33 votes

Reddit testing a new "tip" feature. Giving real money to other users.

44 comments

  1. [15]
    Deimos (edited ) Link
    Here are the terms (from this page): So (at least for now), reddit is taking 20% of the tips. That's a lot more than Patreon's 5%, but lower than Facebook's "Fan Subscriptions" thing they're...

    Here are the terms (from this page):

    PLEASE REVIEW THE TERMS YOU HAVE AGREED TO IN REDDIT’S USER AGREEMENT IN ADDITION TO THOSE BELOW. FOR APPROVED CREATORS ONLY, REDDIT IS ALLOWING THESE CREATORS THE ABILITY TO RECEIVE MONEY FROM THIRD-PARTIES. TO THE EXTENT THIS CONFLICTS WITH REDDIT’S USER AGREEMENT AND POLICIES, THESE TERMS SUPERSEDE THOSE. CONFLICTS REGARDING ANY OTHER PROVISIONS IN REDDIT’S USER AGREEMENT AND POLICIES SUPERSEDE THE FOLLOWING:

    If you “tip” an approved creator, you agree to be charged on behalf of the creator for the content they have created on Reddit. You will be charged immediately upon tipping. Tips are non-refundable.

    The creator’s content may be removed from Reddit’s site at anytime and tipping them does not guarantee the availability of any content. This may include situations outside of Reddit’s, the creator’s, or your control. For example, if the creator posts content that is subject to a valid takedown request, or if the creator decides to remove their content from Reddit. Therefore, you understand that the tips you provide do not constitute a right or a claim that certain content is or will be available on Reddit.

    In connection with the tips a creator receives, the creator appoints Reddit as their limited agent for the sole purpose of receiving, holding, and settling payments to the creator. As the creator’s agent, Reddit’s receipt of funds from a user on the creator’s behalf is the same as receipt of funds by the creator directly, and the creator will only have recourse against Reddit, and not against any user, for Reddit’s failure to settle funds to the creator. Reddit will try to provide timely access to the majority of the creators’ funds, but may delay a portion of the funds. Reddit may also block or hold payments for violations of the terms for compliance reasons, including collecting tax reporting information. When payments are delayed or blocked Reddit, will attempt to communicate the reasons to the affected creator promptly. In order to protect creators, Reddit may block fraudulent payments, or payments believed to be fraudulent.

    Reddit’s fee to process transactions on the creator’s behalf is 20% of processed tips. Additional fees, such as chargebacks, may be assessed against payments to the creator. Remember, this is a beta product and Reddit is working to determine the best solution.

    At all times, a creator’s content must abide by Reddit’s User Terms and Content Policy. Any violation may result in that content being removed and the creator being suspended or banned.

    So (at least for now), reddit is taking 20% of the tips. That's a lot more than Patreon's 5%, but lower than Facebook's "Fan Subscriptions" thing they're working on. I think this is a pretty strange thing to start working on, because it conflicts directly with gold ("premium") and gives them a much smaller portion of the revenue. When (if) they integrate this into their mobile apps, if they do it as an in-app purchase, Apple/Google will also take 30% of the tip, so at current rates the recipient would only end up with half.

    32 votes
    1. [2]
      creesch Link Parent
      It's not that strange, they are probably betting on tipping becoming more popular as it actually gives something to the person they are tipping in contrast to gold. So if that works out the bigger...

      It's not that strange, they are probably betting on tipping becoming more popular as it actually gives something to the person they are tipping in contrast to gold. So if that works out the bigger percentage of people tipping will balance that out. Also they don't need to offer or support any additional gold features so that might also be an incentive as moving away from gold might allow them to no longer work an a seperate "premium" feature base.

      16 votes
      1. Deimos (edited ) Link Parent
        True, but it still directly conflicts with premium. The reason that they chose shittymorph in particular as a test case is probably because practically every one of his posts consistently gets...

        True, but it still directly conflicts with premium. The reason that they chose shittymorph in particular as a test case is probably because practically every one of his posts consistently gets multiple silver/gold/platinum, so they believe those awards will be converted to tips. I just think that's strange when they've only recently done a major rework of the gold/premium system (adding the whole "Coins" system and the tiers of silver/gold/platinum), and they also keep talking about future plans with it. Alexis is going on podcasts talking about how they think "selling digital goods" on reddit could be "even more valuable than advertising", and they've dropped various hints that the Coins system is how they're intending to do that.

        As I said elsewhere though, I think the tipping will probably have to remain as something that they only enable for pre-approved creators, because there's way too much stuff on reddit that violates Stripe's terms.

