Looks like Framework is claiming more battery life than Apple's newest laptops, at least for video, on Linux. And you can upgrade the RAM and ROM with standard components, and easily swap ports...
Looks like Framework is claiming more battery life than Apple's newest laptops, at least for video, on Linux. And you can upgrade the RAM and ROM with standard components, and easily swap ports and replace parts using Framework parts!
They mention in the video that they don't want to announce the laptop price because of ram volatility. So I would guess they are not announcing any pricing for anything until they have some ram...
They mention in the video that they don't want to announce the laptop price because of ram volatility. So I would guess they are not announcing any pricing for anything until they have some ram contracts locked in.
Looking at the ram config prices already gave me a heart attack, so I can't blame them. 1200 for the base chasis and then ram was Heart attack warning439 USD for 32 GB. And 849 USD for 64 GB I'd...
Looking at the ram config prices already gave me a heart attack, so I can't blame them. 1200 for the base chasis and then ram was
Heart attack warning439 USD for 32 GB. And 849 USD for 64 GB
I'd definitely hold off any pricing until things stabilize.
If you look at the individual parts for the Framework 13 Pro: Framework Laptop 13 Pro Battery - 74Wh: $89 Framework Laptop 13 Pro Speaker Kit: $19 Framework Laptop 13 Pro Input Cover Frame -...
If you look at the individual parts for the Framework 13 Pro:
https://frame.work/nextgen Other announcements included updates to the Framework 16, including one-piece keyboard and touchpad modules, and an Oculink devkit. As well as a wireless keyboard (and...
Other announcements included updates to the Framework 16, including one-piece keyboard and touchpad modules, and an Oculink devkit. As well as a wireless keyboard (and wireless keyboard board) and a laptop sleeve.
Do you know if any independent hands-on of the new trackpad are out? It sounds very compelling, with glass and haptics, but the devil is in the details.
Do you know if any independent hands-on of the new trackpad are out? It sounds very compelling, with glass and haptics, but the devil is in the details.
This is right off the presentation, so nothing apparent to me at this time outside of LTT, and Linus is an investor in Framework, so ymmv on independence. https://youtu.be/5c1sGzZnuiU
This is right off the presentation, so nothing apparent to me at this time outside of LTT, and Linus is an investor in Framework, so ymmv on independence.
If it makes you feel better, he's an incredibly minor investor in the scope of things. I think he put in around 100k or 200k? For scale, their series A round in 2024 was $18m. Relative to LMG's...
If it makes you feel better, he's an incredibly minor investor in the scope of things. I think he put in around 100k or 200k? For scale, their series A round in 2024 was $18m. Relative to LMG's value, even with a very optimistic outlook for Framework, I doubt it's a noticeable portion of his net worth.
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the number of videos he's done on Framework, if they had actually been paid "showcase" (aka entertaining advertising ) videos would be worth more than his actual investment.
And Linus does those because his community is interested in the topic. They consistently perform very well.
It's still a presentation by an investor and the CEO of Framework. It might be cool, and I personally think that Framework is very cool, but it's just not an objective review. It's a showcase....
It's still a presentation by an investor and the CEO of Framework. It might be cool, and I personally think that Framework is very cool, but it's just not an objective review. It's a showcase. It's an ad. That's okay. But you're not going to get a honest review.
I was replying to a user who was saying the sole reason they were unwilling to purchase a Framework was that Linus is an investor. I do agree that LMG tends to over-focus on the positives of...
I was replying to a user who was saying the sole reason they were unwilling to purchase a Framework was that Linus is an investor. I do agree that LMG tends to over-focus on the positives of products on their channel.
I think the money invested were very well worth for Framework at the time of investment. I believe Linus said back then that such investemnt helps a lot at that stage - beginning - as the money...
I think the money invested were very well worth for Framework at the time of investment. I believe Linus said back then that such investemnt helps a lot at that stage - beginning - as the money invested is quite big compared to what the company has at the time. I hope I make sense.
Nowadays Framework is kinda established and likely self-sufficient company so his investment is kinda negligible in today's money.
And I also thinm that if Linus don't like something, he says it out loud - put them on the spotlight. He was saying all the time that touchscreen must happen and voila, it's there. If something wasn't ok, he would tell, I believe. Even with his investment.
