18 votes

Nintendo Switch (OLED Model)

35 comments

  1. [34]
    moocow1452
    Link
    Nintendo made a phone commerical. And also a new model of Nintendo Switch with an OLED screen and various other half step updates. No processor, battery or resolution updates yet.

    Nintendo made a phone commerical.

    And also a new model of Nintendo Switch with an OLED screen and various other half step updates. No processor, battery or resolution updates yet.

    5 votes
    1. [13]
      TheJorro
      Link Parent
      I'm glad there aren't any major hardware revisions. I hate mid-generation hardware upgrades. It's one of the biggest incentives to never buy a console because of the fear that you're always two or...

      I'm glad there aren't any major hardware revisions. I hate mid-generation hardware upgrades. It's one of the biggest incentives to never buy a console because of the fear that you're always two or three years away from your expensive purchase becoming a second-class product. It's hard enough to swallow with phones but at least that's an industry of incremental upgrades. Video game consoles are generational and moving towards what the phone market does is a bad move.

      It was nonsense with the 3DS and New 3DS where some games were made exclusively for the latter despite them being the same generation of handheld. I hated that the PS4 Pro and the Xbox One X doubled down on the feeling that buying either of those consoles early in their generations was a bad idea since games were being drip fed out. And then after they started releasing at a good pace, you were always getting the worst version of what that generation could offer as more games targeted those higher specs.

      10 votes
      1. [4]
        Octofox
        Link Parent
        Microsoft seems to want to make Xbox more of a platform rather than generations of specific hardware. The new way of things looks like games will be marked as compatible with the xbox platform...

        Microsoft seems to want to make Xbox more of a platform rather than generations of specific hardware. The new way of things looks like games will be marked as compatible with the xbox platform rather than for a specific generation. And then depending on what xbox hardware you have, you will get more/less visual quality/fps but not more or less features.

        This seems like the ideal model imo. The problem consoles have is they are very competitive on release date but one year later they are old tech compared to what PC gamers have available. So under the new model, no matter when you buy an xbox, its always the latest technology and a future xbox coming out doesn't limit your game selection.

        5 votes
        1. [3]
          nothis
          Link Parent
          Apparently I'm in the minority with this but the issue I have with that approach is that it gradually reduces the purpose of generational upgrades. Console generations used to mean that you could...

          Apparently I'm in the minority with this but the issue I have with that approach is that it gradually reduces the purpose of generational upgrades. Console generations used to mean that you could suddenly do a kind of game that was literally impossible before.

          An extreme example: Between the SNES and the Nintendo 64, the rules of game design had to be rewritten (think Super Mario World vs. Super Mario 64). I'd argue a game like Skyrim wouldn't have been possible on the PS2, either (and it struggled on the PS3).

          Since then, console generational upgrades seem to be about... playing the same games but at higher resolution? It seems to be literally the pitch for a bunch of next-gen games. If you extrapolate that into the future, you're hitting a wall pretty soon: 4K is just barely noticeable as being sharper if you have a wall-sized TV. Meanwhile, I have serious doubts human eye anatomy is capable of distinguishing 4K from 8K in just about any circumstance. Same with going from 60fps to 120fps. Certainly 240fps. If you're a CS pro player, ok, but I can guarantee you I wouldn't give a fuck.

          Meanwhile, we already see cases of Xbox Series/PS5 games running like shit on Xbox One/PS4 (think Cyberpunk, think all the murmur of Halo Infinite looking crap due to backwards compatibility, etc). So this is where the upgrades actually become interesting and already see the "cross-generation" model fail, as it always did.

          What I rather see with the latest generation of game console is that marketing notices that it's hard to show anything truly unique so what they do is pull the "premium model" sales pitch where they don't even pretend it's a truly new experience but just a gradual upgrade (which is true). "Play the same games, but in 4K!!" I'm honestly baffled that it works, but everything is sold out so it probably does. In the end, what will sell consoles are custom-made exclusives that take advantage of a deep integration with the new hardware. And you don't get that by keeping one eye on last gen.

          2 votes
          1. [2]
            PetitPrince
            Link Parent
            While I agree with the general sentiment (I myself game on a 1080p TV, and going through the Yakuza series lately it's more with PS3/early PS4 graphics), there's the VR use case where the push...

            Meanwhile, I have serious doubts human eye anatomy is capable of distinguishing 4K from 8K in just about any circumstance. Same with going from 60fps to 120fps

            While I agree with the general sentiment (I myself game on a 1080p TV, and going through the Yakuza series lately it's more with PS3/early PS4 graphics), there's the VR use case where the push toward higher resolution and framerate is justified. So I'm ambivalent toward the subject: I don't personally care about 4K120p gaming, but I can't wait for those kind of performance to be common because this will make VR development much easier (and prettier).

