37 votes

Survey documents that American viewers are increasingly using subtitles - Gen Z uses them most frequently

41 comments

  1. [6]
    zipf_slaw
    Link
    I am among these masses that are leaning on CC more and more even though my hearing is fine (except some decrease at the 3kHz band). It allows me to keep the volume lower for others in the house,...

    I am among these masses that are leaning on CC more and more even though my hearing is fine (except some decrease at the 3kHz band).

    It allows me to keep the volume lower for others in the house, hear quieter scenes without having to constantly adjust volume up and down between action and drama scenes, and to be able to "see" what's being said when I am cooking in the kitchen while the TV is on.

    That being said, I can't stand using CC while watching comedies, it ruins the jokes where timing is critical to a good landing.

    57 votes
    1. [4]
      foxensly
      Link Parent
      Having CC on ruins more than just comedies. A lot of times, I'll be re-watching a drama that I really wanted to show a friend. CC can affect some of those most dramatic moments as well! Also, this...

      Having CC on ruins more than just comedies. A lot of times, I'll be re-watching a drama that I really wanted to show a friend. CC can affect some of those most dramatic moments as well!

      Also, this seems silly (and not that I watch a lot of it) - but reality TV too!

      8 votes
      1. [2]
        Adys
        Link Parent
        Writing subtitles is an art. The best subtitlers will take this sort of thing into account and respect timing. It’s one of the reasons I love Captions.Plus, who subtitle some of the more...

        Writing subtitles is an art. The best subtitlers will take this sort of thing into account and respect timing.

        It’s one of the reasons I love Captions.Plus, who subtitle some of the more successful educational YouTubers. They have an incredible respect for timing, positioning, puns, etc. They are hands down the best subtitle team I’ve seen at work.

        22 votes
        1. merry-cherry
          Link Parent
          Subtitles can even add a layer to the scene. They'll sometimes write in descriptions of audio playing that play into the feeling of the scene.

          Subtitles can even add a layer to the scene. They'll sometimes write in descriptions of audio playing that play into the feeling of the scene.

          8 votes
      2. Macha
        Link Parent
        Honestly that's kind of the fault of the subtitler if you get something like: Which totally happens, but shouldn't.

        Honestly that's kind of the fault of the subtitler if you get something like:

        And, now, my moment of trium-[dying noises]

        Which totally happens, but shouldn't.

        8 votes
    2. TescoLarger
      Link Parent
      Absolutely agree on the comedies point, it completely kills it! My partners first language isn't English so we'd watch most English programmes with subtitles on - Brooklyn 99 has never been the...

      Absolutely agree on the comedies point, it completely kills it! My partners first language isn't English so we'd watch most English programmes with subtitles on - Brooklyn 99 has never been the same!

      It has gotten me into the habit of watching most programmes with them on though, and it's a game changer for dramas in particular. So much more enjoyable not stressing over trying to make out what has been said.

      3 votes
  2. [4]
    ButteredToast
    Link
    I don't particularly mind subtitles and use them frequently for foreign language media, but one gripe I have with them is that I read very quickly, which leads me to constantly outpace what's...

    I don't particularly mind subtitles and use them frequently for foreign language media, but one gripe I have with them is that I read very quickly, which leads me to constantly outpace what's happening on-screen and spoil dramatic pauses and such, especially when the spoken language doesn't match English's sentence order.

    So I'd say it'd be ideal if I didn't have to use them.

    19 votes
    1. Nny
      Link Parent
      I hate this with comedy films too. It’ll completely ruin the flow of the joke, especially if physical comedy is involved Flip side is that it’s nice if I completely zone out for a second and miss...

      I hate this with comedy films too. It’ll completely ruin the flow of the joke, especially if physical comedy is involved

      Flip side is that it’s nice if I completely zone out for a second and miss what was said, I can quickly read the subtitle lol

      1 vote
    2. [2]
      OBLIVIATER
      Link Parent
      Yeah, I can't stand subtitles for this reason. Its frustrating that so many of my friends want to watch stuff with them on

      Yeah, I can't stand subtitles for this reason. Its frustrating that so many of my friends want to watch stuff with them on

      1 vote
      1. vagueallusion
        Link Parent
        Flip side is it can be frustrating watching a movie with a group and missing a bit of dialogue. When I'm alone it's quiet and I can rewind if I miss something. In a group distractions happen more...

