What's a good and/or competitive video game that does not require quick aiming, a lot of actions per minute, or precise motor skills?
Playing World of Warcraft Classic WOLTK, I realize that dungeon instances are the best part of the game for me. I love the holy trinity, and how everyone has a specific role to play and contribute to the group. But the thing is, WoW is just not that hard. As a level 30 healer, I'm going through the motions and being complimented on my heals, but I could do it with very-low effort and only partially awake. And according to other players, that won't change until I get to raiding, and maybe not even then. PvP is a possibility, but I'd like to explore games that focus on the matches without all else that comes with an MMO.
The problem is, when I think of the kind of equivalent outside the MMORPG sphere, MOBAs are what first come to mind. But LoL, Dota, etc, are not easy games for an older gentleman to pick up. I don't wanna play anything that relies on quick reflexes because I simply have none. And a game like Starcraft, on the competitive level, also relies on high APM as far as I know.
So maybe this game doesn't exist, but I'd love to play something that allows me to be in a group with a defined role that requires some degree of coordination (and a social aspect) but is neither an FPS nor a stressful high-octane game for people in their 20s with a lot of brain energy to burn.
Sounds like you should check out turn based card games such as Hearthstone, MTGA, Marvel Snap etc.
I've been enjoying Legends of Runeterra. If you decide to play, message me and we can play a few games. :-)
One TBS game I've enjoyed a lot lately is Ozymandias. It's a little bit like Civilization, but matches rarely last more than an hour. Online multiplayer seems to be decently active.
Sorry for the bump, but I'm considering this game now. How much memorization would say is involved in being decent at Hearthstone? That's always a concern of mine, given the ADHD.
You can get hearthstone deck tracker if you’re concerned about memorisation (disclaimer: i worked on it, was my previous startup!)
That's really cool!
Chess? :p
Thank you for answering ;)
I actually play a lot of chess every day and have been for years. I'm a bit sick of it, to be honest, and in need of a break.
That’s obviously when you get into go. It’s the thinking man’s chess.
Ah, man! I'm scared of acquiring another obsession! :P
Make sense, but if you ever want to try go, I'd be happy to give you an intro to the game over Discord!
Lots of other good board games! Be on the lookout for board game meets in your town. Nerds will be all too happy to teach you their favourite games.
Once you’ve ruled out mechanical difficulty I think you’re just left with turn based strategy games right?
The importance of APM in StarCraft is honestly way overrated. Better players have higher APM because they’re better at multitasking. They’re better at multitasking because they’re just used to doing certain actions and keeping up with mental routines to where lots of decision making is largely automatic for them. It’s not their hand speed that’s differentiating them, the APM is just a proxy for how many decisions they’re doing because they’re mentally able to keep a lot of plates spinning at the same time on instinct instead of having to stop and think “what should I do next!?”
Hand speed eventually becomes a differentiating factor, but that’s not until you start getting higher up in diamond league, looking towards Master. That would put you in the 90th percentile of players at minimum so it’s not worth worrying about.
But you did say you care about having a role and playing cooperatively. For something like that an ARPG might work. Diablo IV comes out this year! Also raiding in Destiny does it too. The mechanical demands aren’t that serious, well within the envelope for someone without meaningful motor skill disabilities.
Thanks!
I'm not that old! :P I am capable of moving the mouse and using the keyboard competently, WoW requires that of me. What I'm ruling out are games that require an insane amount of actions per minute such as many eSports like games.
I do enjoy the Diablo franchise and intend to play it in the future, but I'll have to wait for quite a while after launch because converted to my currency Diablo 4 will cost about half my country's monthly minimum wage.
Despite the lack of a social aspect, I could definitely put in the effort to become competitive in StarCraft just out of my love for the franchise -- especially if, as you say, I don't need to become a mouse-clicking machine.
