17 votes

WandaVision | Episode 9 Discussion Thread

26 comments

  1. [2]
    soks_n_sandals
    Link
    I stopped watching the Marvel movies after the first Avengers. Didn't have the time or interest to make it to the theaters. But, I've finished watching WandaVision and was floored for the entire...

    I stopped watching the Marvel movies after the first Avengers. Didn't have the time or interest to make it to the theaters. But, I've finished watching WandaVision and was floored for the entire show. It gave me strong Westworld vibes without the violence. I liked WandaVision so much that I've started at the beginning of the MCU and I watching all the movies in time-line order. I'm up to the Winter Soldier, in which the Easter egg sets up Wanda and Pietro. I'm excited to get the full context of the time line leading up to WandaVision and it's a testament to how good the writing is that it stands on its own while simultaneously incorporating so many details from the movies.

    12 votes
    1. hamstergeddon
      Link Parent
      Similar situation for me. I've never really been super into the Marvel movies, but I'd seen bits and pieces here and there. But to kill time between Fridays, I've been going back and catching up...

      Similar situation for me. I've never really been super into the Marvel movies, but I'd seen bits and pieces here and there. But to kill time between Fridays, I've been going back and catching up on stuff. I think you'll really enjoy Age of Ultron and Civil War as they both setup a lot for WandaVision.

      6 votes
  2. [7]
    moocow1452
    (edited )
    Link
    Lot of people are going to have to eat a whole bunch of crow on a Mephisto/X-Men mega twist. I am totally fine with the whole meta of the hype building up to an epic "Bohner" reveal. I'm not...
    • Lot of people are going to have to eat a whole bunch of crow on a Mephisto/X-Men mega twist. I am totally fine with the whole meta of the hype building up to an epic "Bohner" reveal.
    • I'm not really into the two final boss fights going off at the same time, especially with so little build up to White Vision comparatively and how they aren't interacting with one another. Liked how both resolved, even if you set it up in the previously on.
    • What can actually stick to Hayward crime wise? Everyone who can speak to him doing villainous things is either in on White Vision, insubordinate to SWORD, or is unwilling to testify due to having to then answer to mind controlling a town.
    • Even if everyone in Westview was perfectly content with being enthralled into suburban bliss, mind control is still wrong, and does Wanda recognize that, or are they purposely setting her up for a more detached, "Doctor Manhattan" arc in the future?
    8 votes
    1. [3]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. [2]
        BlindCarpenter
        Link Parent
        Yea I agree, I was quite disappointed by that. If any of the characters were to cross over from X-Men, he would have been my first choice. But now it was just a cheap gag which makes me think he...

        Yea I agree, I was quite disappointed by that. If any of the characters were to cross over from X-Men, he would have been my first choice. But now it was just a cheap gag which makes me think he is not coming back.

        5 votes
        1. nothis
          Link Parent
          Wait, so he isn't Quicksilver after all? This seemed to build up to something but nothing happened.

          Wait, so he isn't Quicksilver after all? This seemed to build up to something but nothing happened.

          6 votes
    2. [3]
      smithsonian
      Link Parent
      Darcy downloaded and accessed all of his files, so they probably don't need a ton of eyewitness testimony when they already have a ton of evidence, which probably include his own communications he...
      • What can actually stick to Hayward crime wise?

      Darcy downloaded and accessed all of his files, so they probably don't need a ton of eyewitness testimony when they already have a ton of evidence, which probably include his own communications he sent that incriminate himself.

      That being said, I'm not entirely sure what crimes he would really be charged with.

      2 votes
      1. [2]
        Thrabalen
        Link Parent
        Theft of government property and a coverup related to same? If his story to other government agents is that Wanda stole Vision's body, he's operating off-books.

        Theft of government property and a coverup related to same? If his story to other government agents is that Wanda stole Vision's body, he's operating off-books.

        1. moocow1452
          Link Parent
          Assuming Hayward has highest clearances as acting director of SWORD, I'm not sure whether or not he can lie to underlings or other acronym organizations. If there is anyone he does answer to,...

          Assuming Hayward has highest clearances as acting director of SWORD, I'm not sure whether or not he can lie to underlings or other acronym organizations. If there is anyone he does answer to, they're probably more upset that he lost White Vision than the initial coverup.

          1 vote
    3. Thrabalen
      Link Parent
      We all know that if we're going to get Mephisto, it's going to be in Spider-Man 4: You Can't Go Home Again

      We all know that if we're going to get Mephisto, it's going to be in Spider-Man 4: You Can't Go Home Again

      1 vote
  3. [4]
    Grzmot
    Link
    Apologies for forgetting to post this discussion thread on Friday! :( The end was simpler than I expected. No real implications for the rest of the MCU, just a powerup for Wanda and the revival of...

    Apologies for forgetting to post this discussion thread on Friday! :(

    The end was simpler than I expected. No real implications for the rest of the MCU, just a powerup for Wanda and the revival of Vision and nothing else. In a way, those are already big things for a TV show in a franchise packed to the brim with 200 mill USD blockbusters, but all the theories made it seem more involved. I suppose it makes more sense that Marvel would like to keep things like Mephisto under wraps for now, as the MCU is only just starting to get into the whole weird space magic shit from the comics.