            3 votes
            1. nothis
              Link Parent
              Without going into my views on VR (hint: I'm not a believer), I'm mostly talking about the idea of having a continuous platform with backwards compatibility for brand new games, 3+ generations behind.

              Without going into my views on VR (hint: I'm not a believer), I'm mostly talking about the idea of having a continuous platform with backwards compatibility for brand new games, 3+ generations behind.

      2. [8]
        ali
        Link Parent
        Interesting arguments. I was actually looking forward to an upgraded switch. Exclusives to the new version would suck though. But there are some occasions in which the switch could profit of more...

        Interesting arguments. I was actually looking forward to an upgraded switch. Exclusives to the new version would suck though.
        But there are some occasions in which the switch could profit of more power. E.g. the deku forest in breath of the wild

        2 votes
        1. [7]
          TheJorro
          Link Parent
          For sure, being able to play BotW at a smooth 1080p/60fps all the way through would be magical. But at the same time, I think the notion that a console can benefit from better hardware is one of...

          For sure, being able to play BotW at a smooth 1080p/60fps all the way through would be magical. But at the same time, I think the notion that a console can benefit from better hardware is one of the most universal traits of all consoles in general. I don't think a single generation has gone by where one console didn't have most people wishing it had better hardware to allow some of its games to perform or look better.

          2 votes
          1. [6]
            Moonchild
            Link Parent
            Can be done, with an emulator.

            being able to play BotW at a smooth 1080p/60fps all the way through would be magical

            Can be done, with an emulator.

            5 votes
            1. [5]
              TheJorro
              Link Parent
              I've looked into it but it's not quite as simple as it sounds to get it running with full fidelity. One thing I was annoyed to discover is that there's a shader cache that has to be generated...

              I've looked into it but it's not quite as simple as it sounds to get it running with full fidelity. One thing I was annoyed to discover is that there's a shader cache that has to be generated (based on a bunch of factors, including which version of the game and which version of the emulator you have) to avoid massive performance drops every few seconds when playing. And it can only be done while playing, so suffering through those huge performance walls. Even downloading a preloaded one doesn't guarantee it. There's a lot of shortcuts to avoid it but at that point, I'd rather deal with the inconsistent but solid Switch performance.

              1 vote
              1. [2]
                tesseractcat
                Link Parent
                This isn't really a problem now as Cemu has asynchronous shader compilation with Vulkan.

                This isn't really a problem now as Cemu has asynchronous shader compilation with Vulkan.

                5 votes
                1. TheJorro
                  Link Parent
                  Oh really? Been a while since I last looked at Cemu, I'll check it out again.

                  Oh really? Been a while since I last looked at Cemu, I'll check it out again.

                  3 votes
              2. [2]
                Moonchild
                Link Parent
                FWIW that hasn't been my experience. Yes, you need to compile shaders; so you get some stuttering in the first few minutes of gameplay and after that you're largely left alone. My experience has...

                there's a shader cache that has to be generated to avoid massive performance drops every few seconds

                FWIW that hasn't been my experience. Yes, you need to compile shaders; so you get some stuttering in the first few minutes of gameplay and after that you're largely left alone. My experience has been overall very smooth.

                3 votes
                1. TheJorro
                  Link Parent
                  Yes, after tesseractcat's comment above, I realized it might have been longer than I realized since I last attempted to get it working in Cemu and this may be a solved problem now.

                  Yes, after tesseractcat's comment above, I realized it might have been longer than I realized since I last attempted to get it working in Cemu and this may be a solved problem now.

                  2 votes
    2. [10]
      cafe
      Link Parent
      The only thing I want from Nintendo is fixed joycons. I skipped Switch solely because of the joycon drift.

      The only thing I want from Nintendo is fixed joycons. I skipped Switch solely because of the joycon drift.

      5 votes
      1. [4]
        nothis
        Link Parent
        It's the most baffling quality issue with the Switch. It seems easily fixable (more durable contacts underneath the sticks) but apparently that whole supply chain is set in stone and they rather...

        It's the most baffling quality issue with the Switch. It seems easily fixable (more durable contacts underneath the sticks) but apparently that whole supply chain is set in stone and they rather fight off lawsuits and repair tons of joycons for free than to fix the damn problem.

        Honestly, though: Don't hold out on the Switch because of joycon drift. It's maybe 0.1% of your experience and the rest, especially now, is a library of exclusives (and indies that work perfectly on a handheld) that must slowly enter the ranks of the best console libraries ever. It's been a dry 2 years, admittedly (especially since I'm not that into Animal Crossing) but the current library can probably keep you busy up until BotW2 and Metroid Prime 4, which should seal the deal for just about anyone.

        5 votes
        1. [3]
          cafe
          Link Parent
          I'll see if I can get it on black friday or after christmas haha. It just seems icky that I need to pay 75-80 euros for a new pair of joycons since the repairment program seems to be only in the US.