FYI Diablo 4 has a open beta coming in a few weeks if you'd like to try it out without spending any money: https://news.blizzard.com/en-us/diablo4/23916442/your-guide-to-the-diablo-iv-open-beta
In which case, I agree that most competitive titles that are not FPS are lax enough that reponse time is less of an issue than proper decisionmaking. Even in many FPS the reason you died is often due more to your bad positioning than lack of reflexes and aim.
I will say that much of WoW's difficulty was tuned for the endgame (60 in vanilla). It was there that the dungeons and raids required more advanced techniques which required more coordination and practice. Old MC/BWL raids with 40 people were quite an experience at the time.
I personally won't play mobas anymore mostly due to giant learning curve and toxic playerbase. Maybe it got better in the last 7 years, but I have my doubts.
Also since you're on pc you can take steps to minimize lag in your gaming rig. Shaving off as much hardware-related lag will help compensate for aging reflexes.
Thank you for answering ;)
I do intend to play WoW's endgame eventually, both Classic and Retail. But I wanted something more focused on the competitive aspect, it's not every day that I can dedicate to the minimum of 4 hours that Classic requires for me to feel rewarded for the time investment.
To be honest, my only real problem with WoW's dungeons is that there are no difficulty levels. If every dungeon had a few different modes (say, "normal", "hard", and "epic"), with appropriate rewards, it would be kinda awesome. And I also ask myself, why didn't anyone try to copy those to non-MMORPGs?
What would that entail? I'm already using ExitLag, which is a game-specific VPN that reduced my WoW lag by about 40ms.
Have you actually ruled out WoW (either classic or retail)? A level 30 dungeon is easy for a few reasons. One big one is that the early game content needs to be accessible to newer/younger players and beating a dungeon needs to be achievable by a group of randoms. Another reason is that most of the dungeons are from previous expansions and combat upgrades from newer expansions will often bump the capabilities, while the old dungeons don't get tuned to the new power levels.
The more expansions into WoW you go, the more the "real content" shifts towards max level and endgame. That includes raiding, but also the max level dungeons - both of which have some form of difficult mode or even scaling mode depending on the current expansion. Raiding often has an easier "LFG" difficulty, which is easier mechanics-wise and designed for a group of random people. And then raids often have a normal, heroic, and eventually mythic level difficulty with higher-tuned numbers and additional mechanics. It shouldn't be too difficult to find a group of like-minded folks who are at the same level of difficulty you want. I'll also add that you can adjust your "MMO BS" levels as well if you aren't playing at the highest tier. No need to worry about doing daily chores and long grinds if you are doing LFG or normal raiding.
If you haven't tried retail - I might suggest looking at that. Classic WoW is a bit weird since everything has been extremely optimized and the community tends to be a bit more elitist as far as I can tell. Retail has its own issues - but might be up your alley. Retail also optimizes the leveling process so you can get to max level much sooner.
If you're looking at MMOs - the other top MMOs are FFXIV, destiny 2, and runescape. I haven't played final fantasy, but IIRC it somewhat follows the holy trinity - but has a tedious early game. Destiny 2 is a first-person shooter, but isn't like CS:GO or other high intensity pvp games - it tends to have a lot more PVE content and interesting weapons/abilities. It always amuses me that runescape (specifically old school runescape) is still going strong. Some of it is nostalgia - but they've added plenty of updates and endgame content. Much of the game is "solo" in terms of gameplay like questing/skilling (but might be social in that you can hang out with others doing the same thing) - but there are plenty of minigames and even some end game raids that might fit your criteria of people working together in different roles to accomplish a goal. Outside of high-end pvp, it tends to be not too technically crazy.
Thank you for answering ;)
Absolutely will continue playing WoW Classic. A lot of current players told me that the difficulty will not really ramp up during leveling at all, but there are other aspects that I find rewarding (mainly social). I played the game in the Cataclysm era when everyone talked about how awesome WOTLK was. Now I can see for myself.