I think he also said the investment is more like support of the idea of serviceable and ulgradeable laptop and thus was kinda backing his words with money.
Sounds kinda petty. Plenty of companies have multiple investors which you don't know about. Linus is just one of them that you have a parasocial grudge on
Sounds kinda petty. Plenty of companies have multiple investors which you don't know about. Linus is just one of them that you have a parasocial grudge on
I would bet a hefty sum that every company with more than, say, 100 employees has someone attached to it (as an investor, shareholder, employee, etc) who did something most people would consider...
I would bet a hefty sum that every company with more than, say, 100 employees has someone attached to it (as an investor, shareholder, employee, etc) who did something most people would consider an asshole move.
I don't mean this to sound rude, but why? I know very little about Linus, but is he problematic? I've had other people bother me on YouTube, like when MKBHD did 90 mph in a school zone on video...
I don't mean this to sound rude, but why?
I know very little about Linus, but is he problematic?
I've had other people bother me on YouTube, like when MKBHD did 90 mph in a school zone on video and never released any statement owning up to that colossal fuck up.
Last video I did something pretty stupid. You might've already seen it, but maybe not so I'll address it here. There was a clip with the action cam of me test driving a car and going way to fast. Absolutely inexcusable and dangerous.
I've since cut it out of the video with YouTube's editor tool. I also understand that this looks like covering it up, but I think it's the right thing to do.
There's no reason to leave that clip in (there was no reason to include it in the first place) and I would never want to make it seem ok by leaving it in the video. I'm well aware of the Streisand effect, and I know everything on the internet lives forever, but I think that's the best decision right now.
All I can do apologize and promise never to do anything close to that stupid again. That's a terrible example to set and I'm sorry for it.
Why so? Just curious - to me it doesn't seem to be any worse than enriching random legacy vendors and their shareholders who're doing little to change the Linux portable space, but I may be...
Why so? Just curious - to me it doesn't seem to be any worse than enriching random legacy vendors and their shareholders who're doing little to change the Linux portable space, but I may be missing something.
He kind of glossed over it a bit. There was lots to go over there and I think all of that stuff may or may not have been actual production units. For anyone that isnt interested, the one REALLY...
He kind of glossed over it a bit. There was lots to go over there and I think all of that stuff may or may not have been actual production units.
For anyone that isnt interested, the one REALLY interesting bit is that they included a usb-c to usb-a adapter slot thing for their laptops that had recessed port so the dongle sits flush with the laptop when plugged in. I don't get the point of using a keyboard like that with my laptop, but Linus mentioned using it for his wireless mouse and it half way fit his mouse dongle.
Hardware like a Macbook, but I can install linux on it? Sign me up. Love that framework's laptops are easy to repair and upgrade. I'm super impressed that even with this new chassis the parts are...
Hardware like a Macbook, but I can install linux on it? Sign me up. Love that framework's laptops are easy to repair and upgrade. I'm super impressed that even with this new chassis the parts are backwards- and forwards-compatible.
This makes Framework a much more attractive option for me. Battery life is one of the biggest advantages of MacBooks compared to everything else and it's difficult to imagine spending this kind of...
This makes Framework a much more attractive option for me. Battery life is one of the biggest advantages of MacBooks compared to everything else and it's difficult to imagine spending this kind of money on a machine that doesn't have it. It's just too core to what makes a laptop a good laptop, in my opinion at least — if battery life is unavoidably poor I may as well go the route of an SFF PC which will have similar or better power and more capable/more quiet cooling for a marginally larger footprint.
It remains to be seen how well it fares in real life usage though, particularly under Linux. They also claim improved standby time which I hope is true because it's really annoying (and in the long term, bad for the environment) to have to recharge your laptop 2-3x more often due to sleep drain.
I have a 12th Gen Framework 13 and these upgrades are impressive. I'm a bit envious because my current machine runs great and I don't need an upgrade right now. But that's a good problem to have.
I have a 12th Gen Framework 13 and these upgrades are impressive. I'm a bit envious because my current machine runs great and I don't need an upgrade right now. But that's a good problem to have.
I've been daily driving a 13th-gen Intel Framework 13 running Fedora for nearly three years, and the experience has been fantastic overall, with the exception of battery life. I've been...
