something to replace my toms that is slowly falling apart.
My feet and legs are pretty strong from hiking, but I wouldn't mind trying something to improve my feet strength.
Selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs) are a promising emerging medical intervention which can help to build joint tissue and muscle, and research has mostly focused on osteoarthritis and...
Selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs) are a promising emerging medical intervention which can help to build joint tissue and muscle, and research has mostly focused on osteoarthritis and elderly health.
The article does later provide a quote stating that the upper numbers (20,000-ish) did not have large enough sample sizes for conclusive statements. A nice shareable quote, from the WHO:
“Our study confirms that the more you walk, the better,” Banach noted. “We found that this applied to both men and women, irrespective of age and irrespective of whether you live in a temperate, sub-tropical, or sub-polar region of the world or a region with a mixture of climates. In addition, our analysis indicates that as few as 4,000 steps a day are needed to significantly reduce deaths from any cause, and even fewer to reduce deaths from cardiovascular disease.”
The study, just published in the European Journal of Preventive Cardiology found that walking an average of at least 3,967 steps a day started to reduce the risk of dying from any cause, and 2,337 steps a day reduced the risk of dying from cardiovascular diseases.
The new analysis of 226,889 people from 17 different studies around the world has shown that the more you walk, the greater the health benefits. The risk of dying from any cause or from cardiovascular disease decreases significantly with every 500 to 1000 extra steps you walk. An increase of 1,000 steps a day was associated with a 15% reduction in the risk of dying from any cause, while an increase of 500 steps a day was associated with a 7% reduction in dying from heart disease and stroke.
The researchers, led by cardiology Prof. Maciej Banach at the Medical University of Lodz, Poland who is also adjunct professor at the Ciccarone Center for the Prevention of Cardiovascular Disease at Baltimore’s Johns Hopkins University School of Medicine, found that even if people walked as many as 20,000 steps a day, the health benefits continued to increase. They have not found an upper limit yet.
The article does later provide a quote stating that the upper numbers (20,000-ish) did not have large enough sample sizes for conclusive statements.
A nice shareable quote, from the WHO:
insufficient physical activity is the fourth most frequent cause of death in the world, with 3.2 million deaths a year related to physical inactivity.
Getting poor health (and other bad things happening in your life) might make you walk less. Then you die and somebody will say that you did not walk enough when in fact you did not walk as a...
Getting poor health (and other bad things happening in your life) might make you walk less. Then you die and somebody will say that you did not walk enough when in fact you did not walk as a consequence of your poor health. And it was your poor health that killed you, not the lack of walking.
This the type of answers that cannot be obtained with observations but with community trials. The researcher increases in some communities the likelihood of people doing exercise and keep those...
This the type of answers that cannot be obtained with observations but with community trials.
The researcher increases in some communities the likelihood of people doing exercise and keep those chances unchanged in control communities. Then a follow up will determine whether such intervention modifies mortality. Trials must be repeated and have similar results (in general) to be supportive of causality.
In this case, as in many others, researchers cannot control for the sequence in the chain of causation. They cannot control for temporality,
This is an important caveat because the policy making must focus on whether to invest on "do more exercise" or in "disease prevention" by other measures or both.
The fact that researchers cannot do anything else does not improve the conclusion of the research but highlights the limitation of these type of studies. It is interesting that despite that, in this study as in many others researchers are aware of the limitations to assume a causal relationship but they are explicit in assuming it.
I do not understand what is the point you are trying to make. Do you think that because a study is uniquely super large it is not under the limitations of the methodology?
I do not understand what is the point you are trying to make. Do you think that because a study is uniquely super large it is not under the limitations of the methodology?
This is not an issue of data analysis as we might think of statistics. It is an issue of methodology and assumption of causality, which many researchers know and ,as in this case, is displaced by...
This is not an issue of data analysis as we might think of statistics. It is an issue of methodology and assumption of causality, which many researchers know and ,as in this case, is displaced by results of regression analyses.
They should have not conclude that exercise as steps is the reason why people's mortality change, only that their results is consistent with that... and with many other hypotheses, which they do not discuss as seriously as the "how many steps" one.
Have you read the actual study or only this article about it? https://academic.oup.com/eurjpc/advance-article/doi/10.1093/eurjpc/zwad229/7226309?login=false They don’t conclude a causal...
Have you read the actual study or only this article about it?
The articles was written using walking as the risk factor and mortality as the outcome. In the Discussion section the authors say "Therefore, our analysis demonstrates that ‘more is better’ with...
The articles was written using walking as the risk factor and mortality as the outcome.