        Flip side is it can be frustrating watching a movie with a group and missing a bit of dialogue. When I'm alone it's quiet and I can rewind if I miss something. In a group distractions happen more often and I can't rewind as freely.

        I do however wish subtitles would use the black margins instead of overlaying on the movie.

        4 votes
  3. [11]
    FishFingus
    Link
    Sound editing in a lot of modern movies, and even shows, has seemingly gone to ploppers. I'm not prepared to throw away a perfectly good pre-smart era flatscreen TV, and fork out thousands on an...

    Sound editing in a lot of modern movies, and even shows, has seemingly gone to ploppers. I'm not prepared to throw away a perfectly good pre-smart era flatscreen TV, and fork out thousands on an overpriced and user-hostile new model, just to be able to make out what characters are trying to say among the muddled audio assault. Subtitles is a much cheaper option. Plus, it means you don't have to struggle to hear the television over people talking, or the other beeps and boops and nnnnnnnngs of the modern home. I don't remember fridges of the past being so loud and constant. D:

    Also, I can switch to Spanish or Italian and laugh at what the characters are saying, because apparently I'm immensely easy to amuse.

    16 votes
    1. [8]
      Minty
      Link Parent
      A new TV won't help. They don't have per-channel volume controls. It's just poor editing, most noticeable if you watch a 40-50 year old movie (around when technology stopped being the bottleneck)...

      A new TV won't help. They don't have per-channel volume controls. It's just poor editing, most noticeable if you watch a 40-50 year old movie (around when technology stopped being the bottleneck) back to back with a new one.

      9 votes
      1. FishFingus
        Link Parent
        Hrmph. Then I'll just sit alone in my room and listen to movies through my headset. Not much on TV these days anyway, except for repeats of Come Dine With Me and inexplicable all-year Christmas...

        Hrmph. Then I'll just sit alone in my room and listen to movies through my headset. Not much on TV these days anyway, except for repeats of Come Dine With Me and inexplicable all-year Christmas movie channels.

      2. [6]
        Akir
        Link Parent
        It’s not so much poor editing as it is that built in tv speakers are universally terrible. Soundbars tend to be bad too. They overemphasize some frequencies and underproduce on others, so things...

        It’s not so much poor editing as it is that built in tv speakers are universally terrible. Soundbars tend to be bad too. They overemphasize some frequencies and underproduce on others, so things never quite sound right.

        On the other hand the fact that these programs are not taking bad speakers into account can be a knock against the sound mixing (unless we are talking about movies meant to be played in theaters with much better sound systems).

        1. [5]
          merry-cherry
          Link Parent
          They've always been terrible though. Those old cabinet sized TVs didn't have great audio either, but producers worked within the limitations. I fully understand producers and engineers wanting to...

          They've always been terrible though. Those old cabinet sized TVs didn't have great audio either, but producers worked within the limitations. I fully understand producers and engineers wanting to explore Dolby and make a great product for great hardware, I really do. But they need to also include a shit mix for those who aren't running a 10 grand studio at home. It's entirely possible to deliver both to customers and allow them to choose, same as we chose now for video quality.

          Arrogance and laziness are the reason why you can't hear shit anymore, not hardware.

          9 votes
          1. [2]
            Akir
            Link Parent
            They haven't always been terrible, though - at least not as bad as they are now. They were bad because they had bare drivers against the grilles; a good speaker will have a chamber behind it to...

            They haven't always been terrible, though - at least not as bad as they are now. They were bad because they had bare drivers against the grilles; a good speaker will have a chamber behind it to reduce resonance. But since TVs became flat panels they couldn't even put good quality drivers in them, and they had to put them in odd places like the bottom or the back.

            It's also very bad to blame this on the sound engineers mixing the audio. If they mix their audio for low quality speakers it will sound bad on both of them. You're also asking them to gimp their work. You wouldn't ask a painter to try to make a worse painting, would you?

            4 votes
            1. merry-cherry
              (edited )
              Link Parent
              Video playback is capable of delivering different audio quality, it can also deliver different audio quality. You appear to have missed the entire section where I said the audio should be...