I've been daily driving a 13th-gen Intel Framework 13 running Fedora for nearly three years, and the experience has been fantastic overall, with the exception of battery life. I've been begrudgingly eyeing a Macbook Pro for my next laptop simply because no other manufacturer has been able to come close to Apple's power efficiency, but if Framework's battery life claims are to be believed for this new model I'll be happily sticking with Framework for my next purchase. I love their modularity/right to repair ethos and first-class Linux support.
A question for anyone with a better handle on their upgrade paths and their value/dollar than myself - if I want to get the upgraded mainboard, battery, trackpad, and display, is it worthwhile to just do the bottom cover upgrade kit and repurpose the old mainboard as a home server or should I sell my current FW13 and buy the new DIY Pro edition?
I wish they sell it in Thailand. I went to their booth at Computex two years ago, and the answer I got was "you have to get it here while you're in Taiwan". Which is probably not an easy option -...
I wish they sell it in Thailand. I went to their booth at Computex two years ago, and the answer I got was "you have to get it here while you're in Taiwan". Which is probably not an easy option - they are not selling in retailers and online ordering might not arrive until you've left. I heard that they also actively banning re-shipper and the use of credit cards from other countries (your order may get canceled, or if you admit that you did those your forum account banned and warranty void).
The only asian countries that Framework ships to are Taiwan, Singapore.
Seems like a really solid upgrade. Interested in seeing reviews of it in the near future. I'm sorta in the market for a new laptop. I have a desktop and used to have a 16in M1 MacBook Pro but I...
Seems like a really solid upgrade. Interested in seeing reviews of it in the near future. I'm sorta in the market for a new laptop. I have a desktop and used to have a 16in M1 MacBook Pro but I recently lent that to my mother and she's keeping it. My desktop is powerful to do anything I need but I miss having a laptop for couch and on-the-go computing. I partially replaced the couch computing with using a different browser on my work laptop but it was very limiting and new corporate policies as of today are further restricting personal use.
I'm very much spoiled by my MacBook so I was thinking of picking up a refurbed one though the Framework is also on my radar. I miss having a Mac since it integrated nicely with my other Apple products (vendor lock-in woohoo!), I genuinely enjoy and kinda prefer macOS nowadays, and the hardware was genuinely a good value for its price. The Framework 13 Pro basically matches the 14in M5 MacBook Pro on price and scales in a fairly similar manner too so the choice isn't as clearcut for me.
Ya that's not clear cut. For me the vendor lock in with apple got to be too much and I switched to Linux where I can, started with MacOS when I have to, and grapheneOS for my phone. So I'd go with...
Ya that's not clear cut.
For me the vendor lock in with apple got to be too much and I switched to Linux where I can, started with MacOS when I have to, and grapheneOS for my phone. So I'd go with the framework and run Linux and have the repairable platform.
If you're looking at Mac vs the FW running windows... the framework is way more repairable and has those swappable dongle things vs apple with a (probably) smaller device that integrates your stuff.
Forget both of those options though. Go full linux; grow a neckbeard and buy a used thinkpad.
I don't mind the vendor lock-in too much just yet, things work great but we'll see how that holds up in the future. I genuinely appreciate the notification sync between iPhone/Mac, having my...
I don't mind the vendor lock-in too much just yet, things work great but we'll see how that holds up in the future. I genuinely appreciate the notification sync between iPhone/Mac, having my messages be easily accessible on my computer, screen mirroring, and smaller features like having MFA codes that come to my phone automatically be available on my computer. I know that KDE Connect enables most of the same with Linux but it's always been super flakey for me. I'll have to put overall repairability to the test soon as my iPhone's battery health is currently in the low 80s percent-wise and due to be replaced once it drops below 80. I've had good experiences with repairs from Apple in the past, though I've also heard plenty of horror stories lol.
I actually did try a used Thinkpad with Linux for the last 3-4 months, my family had a T490s just collecting dust so I dusted it off and installed Ubuntu. Overall, the experience wasn't too bad but the touchpad and speakers really hurt the experience for me. The touchpad would always lag a heartbeat or two behind my fingers and gestures would take a few hundred milliseconds for the system to recognize I was trying to use a gesture. I get that Linux power users never leave the keyboard but I'm a casual user and I prefer poking around with the trackpad using gestures. The speakers were genuinely terrible though, it hurt to actually listen to anything. I think these are more issues with the Thinkpad rather than Linux though which is why I'm considering the Framework to begin with.