        13 votes
    2. nacho Link Parent
      My thoughts were exactly the same regarding revenue. The judgement reddit seems to be making is that the use-case for tipping is different in many cases, and people are using other platforms for...

      My thoughts were exactly the same regarding revenue.

      The judgement reddit seems to be making is that the use-case for tipping is different in many cases, and people are using other platforms for that instead of reddit as it is.

      Substantial revenue from "premium" snapchat/discord server access or as an alternative to tipping streamers or patreons seem to be what they're aiming to get a cut from.


      In any case, from stopping with AMA-support and essentially giving OC the cold shoulder for some time, now there's first user profile-subreddits the OC tag and this.

      I'm not sure whether I interpret this as an OC-monetization focus, or just "let's try everything so in total we'll hopefully profit from our users"

      This was unexpected to say the least though.


      Edit: twitch.tv stream subscriptions have the platform taking 50% for those with the smallest following, then a gradually reducing amount. Users seem to be willing to support their favorites with $2.50 out of $4.99, so why not try that price point on reddit too (for in app purchases)?

      6 votes
    3. [8]
      Gaywallet Link Parent
      Eh I think there are different reasons for each. They know that people are selling sex and other services through their website and those services aren't necessarily attracting a lot of reddit...

      it conflicts directly with gold ("premium") and gives them a much smaller portion of the revenue.

      Eh I think there are different reasons for each. They know that people are selling sex and other services through their website and those services aren't necessarily attracting a lot of reddit gold.

      Why not also take a small dip into these services by making it easy for the transactions to happen on their website instead of amazon giftcards, paypal, venmo, etc?

      4 votes
      1. [7]
        Deimos Link Parent
        Stripe isn't allowed to be used as a payment processor for many types of services, including all pornography and similar adult services. Reddit would almost certainly have to prevent this from...

        Stripe isn't allowed to be used as a payment processor for many types of services, including all pornography and similar adult services. Reddit would almost certainly have to prevent this from being used for all NSFW subreddits/users, or they'll risk Stripe shutting down their payment-processing (which has happened with various other sites).

        11 votes
        1. [4]
          masochist Link Parent
          This is really curious. Scrolling down to the aforementioned pornography section, the specific wording includes this: So then the question is: how does Stripe interpret the definition of "site" in...

          This is really curious. Scrolling down to the aforementioned pornography section, the specific wording includes this:

          sites offering any sexually-related services such as prostitution, escorts, pay-per view, adult live chat features

          So then the question is: how does Stripe interpret the definition of "site" in their terms? Are specific subreddits considered different sites? reddit can argue all they want that r/gonewild is different from r/shittymorphs, but Stripe's the one operating the service and they have the right to interpret their terms however they want. And what happens if r/shittymorphs sees some NSFW content? What happens if there was ever any NSFW content posted in the past which can now be monetized via this system? This could potentially be a very interesting situation depending upon how Stripe chooses to interpret their terms.

          Of course, this may all have been decided already behind closed doors with reddit and Stripe execs where reddit gets an exemption, but we have no way of knowing that.

          6 votes
          1. [2]
            StellarTabi Link Parent
            The way I understood, you can gild anyone but you can only tip approved content creators. Also, since reddit is a large company, they can probably negotiate a different agreement.

            The way I understood, you can gild anyone but you can only tip approved content creators.

            Also, since reddit is a large company, they can probably negotiate a different agreement.

            3 votes
            1. masochist Link Parent
              Maybe they have negotiated that different agreement. As I said in my comment, we'll never know because any agreement happened behind closed doors.

              Maybe they have negotiated that different agreement. As I said in my comment, we'll never know because any agreement happened behind closed doors.

          2. frickindeal Link Parent
            Seems pretty clear that reddit offers those things, as a site. reddit chose who to use as their payment processor. They may have made a grave error in choice. Obviously there are processors who do...

            sites offering

            Seems pretty clear that reddit offers those things, as a site. reddit chose who to use as their payment processor. They may have made a grave error in choice. Obviously there are processors who do the same work for cam sites and regular porn sites.

            2 votes
        2. [2]
          Gaywallet Link Parent
          I mean reddit is far too large for that to stop it being used for NSFW services in non-NSFW subs that might spring up precisely for this reason, and it also doesn't invalidate other services being...

          I mean reddit is far too large for that to stop it being used for NSFW services in non-NSFW subs that might spring up precisely for this reason, and it also doesn't invalidate other services being offered on the site for pay.