              Video playback is capable of delivering different audio quality, it can also deliver different audio quality. You appear to have missed the entire section where I said the audio should be delivered as both high quality and low quality. We

              2 votes
          2. [2]
            ButteredToast
            Link Parent
            One bit of tech that I think might help with this problem (though I haven't yet tried it myself) is a setting that newer Sony TVs (and maybe some other brands) have where after connecting any...

            One bit of tech that I think might help with this problem (though I haven't yet tried it myself) is a setting that newer Sony TVs (and maybe some other brands) have where after connecting any external speakers, even cheaper ones (even ~$150 stereo Edifiers can do wonders), the built-in speakers are repurposed to act as a supplementary middle channel.

            In theory this should boost the audibility of dialogue substantially since those bands suddenly have dedicated speakers which can have their volume controlled independently.

            4 votes
            1. merry-cherry
              Link Parent
              It's more of an issue of mismatched drivers. Little speakers just can't push lows like they are being asked too. The other problem is the wider dynamic range audio is being mixed in. This makes...

              It's more of an issue of mismatched drivers. Little speakers just can't push lows like they are being asked too.

              The other problem is the wider dynamic range audio is being mixed in. This makes for bigger booms but completely ignores how disruptive it is to listen at the "correct" audio levels in an apartment lifestyle. So people turn the audio down to not piss off neighbors during shooting scenes, making speaking parts practically a whisper. Older shows mixed a pretty even loudness across the entire show.

              4 votes
    2. FrankGrimes
      Link Parent
      I came across this video a little while back that took a quick look at this phenomenon. It drives me crazy that I can't hear anything, even when I run it through a halfway decent external sound...

      I came across this video a little while back that took a quick look at this phenomenon. It drives me crazy that I can't hear anything, even when I run it through a halfway decent external sound system. I've even had some movies where I get 10 minutes in and just finally shut it off because I can't understand anything anyone's saying. It really kills the whole experience for me.

      Why are we still mixing audio primarily for theater level sound systems, when most people are watching movies at home? There's got to be a better middle ground than what we have now.

      8 votes
    3. jackson
      Link Parent
      No need to throw out the TV- you’ll get much better sound from an external sound source. You can occasionally find good deals on sound setups on Craigslist/FB Marketplace. I got a full surround...

      No need to throw out the TV- you’ll get much better sound from an external sound source. You can occasionally find good deals on sound setups on Craigslist/FB Marketplace. I got a full surround setup, receiver included, for under $200, sounds much better than any TV speaker on the market.

      2 votes
  4. [5]
    Nny
    Link
    When I was a teenager, I went through a few year period where I almost only watched subbed anime - so basically everything I consumed, I could only understand through reading subtitles Just been...

    When I was a teenager, I went through a few year period where I almost only watched subbed anime - so basically everything I consumed, I could only understand through reading subtitles

    Just been instilled in me since. It’s hard for me to watch something without them now. It’s why I’m glad it’s been becoming more normal, because it could be weird to ask for subtitles to be put on 20 years ago

    The irony also is that I only watched dubbed anime now lol

    10 votes
    1. [2]
      vagueallusion
      Link Parent
      I'm not sure when you started watching anime but it used to be ...really bad. From the translations, to the lip sync, to the timing. Reeealy bad.

      I'm not sure when you started watching anime but it used to be ...really bad. From the translations, to the lip sync, to the timing. Reeealy bad.

      3 votes
      1. Nny
        Link Parent
        Dubs? Yeah, they’re significantly better now though Subs? Always was dependent. VHS fan subs normally were solid, but importing from HK was one of the only ways to get anime before and yeah those...

        Dubs? Yeah, they’re significantly better now though

        Subs? Always was dependent. VHS fan subs normally were solid, but importing from HK was one of the only ways to get anime before and yeah those could be HORRIBLE

        The first time I watched Yu Yu Hakusho was with HK subs, and I basically had no idea what was happening. But it was the only way I knew how to watch it and was still fun lol

        1 vote
    2. [2]
      redwall_hp
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I mostly watch subtitled anime now, and also watch everything else subtitled. One thing I like about anime is it's a more literary medium: characters emote more than is common outside of stage...

      I mostly watch subtitled anime now, and also watch everything else subtitled. One thing I like about anime is it's a more literary medium: characters emote more than is common outside of stage acting, and voiceovers actually give you an internal monologue that's absent in most Hollywood productions. As someone who grew up reading a lot, being able to know what characters are thinking is something dreadfully absent in most films.