    On the other hand I think it's nice that Wandavision focused more on Wanda's trauma and how she dealt with it in a fucked up way. I would've liked some more introspection from her about what she has done to all those people but the show ended to soon for that sadly.

    7 votes
    1. [3]
      Addyct
      Link Parent
      Except that post credits scene showing that Scarlet Witch is studying the Darkhold, which has huge implications for the future. The most powerful magic user on the planet who is prophesized to end...

      no real implications for the rest of the MCU

      Except that post credits scene showing that Scarlet Witch is studying the Darkhold, which has huge implications for the future. The most powerful magic user on the planet who is prophesized to end the world is studying the book of sins. Before WandaVision started, one of the bigger rumors was that Wanda was going to be one of the main villains (or, if not an actual villain, then a huge source of danger) of the next phase. It got overshadowed by all the mephisto/x-men theories, but it seems to be the only one that (might) have actually come true.

      4 votes
      1. [2]
        Grzmot
        Link Parent
        Considering the fact that all the evil that Wanda did was handwaved away in the finale (Monica's line "They'll never know what you sacrificed" was terrible). The show very clearly framed Wanda as...

        Considering the fact that all the evil that Wanda did was handwaved away in the finale (Monica's line "They'll never know what you sacrificed" was terrible). The show very clearly framed Wanda as not fully in control but it turned out that she was.

        I would like to see her take more of a villanous turn in the next phase, but I'd be interested to see how they'll do that.

        3 votes
        1. callmedante
          Link Parent
          You're so right about that line. What did she sacrifice? She was in the midst of deep grief, and she was actively harming others by living in a reality of her own construction. I think that saying...

          You're so right about that line. What did she sacrifice? She was in the midst of deep grief, and she was actively harming others by living in a reality of her own construction. I think that saying Wanda sacrificed her illusion-family undercuts one of the powerful themes of the show: what our grief can lead us to do, and what consequences that might have on others.

          4 votes
  4. [2]
    Good_Apollo
    Link
    I was disappointed. I know Marvel is relatively safe but this was so safe. I didn’t think they’d throw all the multiverse stuff into this show, the films will do that, but I thought there would be...

    I was disappointed. I know Marvel is relatively safe but this was so safe. I didn’t think they’d throw all the multiverse stuff into this show, the films will do that, but I thought there would be hints or a stinger at the end with something a little more wild than “Hey you know how we’re constantly showing off/teasing Photon? She’s getting a film/show”. Wow shocker!

    The secondary stinger I just didn’t get? Is Scarlett Witch now a separate being to Wanda?

    Vision just gets resurrected and jets off...I don’t know. Maybe they were just running the budget thin but trying to wrap it all in essentially one episode hurt the show.

    5 votes
    1. [2]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. Good_Apollo
        Link Parent
        Ah that would make sense, Dr. Strange’s abilities didn’t even cross my mind but now it seems obvious.

        Ah that would make sense, Dr. Strange’s abilities didn’t even cross my mind but now it seems obvious.

        2 votes
  5. [2]
    Akir
    Link
    I have some thoughts that might be a bit controversial. My fiance watches those annoying youtube shows where nerds comb over every detail with a fine toothed comb so that they can project what's...

    I have some thoughts that might be a bit controversial.

    My fiance watches those annoying youtube shows where nerds comb over every detail with a fine toothed comb so that they can project what's going to happen. I absolutely abhor this; people who do this take away a lot of the suspense and the magic of simply not knowing. I bring this up because I'm really upset that this episode was apparently written specifically for this crowd. Plot threads were brought up and thrown away; references to past events were made for the sake of being references. People made shocking actions and literally disappeared for the rest of the show. It feels like a giant middle finger to anyone who wanted a nice self-contained story that could stand on it's own. It could have done it, but they decided not to.

    I'm actually a little bit angry that after the reconstructed Vision gets his memory back and then immediately yeets away with no explanation.

    I know that it's cannon to the comics, but the fact that Scarlet Witch is supposed to have stronger magic than the being literally called the Sorcerer Supreme (and, you know, the whole fact that she's apparently a mythological figure of some sort) feels kind of cheap. It could have worked with some build-up, but it comes up so suddenly that it feels like it's improvised. That being said, I'm not sure exactly how I would have improved it.

    The way the crowd reacts to having their mind control being released didn't strike me as being realistic (and it's actually a little different than others had reacted), but honestly, I'll give it a pass; they were clearly going for an affect, and it worked wonderfully; I got chills.

    Some of the more melodramatic scenes have some real grade "A" poetic writing. Specifically in scenes where Wanda is being 'real' with Vision. Her response to when he asks "What am I?" is just pure gold.