          But you're right, they probably will try to crack down enough that Stripe isn't going to blacklist them.

          3 votes
          1. Deimos Link Parent
            I think it's likely that they'll keep this as a pre-approval-only system, so individual users have to be given the ability to receive tips. Even outside adult content, there are far too many other...

            I think it's likely that they'll keep this as a pre-approval-only system, so individual users have to be given the ability to receive tips. Even outside adult content, there are far too many other things that have very active reddit communities that Stripe prohibits use for (especially cryptocurrency), so probably the only way to control it would be to pre-approve everyone.

            8 votes
    4. EditingAndLayout Link Parent
      If they make this site-wide, I hope they offer a way to turn it off. I don't want people making posts on HighQualityGifs for money. It's never been about money for me, and I don't want that...

      If they make this site-wide, I hope they offer a way to turn it off. I don't want people making posts on HighQualityGifs for money. It's never been about money for me, and I don't want that getting involved.

      4 votes
    5. musa_totter Link Parent
      It further incentivizes people to keep making posts that Reddit's audience likes. Getting gold is somewhat desirable, but actual money is useful to you. I'm convinced that YouTube and Twitch have...

      It further incentivizes people to keep making posts that Reddit's audience likes. Getting gold is somewhat desirable, but actual money is useful to you. I'm convinced that YouTube and Twitch have much more content today than they would have if they had never added monetization for content creators. Similarly, I wonder if Reddit tipping could result in people (or more people than already) posting to Reddit for a living.

      1 vote
    6. hamstergeddon Link Parent
      I'm kind of surprised they didn't incorporate it into the silver/gold model to avoid confusion

      I'm kind of surprised they didn't incorporate it into the silver/gold model to avoid confusion

  2. [4]
    tiz Link
    https://i.redd.it/ropokl6rwzi21.gif of it in action. Thoughts?

    https://i.redd.it/ropokl6rwzi21.gif of it in action. Thoughts?

    13 votes
    1. masochist Link Parent
      Obnoxious eyesore, like everything else about new reddit. Especially that animation of the coin spinning, so gratuitous. With every new thing reddit does, it is becoming more and more clear that...

      Obnoxious eyesore, like everything else about new reddit. Especially that animation of the coin spinning, so gratuitous. With every new thing reddit does, it is becoming more and more clear that they don't want users like me.

      7 votes
    2. [2]
      guts Link Parent
      Is that a new reddit design?, looks better than the old and new reddit.

      Is that a new reddit design?, looks better than the old and new reddit.

      1 vote
      1. apoctr Link Parent
        That is new reddit.

        That is new reddit.

        9 votes
  3. [3]
    ainar-g Link
    I can already see posts ending with “tip me $5 to see more” in /r/gonewild. Nothing wrong with it, of course, but it's an obvious use case.

    I can already see posts ending with “tip me $5 to see more” in /r/gonewild. Nothing wrong with it, of course, but it's an obvious use case.

    13 votes
    1. [2]
      hamstergeddon Link Parent
      They're already doing it behind the scenes, from what I've heard, so yeah definitely going to end up happening.

      They're already doing it behind the scenes, from what I've heard, so yeah definitely going to end up happening.

      10 votes
      1. apoctr Link Parent
        Which might make sense for why they're implementing as Deimos put it an otherwise conflicting and less profitable system -- to facilitate transactions that would previously occur off-site, and...

        Which might make sense for why they're implementing as Deimos put it an otherwise conflicting and less profitable system -- to facilitate transactions that would previously occur off-site, and earn a portion of the revenue that would otherwise be lost.

        7 votes
  4. jackson (edited ) Link
    Interesting! Though I probably won't use it myself (old design ftw), I think this could be a powerful feature that a lot of people seem to have been pushing in somewhat hacky ways (read:...

    Interesting! Though I probably won't use it myself (old design ftw), I think this could be a powerful feature that a lot of people seem to have been pushing in somewhat hacky ways (read: crypotips).

    I'm not sure it'll catch on, but if someone makes a truly meaningful post, it's kinda cool to know this is an option to support (also to support independent creators!)

    I'm betting the fees on this will probably be between 5-8%, with stripe taking 2.9% + $0.30 and reddit taking the rest (while maybe absorbing the $0.30 to make it simpler for end users)


    Edit:

    After letting this stew for a while, it actually makes a lot more sense. With their partnership with Patreon for special flairs and the like, it's clear that reddit's trying to make a platform more focused on creators and original content. This will certainly conflict with the idea of "no pay-to-enter subreddits," but it should be easy to investigate.