In the Discussion section the authors say "Therefore, our analysis demonstrates that ‘more is better’ with respect to step counts in both sexes— irrespective of age and the location where walking takes place. In addition, the results indicate that as little as 4000 steps/day are needed to significantly reduce all-cause mortality, and even fewer steps are required for a significant reduction in CV death. "
That is a clear statement about the authors believing in a causal relationship. They say "4000 steps/day are needed to significantly reduce all-cause mortality." I am sure it skipped the reviewers' attention.
Those are such astonishingly low numbers. 2,000 steps is about 15-20 minutes of walking for me. I’m actually surprised there are enough people out there walking less than that to be able to draw...
Those are such astonishingly low numbers. 2,000 steps is about 15-20 minutes of walking for me. I’m actually surprised there are enough people out there walking less than that to be able to draw that conclusion (I’m assuming they controlled for disability and illness).
Also interesting to see no upper limit - I have read in a few places recently, and I can’t now remember whether these were studies or articles, that over about 7,500 steps the benefits are negligible. (Edit: this study: Association of Step Volume and Intensity With All-Cause Mortality in Older Women https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/article-abstract/2734709 is the one I was thinking of. I presume this was included in the meta analysis) There’s been a pushback against the 10,000 steps number, which, to be fair, was plucked from thin air by a pedometer company to sell more product, but it seems that might be a good aim after all.
From the abstract: “Compared with the reference quartile with median steps/day 3967 (2500–6675), the Quartile 1 (Q1, median steps: 5537), Quartile 2 (Q2, median steps 7370), and Quartile 3 (Q3, median steps 11 529) were associated with lower risk for all-cause mortality (48, 55, and 67%, respectively; P < 0.05, for all).”
It seems reasonable that there would be no limit. The more you walk every day, the healthier you have to be to support that much walking and the more you're going to improve your health. It's a...
It seems reasonable that there would be no limit. The more you walk every day, the healthier you have to be to support that much walking and the more you're going to improve your health. It's a low-impact activity so most people can basically keep going until their bodies get too tired to continue, which will keep them from getting injured.
I agree but the question is whether there’s a point beyond which benefits are negligible. This is an important point for people who are short on time, for example.
I agree but the question is whether there’s a point beyond which benefits are negligible. This is an important point for people who are short on time, for example.
Many things are things you can bounce back from, and a sedentary lifestyle and stimulants like caffiene are both among them. If you stay active and moderate your stimulant consumption there's no...
Many things are things you can bounce back from, and a sedentary lifestyle and stimulants like caffiene are both among them. If you stay active and moderate your stimulant consumption there's no reason that you've permanently harmed yourself. Though the older you are the more likely it is that you don't have enough time/energy remaining to make the lifestyle changes necessary to have a more active/healthy life. At 33 you shouldn't have any problems as long as you keep active.
It's definitely possible to have fine enough damage to have lifelong effects, but I bet you haven't unless you're already seeing distinct medical issues. (Read: you have already been to a doctor...
It's definitely possible to have fine enough damage to have lifelong effects, but I bet you haven't unless you're already seeing distinct medical issues. (Read: you have already been to a doctor to try and fix X)
As a 42yr old with a lifelong penchant for playing games and writing code for a living, the most dangerous problem is lifestyle. The habits and daily priorities we form in our 20s help shape the rest of our lives. They can always be changed, but the longer you do them the more comfortable and familiar they become and the more willpower it takes to change them later.
My advice, be very deliberate about building good habits. If you're headed for a sedentary career, make a point of walking away from your desk every hour like clockwork. Build some minimum level of exercise (like a 20min walk) into your daily routine before/during/after work and stick to it like a religious zealot. That way you'll always have your baseline be something above zero.
I mean, that's a dramatic change. You're definitely going to feel different. I've never been particularly fit, and I don't really work out a lot, so I do get a little winded going up stairs. But...
I mean, that's a dramatic change. You're definitely going to feel different. I've never been particularly fit, and I don't really work out a lot, so I do get a little winded going up stairs. But it's a heavy breathing, not a gasping situation where I can't get enough air.
So maybe you're experiencing the difference between "healthy" and "fit" ?
I'm the same age as you and have had a very sedentary WFH job for the last 7 years. Like, some mornings I wake up, pick up my laptop and start working in bed. During this time I slowly started...
I'm the same age as you and have had a very sedentary WFH job for the last 7 years. Like, some mornings I wake up, pick up my laptop and start working in bed.
During this time I slowly started picking up all sorts of random injuries as my muscles began to atrophy. At the beginning of this year I said enough and began eating right, running, and lifting weights.