      Subtitled anime is also more mentally stimulating than passively watching a TV show, because I can listen to the audio and pick out new vocabulary/try to understand what words were said/criticize choices in translation. And I tend to get bored with passive consumption.

      3 votes
      1. Nny
        Link Parent
        That’s exactly why I switched to dubs, because TV has become mostly a “background” thing for me and so I need to be able to passively consume it. I do switch back to subs when it’s something I...

        Subtitled anime is also more mentally stimulating than passively watching a TV show, because I can listen to the audio and pick out new vocabulary/try to understand what words were said/criticize choices in translation. And I tend to get bored with passive consumption.

        That’s exactly why I switched to dubs, because TV has become mostly a “background” thing for me and so I need to be able to passively consume it. I do switch back to subs when it’s something I want to actively consume and fully take in

        100% to your first paragraph too. I never thought of it before but I was also a voracious reader and definitely relate to what you’re talking about with anime

        1 vote
  5. skreba
    Link
    40 years old and lost a decent amount of hearing in the military, so I'm definitely in the subtitles-always-on group. That said, I really love the way the Apple TV+ shows do it: they have a CC...

    40 years old and lost a decent amount of hearing in the military, so I'm definitely in the subtitles-always-on group.

    That said, I really love the way the Apple TV+ shows do it: they have a CC option that just puts dialogue on the screen (instead of all the sound effects, grunts, groans, etc).

    8 votes
  6. [3]
    spit-evil-olive-tips
    Link
    the original source seems to be these two blog posts by Preply: https://preply.com/en/blog/america-still-obsessed-subtitles/ https://preply.com/en/blog/americas-subtitles-use/ I hadn't heard of...

    the original source seems to be these two blog posts by Preply:

    https://preply.com/en/blog/america-still-obsessed-subtitles/

    https://preply.com/en/blog/americas-subtitles-use/

    I hadn't heard of Preply before. they appear to be a company that sells language learning resources & tutoring.

    7 votes
    1. [2]
      boxer_dogs_dance
      Link Parent
      Do you think they would have any motive for skewing this kind of research?

      Do you think they would have any motive for skewing this kind of research?

      3 votes
      1. spit-evil-olive-tips
        Link Parent
        nah, probably not. I think their only motive is to drive traffic to their blog and hope that some of those clicks results in conversions of traffic to their main website, and then signups for...

        nah, probably not. I think their only motive is to drive traffic to their blog and hope that some of those clicks results in conversions of traffic to their main website, and then signups for their product (we're looking at the outermost edge of what is called a sales funnel)

        they may have a mild bias towards the research generating "surprising" or "interesting" results, because that'll make for a better blog post, but I think that's true of virtually any research, regardless of who's running it.

        4 votes
  7. [3]
    Algernon_Asimov
    Link
    People reading this topic might also be interested in this previous post: Why is everyone watching TV with the subtitles on?

    People reading this topic might also be interested in this previous post:

    Why is everyone watching TV with the subtitles on?

    6 votes
    1. [2]
      boxer_dogs_dance
      Link Parent
      Thank you! It's nice to see your name. You commented more frequently when I first joined and were welcoming.

      Thank you! It's nice to see your name. You commented more frequently when I first joined and were welcoming.

      4 votes
      1. Algernon_Asimov
        Link Parent
        I go through phases, hot and cold. In the past, I've dropped out for months at a time. I'm still here, though. Sorry if I gave you the wrong impression about me. ;)

        You commented more frequently when I first joined

        I go through phases, hot and cold. In the past, I've dropped out for months at a time. I'm still here, though.

        and were welcoming.

        Sorry if I gave you the wrong impression about me. ;)

        13 votes
  8. [2]
    Bipolar
    Link
    When I went to watch Oppenheimer, the couple in front of us had a subtitle machined thingy. And I wanted and needed it, I definitely missed more than a couple lines.

    When I went to watch Oppenheimer, the couple in front of us had a subtitle machined thingy. And I wanted and needed it, I definitely missed more than a couple lines.

    5 votes
    1. tealblue
      Link Parent
      Despite the rep that Nolan has with sound mixing, I didn't run into any issues understanding everything in Oppenheimer.

      Despite the rep that Nolan has with sound mixing, I didn't run into any issues understanding everything in Oppenheimer.