          I'll see if I can get it on black friday or after christmas haha. It just seems icky that I need to pay 75-80 euros for a new pair of joycons since the repairment program seems to be only in the US.

          1 vote
          1. bilbodwyer
            Link Parent
            FWIW I'm in the UK and my partner got her (second hand) joycons replaced for free by Nintendo when they started drifting. UK repair site

            FWIW I'm in the UK and my partner got her (second hand) joycons replaced for free by Nintendo when they started drifting. UK repair site

            1 vote
          2. nothis
            Link Parent
            Yea, but in the EU you're guaranteed a free repair for 2 years, so that could cover your first repair. I also heard them doing it for free, after. But there's no official policy.

            Yea, but in the EU you're guaranteed a free repair for 2 years, so that could cover your first repair. I also heard them doing it for free, after. But there's no official policy.

            1 vote
      2. [3]
        ali
        Link Parent
        It there was no joycon drift, the switch would be the perfect console in my eyes. There’s some amazing games. The power is enough for me. The portability and the ability to pick it up and put it...

        It there was no joycon drift, the switch would be the perfect console in my eyes.

        There’s some amazing games. The power is enough for me. The portability and the ability to pick it up and put it down are amazing

        3 votes
        1. [2]
          moocow1452
          Link Parent
          May want to look into alternative joy cons, like the Hori Split Pad. Since it's based on a more conventional controller, there is less of a drifting issue. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08FJ7XY3B

          May want to look into alternative joy cons, like the Hori Split Pad. Since it's based on a more conventional controller, there is less of a drifting issue.

          https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08FJ7XY3B

          1 vote
          1. Icarus
            Link Parent
            I can vouch for these as my go-to accessory for the switch. The regular joy-cons cause a tingling sensation in my hands due to their small size. The only bad aspect of these is they seem to drain...

            I can vouch for these as my go-to accessory for the switch. The regular joy-cons cause a tingling sensation in my hands due to their small size. The only bad aspect of these is they seem to drain my battery life faster than normal joy-cons. It could just be my launch day Switch is getting old though...

            1 vote
      3. [2]
        petrichor
        Link Parent
        If that's your reason for skipping the Switch, do note that replacing the sticks is a twenty-dollar twenty-minute process.

        If that's your reason for skipping the Switch, do note that replacing the sticks is a twenty-dollar twenty-minute process.

        2 votes
        1. Icarus
          Link Parent
          Eh, that is provided you have the right tools and the confidence/capability to take apart the joy-cons. I tried replacing my left one last year and ended up stripping a screw holding the casing...

          Eh, that is provided you have the right tools and the confidence/capability to take apart the joy-cons.

          I tried replacing my left one last year and ended up stripping a screw holding the casing together. The screws are pretty delicate and made of a softer metal. I ended up having to drill that screw out and replacing the entire shell due to the damage. All-in, I was looking at $20+ of materials for a simple fix of a problem that should not have been placed on me to either fix/send in for a product Nintendo is selling for $35. Nintendo lost a lot of goodwill from me on that one, and I was a Wii U fanboy years ago!

          10 votes
    3. [10]
      Akir
      Link Parent
      Honestly, I think Nintendo is in a bit of a tough space right now in regards to topping the Switch as it already is. IIRC nVidia has given up on their original vision for the Tegra series (at...

      Honestly, I think Nintendo is in a bit of a tough space right now in regards to topping the Switch as it already is. IIRC nVidia has given up on their original vision for the Tegra series (at least in regards to being used for graphics, since there are new ones with compute optimized “GPU” in them), so it is going to be hard to find a company who can offer a “next gen” equivalent.

      2 votes
      1. [2]
        JXM
        Link Parent
        I think Nintendo is big enough to get Nvidia to make a custom chip just for them - especially since AMD already has the PS4/5 and the Xbox One/X/S locked down.

        I think Nintendo is big enough to get Nvidia to make a custom chip just for them - especially since AMD already has the PS4/5 and the Xbox One/X/S locked down.

        3 votes
        1. Octofox
          Link Parent
          It's pretty much impossible. But it would be interesting to see a Nintendo console with the Apple M1 on it.

          It's pretty much impossible. But it would be interesting to see a Nintendo console with the Apple M1 on it.

          1 vote
      2. [5]
        DeFaced
        Link Parent
        Well they have three other options that are probably just as good. Intel (maybe not quite as good), AMD (which is the ideal vendor), or pull an apple and design their own ARM SoC like the m1....

        Well they have three other options that are probably just as good. Intel (maybe not quite as good), AMD (which is the ideal vendor), or pull an apple and design their own ARM SoC like the m1. Since the m1 style chip would cost way more than they likely would want to invest in, AMD would be the best choice especially considering they’re already in the console space. Nvidia isn’t the only vendor, they’re just the ideal vendor with a SoC design for high performance graphics.