However, I would like to play a competitive game that does not require at least 4 hours every session for me to feel that I accomplish something.
I could play retail, I tried for a few hours and the improvements are tangible. But it would be difficult for me to play both versions of the game at the same time.
I didn't encounter elitism in WoW Classic, maybe because I'm at a lower level. People have been incredibly respectful and warm and I had many wonderful moments with them. Including but not limited to a roleplay guild in a low-population server, and randomly encountering people in the largest server in the game.
I'm definitely not looking for other MMOs right now, as I intend to stick to WoW and even that feels like a lot. But I intend to explore FFXIV and Runescape when I feel I've had enough.
About Destiny 2, it's not just the difficulty, but shooting stuff is not that enticing anymore for me. If an FPS has an interesting spin I might enjoy it, but I've played Destiny 2 and that's not it.
Great suggestions, thanks!
I'll just second what @skullkid2424 said and suggest that retail WoW might be the best option, if you're looking for something like WoW classic but with more challenges. I don't want to just say something stereotypical, but a lot of people say that the game doesn't really start until you reach maximum level, and that was true even in Wrath. While Wrath was miles ahead of Vanilla, the dungeon and raid design has only improved since then, and the added option for mythic keystone dungeons is probably exactly what you want, though raiding is also quite a bit different from dungeons; it's one of the things that I enjoy a lot, and it's easier than ever to raid and dungeon at relatively difficult levels (ie. there is not as much mindless grinding to be able to play, and it is more about personal ability than ever before).
I played WoW retail yesterday, took my Paladin to level 13. Coming from Classic, the difference is jarring. I do intend to keep leveling to get to the endgame, but it doesn't feel like I'm in Azeroth. Feels very videogamey. I'm not saying it's bad. It's okay, but a far cry from the connection I have to my dwarf in WOTLK. Something about the lethality, the slow leveling, and the lack of convenience makes Classic feel like an actual world I'm living in. It's hard to explain. It's a chore, but it is also meaningful.
Edit: I also did a few dungeons today. No one says anything in the chat, it was completely cold and utilitarian. Fast too. IDK, it's a bit sad. If those people were bots it wouldn't make a difference. Classic is not like that at all.
What you've come up with is one of the standard things that people bring up about retail, and I realize that it can be offputting for people who are new to the game. But again, I'll say - the current game really starts when you hit max level. Everything before that is basically a tutorial, and is there for historical significance. Depending on where you level, you are playing content that is anywhere from five to eighteen years old; for the most part, the people that are levelling and in a dungeon are spamming dungeons because they want to start playing the game on a new character, and they don't necessarily want to discuss much; they want to spend 15 minutes trying to maximize their XP and get on with it. Complaining that the world doesn't feel as real seems like it's missing the point - you haven't even gotten out of the tutorial yet, to the place where most of the players are actually doing things.
Classic feels more like an actual world, because the place that you are levelling is the entire focal area of the game. But retail is nine expansions past a lot of Azeroth, and most parts of Azeroth are just there for you to remember and to move through. You're looking at an interactive museum of places that used to matter to the game. They don't matter any more. The story isn't there, but you can play with them a bit and get a feel for what things used to be.
It sucks that that's what the levelling experience is like, but I don't know that there's actually a way to make the earlier expansions matter very much; it's just a fact of life that when you have almost 20 years of content, a lot of it isn't going to be particularly relevant.
When you get to max level, the world will be a lot more vibrant. People will be doing things, dungeons will have people who discuss things and talk. And you'll also have the option of joining a guild, which is probably the most important thing you can do to make your own experience better. Actually, this goes for levelling as well - if you join a guild that's about levelling, or a guild that is about being social, you'll be way better off than if you don't. But a lot of classic enthusiasts want to have that social experience that one gets from being in a guild be the experience that they have guildless, and that's just not how it works anymore. Additionally, almost every group I have joined in the last several years has required that you join discord for anything of any real difficulty, so socialness is often pushed into places that are more suitable for it (typing social things when you should be DPSing is pretty suboptimal).