It's been about 6 months of this now and I can run 5-10k a week, mixed with 3-4 weight sessions. My body is starting to look more muscular and I feel great. You can definitely still do it.
I know a good half-dozen people who have sedentary desk jobs and swear by two things: stand-up desks and walking mats under said desks. Yes, you look weird on Zoom with your head bouncing but on...
I know a good half-dozen people who have sedentary desk jobs and swear by two things: stand-up desks and walking mats under said desks.
Yes, you look weird on Zoom with your head bouncing but on the other hand you'll get your steps in during meetings =)
I realize that many people will not exercise no matter what, however I think it would be a health revolution if medicine could find a way to reverse joint damage from osteo and rheumatoid arthritis. I know so many people who would walk miles a day, but their knees, hips, backs will start to hurt.
I spend about 4 months of every year unable to exercise due to injury - usually an irritation of a pelvis injury i got when I was 17. I would kill to be able to push hard at all of my favorite sports/hobbies but even in my mid-thirties I've come to terms with the fact that I am in the maintenance period of my life due to past injuries.
My left leg is absolutely a land mine, and though I've been working to improve it, my sense of balance now adjusts my course leftward. I'm hoping for a treadmill.
My right leg is a mess; i fell on my bent knee in my 20s, sprained it a dozen times, and later had big metal spring go through it near my shin. It is Jacked Up.
I've been doing a very simple yoga routine since December, and its like night and day. My sense of balance, proprioception (which I've always struggled with), everything is better, but i hadn't noticed how little i moved my right leg at all. The difference is staggering! I cannot recommend it enough. Do it for yourself, i feel like a useful leg grew back in place of my old beat up one.
I might give that a try. My only concern is my damage isn't physical, it's neurological. But maybe it'll work just the same!
I hope it helps! I have some nerve damage from the impalement injury & a pretty noticeable groove where the muscle didn't come back quite right, so it can still be helpful even with permanent damage/imperfect muscle function.
This is the routine, best of luck!
I would kill to be able to even walk as much as I used to be able to even 5 years ago. I'm 32 and my chronic pain has basically killed my ability to do much more than suffer. Any time I try to get even a gentle workout/exercise routine going, I have either a major pain flare (my last one is still going, and it's been a month), or I have an injury, like the ankle sprain in March.
I've been considering a life-altering surgery to help with the back pain, but before anyone will even consider it, I need to drop a significant amount of weight. Weight that was brought on because of the chronic pain and reinjury. I'm not going to give a specific number, but it's literally a quarter of my body weight.
Hi,
Sorry if this comment comes off as unneeded advice that’s super obvious, but I don’t know anything about your personal situation.
But I would recommend, as a taller guy, who used to be very heavy (I lost over 25% of my body weight in fat at one point), some strength training.
You can probably do some relatively low impact strength training with low weights, and it might help your situation a lot.
I myself have essentially eliminated all of my back pain by doing exercises that target my back, such as bent over rows.
Now like I said, I don’t know about your personal situation, and if this is applicable to you. But even some small weights of just a few pounds could be a great place to start and they might help you out a lot.
I appreciate the advice! I'm a short lady, but I used to be a professional dancer. Weight training was part of my routine then.
I should add some more weight training back in, I just have a lot of restrictions right now because bending over feels like tearing my lower back muscles apart. Starting slowly if the way to go though!
I wonder if there are some modified weight training things I can do laying in bed (where I don't experience any pain lol).
Seeing a good physiotherapist is probably a good first step! I have a type of inflammatory arthritis and at one point could barely walk from couch to kitchen without extreme pain. Now I can run again! There were meds involved too, but I equally credit my amazing physios for getting me strong and moving again. I started working with them one-on-one, and then moved on to Pilates classes run at the Physio office - so more personalised to my specific issues rather than a large class of everyone doing the same moves. While that would be the ideal, any Pilates class might also be helpful as it focuses on the smaller supporting muscles which are often imbalanced when we have an injury or chronic pain.
Sorry if this is obvious first-line advice! It’s just really helped me so wanted to share in case.
(In the extremely small chance that you happen to live in sydney I’ll send you their name because they actually happen to be dance physios!)
I had a really amazing PT. Then my insurance decided they didn't want to continue to provide me weekly aquatic PT and that I have to come back in house (Kaiser) and only be seen every other week. My PT used to give me a 20 minute massage and do my exercises with me and make sure I am doing them correctly, and altering in action. My current PT gives me exercises and tells me show me you know what they are and then sends me on my way, despite telling him this isn't what works for me, and Kaiser doesn't let me be seen more frequently. I was doing really well with the other PT and in three months, I'm back to where I was before the aquatic PT last year with Kaiser's in-house PT nonsense.