    It's probably going to take a long time to roll out to all users, and may actually depend on manual verification for the foreseeable future, so I think it'll be easy to control the spread of. The next step after individual users will likely be "trusted testers" on their personal subreddits only, then eventually on subreddits that opt in on an admin comment.

    Interesting how high the fees are, though. here's the info on all that

    10 votes
  5. [5]
    tak Link
    This needs a cool-off period. That is, it should be possible to withdraw a tip without penalties within first X hours. This is to combat not immediately obvious reposts and valuable, but stolen...

    This needs a cool-off period.

    That is, it should be possible to withdraw a tip without penalties within first X hours. This is to combat not immediately obvious reposts and valuable, but stolen comments.

    9 votes
    1. [4]
      Algernon_Asimov Link Parent
      For the uninformed among us (me!), what's a stolen comment?

      but stolen comments.

      For the uninformed among us (me!), what's a stolen comment?

      1. [3]
        Amarok Link Parent
        There are rather a lot of bots, and some people, that mine old reddit content and repost it as new content. They do this for submissions and for comments as well, often together on the same post....

        There are rather a lot of bots, and some people, that mine old reddit content and repost it as new content. They do this for submissions and for comments as well, often together on the same post. They rake in millions of karma for this in no time at all.

        This system has no safeguards to prevent people from stealing and reposting content, then getting paid as a reward for doing it. We've had this conversation before about linkjacking - it's similar behavior, the intent being to steal attention/revenue from the real creators of the content. Just more evidence reddicorp has no fucking idea what reddit is or what they are doing with it.

        5 votes
        1. Sahasrahla Link Parent
          This brings up an interesting point. If someone posts your OC to Reddit and gets paid for it could you argue that Reddit owes you money, especially if Reddit is hosting the content directly...

          it's similar behavior, the intent being to steal attention/revenue from the real creators of the content

          This brings up an interesting point. If someone posts your OC to Reddit and gets paid for it could you argue that Reddit owes you money, especially if Reddit is hosting the content directly through an i.redd.it link?

          5 votes
        2. Algernon_Asimov Link Parent
          I knew about this behaviour, but I didn't know the resulting comments were referred to as "stolen". Thanks.

          There are rather a lot of bots, and some people, that mine old reddit content and repost it as new content. They do this for submissions and for comments as well,

          I knew about this behaviour, but I didn't know the resulting comments were referred to as "stolen". Thanks.

          1 vote
  6. [3]
    Diet_Coke Link
    They finally found a way to monetize GW and get a cut of all the online sexwork they facilitate.

    They finally found a way to monetize GW and get a cut of all the online sexwork they facilitate.

    8 votes
    1. [2]
      NaraVara Link Parent
      This is definitely a clue that Reddit's legal team is non-existent. This is a SESTA/FOSTA enforcement claim waiting to happen.

      This is definitely a clue that Reddit's legal team is non-existent. This is a SESTA/FOSTA enforcement claim waiting to happen.

      3 votes
      1. Deimos Link Parent
        It looks like they're simultaneously fighting FOSTA: Wherein The Copia Institute, Engine, And Reddit Tell The DC Circuit That FOSTA Is Unconstitutional (more info here as well: 4 Amicus Briefs...

        It looks like they're simultaneously fighting FOSTA: Wherein The Copia Institute, Engine, And Reddit Tell The DC Circuit That FOSTA Is Unconstitutional (more info here as well: 4 Amicus Briefs Filed in Support of Woodhull FOSTA Case)

        As I posted elsewhere in this thread though, I think they'll probably have to keep this feature as one that requires pre-approval for users, because there are way too many subreddits focused on products/services that Stripe explicitly disallows (pornography/adult included).

        3 votes
  7. [4]
    Sahasrahla Link
    Interestingly I can't view the tip amount or the "Tip" button on the old Reddit UI, they only appear on the redesign. i.e. https://i.imgur.com/YAguzF0.png

    Interestingly I can't view the tip amount or the "Tip" button on the old Reddit UI, they only appear on the redesign. i.e. https://i.imgur.com/YAguzF0.png

    4 votes
    1. [3]
      tiz Link Parent
      Yes, that was outlined in the original post. This feature will probably only work on the redesign in the future if it becomes an actual feature.

      Yes, that was outlined in the original post. This feature will probably only work on the redesign in the future if it becomes an actual feature.

      4 votes
      1. [2]
        Sahasrahla Link Parent
        Ah, that didn't really register. I'm used to just auto-replacing "Reddit" for "redesign" in my mind when I read over anything Reddit-official. I wonder if that means the tip system will make it to...