I'll also note that I haven't played at all this expansion, so I can't actually vouch for the current state of the game being any good, though I've heard it is decent. As far as challenge level, current WoW is so much better than old WoW, because dungeon and raid design has gotten better every expansion, and the addition of Mythic+ for dungeons is probably exactly what you requested. But you'll almost certainly have to join a guild to progress at M+ as well.
You really don't need to defend Retail. It's a different game, with different priorities and incentives. I get it ;)
With the exception of some very specific groups in the 2 RP servers, the vast majority of guilds in Classic are entirely concerned with raiding and you're likely to level alone for the most part. That said, the game as a whole has a more social vibe.
It is regrettable that past content becomes lifeless, but that is just how WoW works.
I'm leveling in the Warlords of Draenor expansion, which seems to be the most recommended for new characters.
With two or three gaming sessions, I'm at level 26 now. Hopefully, it won't take too long.
If you want a cooperative game with fixed asymmetrical roles you might enjoy playing Keep Talking and Nobody Explodes. It does have limited replayability though.
I can’t for the life of me remember what it is called, but a few years back there was a spaceship simulator that needed to have a full crew to operate it and complete missions. That might be a bit closer to what you are looking for.
It’s statistically unlikely that you haven’t played Among Us, but it might be worth revisiting.
Artemis Spaceship Bridge Simulator ?
Or Star Trek: Bridge Crew if you're into VR.
Thank you for answering!
Played it years ago! I think it's especially good if you're playing with people that are physically present? It's a good reminder, I could play with my partner. It would be hilarious!
I played Among Us with my friends. I think we're the only people in the world that didn't like it :P. We did enjoy Fall Guys, basically video game's Takeshi's Castle.
You're thinking of PULSAR! Great game, absolute blast to play with friends. Kinda boring to play by yourself. I haven't played it since.... 2017 apparently according to Steam, but it was super fun and I should go revisit it now that it's fully released.
Similar but different, is Interstellar Rift, where you can collect resources, build ships using a voxel-build system, in a persistent world. You can host your own server or join someone else's. It's a really fun adventure with friends.
And if you enjoy that kind of thing (mining resources, building custom things), but without the first-person, you might enjoy Avorian
I really like Path of Exile ;)
Squad is my favorite shooter of all time (you could also check out Project Reality, the BF2 mod it comes from).
100 player battles with incredible team play. Every player is on the mic at all times. The fun of the game comes from navigating large maps, maneuvering across the battlefield and communicating with teammates. And the action is just so damn cinematic. And there's a nice vibe range in the community from silly to serious.
But unlike so many multiplayer shooters, the focus isn't so much on your technical ability. It's more about your participation. Great for when you want a high-stakes immersive experience that isn't reliant on KDR or quick trigger reflexes.
Might be a weird suggestion, but if you still want to play an FPS, I found that there's a lot of gameplay that isn't very twitchy in Rainbow 6 Siege. While you certainly can play that way, you can also focus on trap placement, reconnaissance, positioning, ambushes, etc.
I'm not opposed to first person as a whole, just that generally FPSs are high paced and require precise aim. If this game allows for a more strategic approach, than why not? Thanks ;)
Have a look at Overwatch, and it's older sibling Team Fortress 2; they seem to check a lot of your boxes. Many of the classes don't really require good aim or quick reflexes.
Batttlefield too might be worth a look. I've mostly mained engineer, focusing on keeping my team's vehicles operational, but you can also try your hand as a medic, or play around with support gadgets like drones and mortars.
Actually, on the topic of vehicles, you may also enjoy World of Tanks and its siblings. When I'm having an off day and can't aim for shit, I bring out one of my artillery cannons and join the arty party in the back.
Have you tried rocket league? It's free to play and I'll give you an overview and tips if you'd like. DM me if you're interested.