To be clear, I fully blame Kaiser for this and for me becoming more disabled in the last 6 years (my original L4/L5 injury was in 2011).
I'm so glad that you're doing so much better now! I hope you stay this way!
Ah I’m so sorry to hear that, insurance in America sounds like a nightmare to navigate. On the other hand, here you have to pay full price so it is less accessible for some - I’m lucky that I’ve been able to afford it.
I hope your situation improves. Chronic pain is a misery that most can never understand (luckily for them!)
There may be, I’m not sure of your exact situation but I’m sure if you could consult with a physical therapist they’d be able to point you in the right direction.
I have a physical therapist. He's okay at best, but He doesn't really help as much as my last one who I saw weekly that started with massage.
Not in bed, but might be worth taking a look at hybrid calisthenics on YouTube,and looking through the free routines he posits on his website. He puts a lot of effort into trying to come up with modified versions of every exercise he demonstrates, and is very encouraging around the idea that you do what you can in terms of reps, and build slowly. Might not be a good fit at all, I don't know your exact situation, but I hope you might be able to find some that help.
Thanks for the recommendation! I appreciate it. I'll take a look through his channel and see if there's something that sparks for me. Any other resources you want to throw my way, I'll be happy to take a look.
I'd be interested in hearing about your strength training, especially what targets the lower back.
I've dropped an embarrassing amount (triple digits of pounds) of weight by diet and cycling. My legs are amazing but everything else is weak. The back pain hasn't really gotten much better..
I generally try to do a full body workout, but the exercise I’ve found most helps my lower back is pull up and bent over rows.
Lots of good resources online for getting started in weight training. I think anything that targets your core or back would be really helpful. (Pull ups, rows, deadlifts, Supermans).
Cycling can help. I have two trauma induced osteoarthritic ankles. The more I bike, the more they work the way they are supposed to (i.e. pain free miles of walking).
Barefooting also helps a lot.
I always wonder how much barefooting help with walking/running exercises. I am debating whether I should get a barefoot walking shoe. I'm also worried about whether the barefoot movement is a sham or not.
I can say this about my experience so far. There is a lot of sensation, and it forces me to slow down and breathe, which can only be good. It seems to help with foot function, and increase ankle mobility, very good for me as I have two broken ankles that didn’t quite heal right.
I might go for a pair for my day to day walking shoe, just to try it out. Something to replace my toms that is slowly falling apart.
My feet and legs are pretty strong from hiking, but I wouldn't mind trying something to improve my feet strength.
I mean actually barefoot, i.e. no shoes at all.
Barefoot outside and/or inside?
Sorry my bad. I thought you meant barefooting shoes.
Yup, outside. On the roots, the gravel, the hot pavement. As an old yoga instructor used to tell me, it’s ok to feel a lot of sensation.
Wow, I'm not sure I'll do that outside the lawn area. But your feet must be crazy resilient.
Selective androgen receptor modulators (SARMs) are a promising emerging medical intervention which can help to build joint tissue and muscle, and research has mostly focused on osteoarthritis and elderly health.
The article does later provide a quote stating that the upper numbers (20,000-ish) did not have large enough sample sizes for conclusive statements.
A nice shareable quote, from the WHO:
Getting poor health (and other bad things happening in your life) might make you walk less. Then you die and somebody will say that you did not walk enough when in fact you did not walk as a consequence of your poor health. And it was your poor health that killed you, not the lack of walking.
This the type of answers that cannot be obtained with observations but with community trials.
The researcher increases in some communities the likelihood of people doing exercise and keep those chances unchanged in control communities. Then a follow up will determine whether such intervention modifies mortality. Trials must be repeated and have similar results (in general) to be supportive of causality.
In this case, as in many others, researchers cannot control for the sequence in the chain of causation. They cannot control for temporality,
This is an important caveat because the policy making must focus on whether to invest on "do more exercise" or in "disease prevention" by other measures or both.
The fact that researchers cannot do anything else does not improve the conclusion of the research but highlights the limitation of these type of studies. It is interesting that despite that, in this study as in many others researchers are aware of the limitations to assume a causal relationship but they are explicit in assuming it.
I do not understand what is the point you are trying to make. Do you think that because a study is uniquely super large it is not under the limitations of the methodology?
This is not an issue of data analysis as we might think of statistics. It is an issue of methodology and assumption of causality, which many researchers know and ,as in this case, is displaced by results of regression analyses.