      3 votes
  9. AgnesNutter
    Link
    This is the new mixed-marriage. Either choice is of course fine, but it must be hard to be in a partnership with the opposite preference. People seem to feel quite strongly one way or the other! I...

    This is the new mixed-marriage. Either choice is of course fine, but it must be hard to be in a partnership with the opposite preference. People seem to feel quite strongly one way or the other! I am personally not a fan of subtitles (except for media in other languages where it’s far preferable to dubbing) - I find them distracting and tend to miss facial expressions

    5 votes
  10. sparksbet
    Link
    My partner and I watch almost everything with subs despite neither of us having hearing issues. We're both neurodivergent which I think plays a part -- I have ADHD so having two modes of...

    My partner and I watch almost everything with subs despite neither of us having hearing issues. We're both neurodivergent which I think plays a part -- I have ADHD so having two modes of communication makes it easier for me not to miss things if I stop paying attention to one of them. Plus there's always the issue of life noise getting in the way -- I don't want to miss something because I was eating something crunchy.

    5 votes
  11. raccoona_nongrata
    Link
    As long as people don't start routinely hard-coding them it's all good. I've run across YT channels and stuff that just assume you want subtitles as a default and it's kind of aggravating.

    As long as people don't start routinely hard-coding them it's all good. I've run across YT channels and stuff that just assume you want subtitles as a default and it's kind of aggravating.

    3 votes
  12. Beowulf
    Link
    Combine this with how dark some shows are now and I sometimes feel more like I'm reading a book from across the room than watching TV.

    Combine this with how dark some shows are now and I sometimes feel more like I'm reading a book from across the room than watching TV.

    2 votes
  13. foxensly
    Link
    It's important to keep in mind that a good portion of this has less to do with anyone's loss of hearing, and a lot to do with a changing industry. From The Guardian (but emphasis mine):...

    It's important to keep in mind that a good portion of this has less to do with anyone's loss of hearing, and a lot to do with a changing industry.

    From The Guardian (but emphasis mine):

    But if you’re switching subtitles on because you simply can’t make out what the actors are saying, it’s (probably) not your ears that are to blame. Hard-to-hear dialogue is a known issue in the industry, says the sound mixer Guntis Sics, who has worked on movies including Moulin Rouge! and Thor: Ragnarok.

    There are a lot of contributing factors but, paradoxically, it all comes back to advances in technology.

    “As technology evolved, especially when it took the leap to digital, a tsunami of sound appeared all of a sudden,” Sics says.

    The problem starts on the movie set. In decades past, actors had to project loudly towards a fixed microphone. The advent of portable mics has allowed a shift towards a more intimate and naturalistic style of performance, where actors can speak more softly – or, some might say, mumble.

    It’s an approach to acting Sics says has been around for a long time now, but something he’s certainly noticed more in younger performers.

    Anecdotally, that last comment seems to line up with why younger generations would be using more subtitles.

    Additionally, I only recently learned that Foley artists exist, which just seems like a super cool profession. As it relates to subtitling, quoted below from this article, it seems like Foleys are adding a lot more sound into movies than what they used to, which would also line up with a changing industry / changing film.

    In 2019, things are vastly different. Foley artists mostly cover any sort of customizable sound effect that must be performed and imbued with the energy and aesthetic of the moving image. We perform and re-auralize sounds that must be created at the moment of recording and can’t be pulled or edited together with a sound library or field recordings. We also create impressionistic sounds that the audience needs to feel but are non-existent in reality: guns typically don’t rattle, handshakes are usually imperceivable. We craft sounds that are dependent on an understanding of the film’s rhythms and are tightly synced with the emotion and storytelling in a very kinetic way. We depend on life experience to find that middle ground between impressionism and technical accuracy to help immerse the audience into the emotional world of the characters.

    Algernon_Asimov's comment in this thread links to a good Tildes post that I also read through, but it seemed like most of that thread was focused on surround sound mixing.

    Just my thoughts.

    1 vote
  14. teaearlgraycold
    Link
    I’m surprised TVs haven’t yet added an AI audio processing feature to make it easier to hear dialogue. It would be considered tasteless by some, like motion smoothing, but that never stopped TV...

    I’m surprised TVs haven’t yet added an AI audio processing feature to make it easier to hear dialogue. It would be considered tasteless by some, like motion smoothing, but that never stopped TV manufacturers before.