        1. [4]
          Akir
          Link Parent
          The only problem is if they want it to continue to be portable, and most signs are pointing to 'yes' on that one. AMD has some great notebook APUs with great performance in their market segment,...

          The only problem is if they want it to continue to be portable, and most signs are pointing to 'yes' on that one. AMD has some great notebook APUs with great performance in their market segment, but they draw far too much energy. For reference, the TDP on the Tegra X1 maxes out at 15W, whereas AMD's current mobile APUs can draw up to 54W, with some of them drawing a minimum of 35W. It might happen, but it would also mean a bulkier machine because it needs more battery power.

          For a while I was actually entertaining the idea that Nintendo would approach Apple to use their M1 chip, since it would appear that their graphics are pretty much the best in the mobile space (though to be completely honest, I have no idea if that's reality or just my impression; mobile SoC designs are famously opaque), but I have a really hard time believing that Apple would agree to whatever terms Nintendo would ask for.

          I'm sure Nintendo will come up with something for their next generation console, but I'm thinking it probably won't exactly be "the switch but better".

          4 votes
          1. [3]
            DeFaced
            Link Parent
            Yep, amd just requires more power, but they’re getting better and making a larger switch is clearly Nintendo’s plan, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they did go amd in the future. As for the m1, I...

            Yep, amd just requires more power, but they’re getting better and making a larger switch is clearly Nintendo’s plan, so I wouldn’t be surprised if they did go amd in the future. As for the m1, I have an m1 Mac mini base model and holy cow is that thing powerful. There’s no doubt it could play games at Nintendo’s specifications. For comparison I tried to configure a system76 nuc, I think they call them meerkats or something, but it’s about $100 more expensive than a mini for the same specs and it was still configured with terrible intel integrated graphics. The Mac mini is just insane power for the price so I could see Nintendo using a similar chip.

            3 votes
            1. [2]
              moocow1452
              Link Parent
              Nintendo hardware is somewhat notorious for being bargain bin technology with a stupendous amount of effort to make it price effective and power efficient, and they're not really interested in...

              Nintendo hardware is somewhat notorious for being bargain bin technology with a stupendous amount of effort to make it price effective and power efficient, and they're not really interested in playing the spec game. Why would they seek out Apple to make hardware for them without the Apple ecosystem, when Nvidia does what they want well enough for a good price?

              4 votes
              1. DeFaced
                Link Parent
                Because nvidia hasn’t updated the Tegra platform in years and there’s no real sign they’re going too in the near future. AMD would be the most cost effective but not the best for power...

                Because nvidia hasn’t updated the Tegra platform in years and there’s no real sign they’re going too in the near future. AMD would be the most cost effective but not the best for power requirements, arm would be the next best thing. Either way it’s clear nvidia doesn’t really care about updating tegra considering Nintendo is essentially making a bigger switch that only has QoL improvements and not a single internal hardware improvement.

                3 votes
      3. [3]
        Comment deleted by author
        Link Parent
        1. [2]
          Akir
          Link Parent
          Like every technology claim, I'll believe it when I see it; right now I have no reason to believe that will be true. Don't forget that performance isn't the only goal; if it's not energy...

          Like every technology claim, I'll believe it when I see it; right now I have no reason to believe that will be true. Don't forget that performance isn't the only goal; if it's not energy efficient, the mobile experience will not be that great. The fact that they claim that it will support ray tracing leads me to believe that it won't be, since pretty much every graphics card that meaningfully supports that feature tends to sip a lot of power.

          Besides that, has Samsung ever sold their SoCs to third party vendors?

          1. hungariantoast
            (edited )
            Link Parent
            Sorry, my original comment was a bit sloppy, so I have re-written it here: Samsung is developing a mobile-focused Exynos SoC with Radeon graphics, that has been shown to outperform Apple's A14. As...

            Sorry, my original comment was a bit sloppy, so I have re-written it here:

            Samsung is developing a mobile-focused Exynos SoC with Radeon graphics, that has been shown to outperform Apple's A14.

            As for energy efficiency and ray-tracing, it could very easily turn out that ray-tracing on the Switch Pro is disabled when the device is not docked or is running on battery.

            Also, FidelityFX would almost certainly be utilized to provide better performance as well.

            Yes, Samsung has collaborated with third-parties on custom SoCs, most notably Microsoft with their Surface devices, but they are also collaborating on chips with Google. It's not a stretch at all to imagine they could supply chips to Nintendo, or even collaborate with Nintendo on yet another custom SoC.

            Honestly, if Nintendo does not go with Samsung's chip for the Switch Pro, then the only other option I can think of would be AMD's supposed upcoming ARM processor, but that is probably years away, if it's even real, and it's not like they can just toss an Opteron in there.