        Ah, that didn't really register. I'm used to just auto-replacing "Reddit" for "redesign" in my mind when I read over anything Reddit-official. I wonder if that means the tip system will make it to the old version eventually or if this is a sign the old version will be phased out.

        1. Algernon_Asimov Link Parent
          Neither. The Reddit admins have repeatedly said they will not decommission the old version of Reddit - and, given that m.reddit.com and www.reddit.com/.compact both still work, years after they...

          I wonder if that means the tip system will make it to the old version eventually or if this is a sign the old version will be phased out.

          Neither.

          The Reddit admins have repeatedly said they will not decommission the old version of Reddit - and, given that m.reddit.com and www.reddit.com/.compact both still work, years after they were abandoned, I believe them. old.reddit.com will still work years from new.

          However, they're also deliberately not adding new features to the old version of Reddit. It is falling further and behind the feature set of the redesign - and that's one way they're pulling people toward the new version and off the old version.

          4 votes
  8. ThatFanficGuy Link
    I'm thinking of independent creators whose work could be supported on this massive platform where they could easily get a lot of exposure. Someone can turn their crappy poetry gig into a supported...

    I'm thinking of independent creators whose work could be supported on this massive platform where they could easily get a lot of exposure. Someone can turn their crappy poetry gig into a supported kind-of-a-job. Comic artists. Writers. Livestreamers, lets-players. The tips are basically one-time donations, not unlike un-monthly Patreon.

    Which makes me wonder about the timing. Patreon's been hit hard after their account-closing debacle. Capitalizing on that – while also being a massive online platform with an established audience – does sound like a good idea for the admins. If they can also make more users switch to the new design – citing, perhaps, the "inherent inability of the old design backbone to support something like this" (which would be bullshit) – so much is the better.

    2 votes
  9. [3]
    tiz Link
    They are now testing it on the Fortnitebr sub: https://www.reddit.com/r/FortNiteBR/comments/b0am0t/tipping_creators_in_rfortnitebr/
    2 votes
    1. [2]
      Deimos Link Parent
      This is even stranger than the original test.

      The creator gets 60% of the tip, the community gets ~20%, and Reddit ~20%. Payment processing fees (~3%) are split between Reddit’s portion and the community’s portion.

      The community's portion goes to a common pool of funds that will be initially managed by the top mod u/FinallyRage. He has the support and trust of the other moderators to spend this fund on the community (eg: organizing contests and running bots). We expect to change how the community's portion is distributed and managed in the coming months. Our long term vision is to create a mechanism for all community members to participate in managing the community pool.

      This is even stranger than the original test.

      3 votes
      1. tiz Link Parent
        Yeah, this is really odd. What is the community? Who does what with the community portion? Is it up to the mods? Will the mods have to make a "community poll"? Will admins forever keep updating...

        Yeah, this is really odd. What is the community? Who does what with the community portion? Is it up to the mods? Will the mods have to make a "community poll"? Will admins forever keep updating the approved tipped users? Will they push that responsibility onto the mods at some point? ...so many questions.

        Also, another admins has said they are working to get tips to work on old reddit. So they are probably going to push forward with this.

        3 votes
  10. [5]
    Nivlak Link
    I’m sure this will keep the shitposting to a minimum.

    I’m sure this will keep the shitposting to a minimum.

    4 votes
    1. apoctr (edited ) Link Parent
      And likely also incentivise further reposting previously popular content, if rolled out to a larger audience than just /r/shittymorph.

      And likely also incentivise further reposting previously popular content, if rolled out to a larger audience than just /r/shittymorph.

      7 votes
    2. [3]
      teaearlgraycold Link Parent
      I guess it depends how well monitored approved creators are.

      If you “tip” an approved creator, you agree to be charged on behalf of the creator for the content they have created on Reddit.

      I guess it depends how well monitored approved creators are.

      1. MimicSquid Link Parent
        The more "creators", the more opportunities for Reddit to get their cut. Their incentives go entirely towards opening the floodgates.

        The more "creators", the more opportunities for Reddit to get their cut. Their incentives go entirely towards opening the floodgates.

        4 votes
      2. tiredlemma Link Parent
        I'm guessing they're being monitored like it's nineteen ninety eight when the undertaker threw mankind off hеll in a cell, and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.

        I'm guessing they're being monitored like it's nineteen ninety eight when the undertaker threw mankind off hеll in a cell, and plummeted sixteen feet through an announcer's table.