    4 votes
    1. RapidEyeMovement
      Link Parent
      This is why, I feel, I cannot watch Westworld, it is like half the story is told outside of the world, or that the threads are so thin, I need someone to take me through it step by step. Which is...

      comb over every detail with a fine toothed comb so that they can project what's going to happen. I absolutely abhor this; people who do this take away a lot of the suspense and the magic of simply not knowing.

      This is why, I feel, I cannot watch Westworld, it is like half the story is told outside of the world, or that the threads are so thin, I need someone to take me through it step by step. Which is sad because I liked the first season

      2 votes
  6. Adys
    Link
    Finally finished WandaVision today. Didn't get what was going on in the final post-credit scene. Enjoyed it throughout; stayed off the spoilers and theorycrafting. A nice, self-contained story...

    Finally finished WandaVision today.

    Didn't get what was going on in the final post-credit scene.

    Enjoyed it throughout; stayed off the spoilers and theorycrafting. A nice, self-contained story with an epic finale (although not really that epic in my view, it was easily the weakest episode of the lot).

    I think it was really high quality overall. My friend mentioned Doctor Who and I have to agree: This is probably as close as the US ever got to producing a Doctor Who-like series.

    4 votes
  7. [4]
    Nivlak
    Link
    Director Hayward was the good guy. Change my mind.

    Director Hayward was the good guy. Change my mind.

    3 votes
    1. [2]
      moocow1452
      Link Parent
      Shot at children who were nonviolently defending themselves. Lied to the FBI et al on the nature of Vision's body and pinned it's disappearance on Wanda. Lost the reanimated corpse of Vision...
      • Shot at children who were nonviolently defending themselves.
      • Lied to the FBI et al on the nature of Vision's body and pinned it's disappearance on Wanda.
      • Lost the reanimated corpse of Vision causing who knows what kind of PR cluster.
      • Was mustache twirlingly arrogant of grief and pain that his plans were putting people in, in a show about people processing their grief and pain.
      3 votes
      1. [2]
        Comment deleted by author
        Link Parent
        1. moocow1452
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          I was taking the Doylist argument that WandaVision was about processing grief, and that Hayward, by being an obstacle to Wanda is an antagonist of the piece, egro he's not the good guy. No...

          I was taking the Doylist argument that WandaVision was about processing grief, and that Hayward, by being an obstacle to Wanda is an antagonist of the piece, egro he's not the good guy. No argument here that Wanda did a horrifying thing and nothing that I listed in my list will probably stick in a court of law, but when the theme is processing grief and letting go, the suit who really wants his weapon of war working and gives it a jump from the magical grief of his widow is not helping his case.

          1 vote
    2. TheJorro
      Link Parent
      Where on the scale of good and evil does blithely choosing to execute children fall? Seems like a move even most of the other Marvel villains wouldn't cross, definitely a moral event horizon. I...

      Where on the scale of good and evil does blithely choosing to execute children fall? Seems like a move even most of the other Marvel villains wouldn't cross, definitely a moral event horizon.

      I thought it was rather out of character for him, but now it's canon.

  8. Thrabalen
    Link
    Agnes is not going to enjoy living in Westview. Everyone knows Wanda messed them up, but they also have to know Agatha could have freed them at any time. And now she can't do anything substantial...

    Agnes is not going to enjoy living in Westview. Everyone knows Wanda messed them up, but they also have to know Agatha could have freed them at any time. And now she can't do anything substantial to defend herself.

    I don't think they'd get violent, but petty and vindictive? I could see it.

    2 votes
  9. [3]
    cfabbro
    (edited )
    Link
    I finally had a chance to binge the whole show, so that's what I did over the last few days. I was a bit disappointed with the ending since I was definitely one of the ones rooting for it to be...

    I finally had a chance to binge the whole show, so that's what I did over the last few days. I was a bit disappointed with the ending since I was definitely one of the ones rooting for it to be Mephisto, and for it to have some more concrete multiverse tie-ins to finally allow the X-Men to be incorporated into the MCU. I also kinda wish they hadn't brushed off the suffering of the other residents quite so much at the very end too. Wanda is pretty much a villain now in my eyes after what she did to everyone, and so is going to have a lot of work to do in Dr. Strange 2 to redeem herself. But despite all that, I still thoroughly enjoyed the show overall, and hope Disney/Marvel put out more like it (or revive some of the Netflix properties!).

    2 votes
    1. [2]
      Good_Apollo
      Link Parent
      It’s really a damn shame the Netflix stuff won’t ever be officially folded into the MCU.

      It’s really a damn shame the Netflix stuff won’t ever be officially folded into the MCU.

      2 votes
      1. cfabbro
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        Yeah, especially Vincent D'Onofrio as Kingpin, and Jon Bernthal as Punisher, as they're by far the best depictions we could ever hope for, IMO. They both absolutely nailed the roles and I would...

        Yeah, especially Vincent D'Onofrio as Kingpin, and Jon Bernthal as Punisher, as they're by far the best depictions we could ever hope for, IMO. They both absolutely nailed the roles and I would love to see them on the big screen alongside the other MCU characters at some point.