They should have not conclude that exercise as steps is the reason why people's mortality change, only that their results is consistent with that... and with many other hypotheses, which they do not discuss as seriously as the "how many steps" one.
Have you read the actual study or only this article about it?
https://academic.oup.com/eurjpc/advance-article/doi/10.1093/eurjpc/zwad229/7226309?login=false
They don’t conclude a causal relationship, they conclude that they’re associated.
The articles was written using walking as the risk factor and mortality as the outcome.
In the Discussion section the authors say "Therefore, our analysis demonstrates that ‘more is better’ with respect to step counts in both sexes— irrespective of age and the location where walking takes place. In addition, the results indicate that as little as 4000 steps/day are needed to significantly reduce all-cause mortality, and even fewer steps are required for a significant reduction in CV death. "
That is a clear statement about the authors believing in a causal relationship. They say "4000 steps/day are needed to significantly reduce all-cause mortality." I am sure it skipped the reviewers' attention.
Those are such astonishingly low numbers. 2,000 steps is about 15-20 minutes of walking for me. I’m actually surprised there are enough people out there walking less than that to be able to draw that conclusion (I’m assuming they controlled for disability and illness).
Also interesting to see no upper limit - I have read in a few places recently, and I can’t now remember whether these were studies or articles, that over about 7,500 steps the benefits are negligible. (Edit: this study: Association of Step Volume and Intensity With All-Cause Mortality in Older Women https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/article-abstract/2734709 is the one I was thinking of. I presume this was included in the meta analysis) There’s been a pushback against the 10,000 steps number, which, to be fair, was plucked from thin air by a pedometer company to sell more product, but it seems that might be a good aim after all.
From the abstract: “Compared with the reference quartile with median steps/day 3967 (2500–6675), the Quartile 1 (Q1, median steps: 5537), Quartile 2 (Q2, median steps 7370), and Quartile 3 (Q3, median steps 11 529) were associated with lower risk for all-cause mortality (48, 55, and 67%, respectively; P < 0.05, for all).”
https://academic.oup.com/eurjpc/advance-article-abstract/doi/10.1093/eurjpc/zwad229/7226309?redirectedFrom=fulltext&login=false#
It seems reasonable that there would be no limit. The more you walk every day, the healthier you have to be to support that much walking and the more you're going to improve your health. It's a low-impact activity so most people can basically keep going until their bodies get too tired to continue, which will keep them from getting injured.
I agree but the question is whether there’s a point beyond which benefits are negligible. This is an important point for people who are short on time, for example.
Many things are things you can bounce back from, and a sedentary lifestyle and stimulants like caffiene are both among them. If you stay active and moderate your stimulant consumption there's no reason that you've permanently harmed yourself. Though the older you are the more likely it is that you don't have enough time/energy remaining to make the lifestyle changes necessary to have a more active/healthy life. At 33 you shouldn't have any problems as long as you keep active.
It's definitely possible to have fine enough damage to have lifelong effects, but I bet you haven't unless you're already seeing distinct medical issues. (Read: you have already been to a doctor to try and fix X)
As a 42yr old with a lifelong penchant for playing games and writing code for a living, the most dangerous problem is lifestyle. The habits and daily priorities we form in our 20s help shape the rest of our lives. They can always be changed, but the longer you do them the more comfortable and familiar they become and the more willpower it takes to change them later.
My advice, be very deliberate about building good habits. If you're headed for a sedentary career, make a point of walking away from your desk every hour like clockwork. Build some minimum level of exercise (like a 20min walk) into your daily routine before/during/after work and stick to it like a religious zealot. That way you'll always have your baseline be something above zero.
I mean, that's a dramatic change. You're definitely going to feel different. I've never been particularly fit, and I don't really work out a lot, so I do get a little winded going up stairs. But it's a heavy breathing, not a gasping situation where I can't get enough air.
So maybe you're experiencing the difference between "healthy" and "fit" ?
Long Covid, perhaps. Post Exertional Malaise is a bitch.
I'm the same age as you and have had a very sedentary WFH job for the last 7 years. Like, some mornings I wake up, pick up my laptop and start working in bed.
During this time I slowly started picking up all sorts of random injuries as my muscles began to atrophy. At the beginning of this year I said enough and began eating right, running, and lifting weights.
It's been about 6 months of this now and I can run 5-10k a week, mixed with 3-4 weight sessions. My body is starting to look more muscular and I feel great. You can definitely still do it.
I know a good half-dozen people who have sedentary desk jobs and swear by two things: stand-up desks and walking mats under said desks.
Yes, you look weird on Zoom with your head bouncing but on the other hand you'll get your steps in during meetings =)
You could always invest in a walking desk.