I've already switched my desktop to Linux and have been Windows-free for a few years now thankfully. Windows 11 is somehow worse than both macOS and Linux distros to me.
See... I can't stand extra notifications on my computer and my phone mostly lives on do not disturb mode now. I tried KDE Connect and didn't like the additional stuff on my computer, and its not...
I genuinely appreciate the notification sync between iPhone/Mac
See... I can't stand extra notifications on my computer and my phone mostly lives on do not disturb mode now. I tried KDE Connect and didn't like the additional stuff on my computer, and its not amazing like you said.
I actually did try a used Thinkpad with Linux
ONE OF US!
but the touchpad and speakers really hurt the experience for me
The touchpad is just never as good :-( and I never listen to anything on my thinkpad because its too terrible. Maybe look into some reviews on the framework trackpad on linux before buying (if you go that route) because a LOT of how well the trackpad works seems to be software.
Yeah matching the Mac trackpad is a difficult task but if they get like 90% of the way there, that'd be good enough for me to be honest. I just want reliable trackpad gestures and I think Wayland...
Yeah matching the Mac trackpad is a difficult task but if they get like 90% of the way there, that'd be good enough for me to be honest. I just want reliable trackpad gestures and I think Wayland has unlocked that for the most part. I just need to see if gesture detection has improved. I'm not in a rush to get a computer so I'll definitely be waiting for reviews!
Looks like Framework is claiming more battery life than Apple's newest laptops, at least for video, on Linux. And you can upgrade the RAM and ROM with standard components, and easily swap ports and replace parts using Framework parts!
I wonder if they fixed sleep?
Are they making the battery claims on Linux? The webpage says "Windows 11" under each battery life number.
Don't be ridiculous!
And there's an upgrade kit for existing Framework 13 users, which is just fantastic.
Is the price for the upgrade kit TBA? I'm not seeing it anywhere on the product page or in the announcement video.
They mention in the video that they don't want to announce the laptop price because of ram volatility. So I would guess they are not announcing any pricing for anything until they have some ram contracts locked in.
Looking at the ram config prices already gave me a heart attack, so I can't blame them. 1200 for the base chasis and then ram was
Heart attack warning
439 USD for 32 GB. And 849 USD for 64 GBI'd definitely hold off any pricing until things stabilize.
As someone used to Apple memory tax this won’t scare me away from buying one of these later in the year.
Oooffff. Wow. It is a new module type, and probably quite a high spec, but still. I bought 64gb of DDR5 last September for $200 or so.
If you look at the individual parts for the Framework 13 Pro:
Total: $436
Edit: I linked the silver bottom and input covers, but graphite is the same price.
Typing on my Framework 13 now ... literally came to this thread for this post. Danke, y gracias.
https://frame.work/nextgen
Other announcements included updates to the Framework 16, including one-piece keyboard and touchpad modules, and an Oculink devkit. As well as a wireless keyboard (and wireless keyboard board) and a laptop sleeve.
Do you know if any independent hands-on of the new trackpad are out? It sounds very compelling, with glass and haptics, but the devil is in the details.
This is right off the presentation, so nothing apparent to me at this time outside of LTT, and Linus is an investor in Framework, so ymmv on independence.
https://youtu.be/5c1sGzZnuiU
If it makes you feel better, he's an incredibly minor investor in the scope of things. I think he put in around 100k or 200k? For scale, their series A round in 2024 was $18m. Relative to LMG's value, even with a very optimistic outlook for Framework, I doubt it's a noticeable portion of his net worth.
https://frame.work/blog/frameworks-series-a-1-and-community-participation
I honestly wouldn't be surprised if the number of videos he's done on Framework, if they had actually been paid "showcase" (aka entertaining advertising ) videos would be worth more than his actual investment.
And Linus does those because his community is interested in the topic. They consistently perform very well.
It's still a presentation by an investor and the CEO of Framework. It might be cool, and I personally think that Framework is very cool, but it's just not an objective review. It's a showcase. It's an ad. That's okay. But you're not going to get a honest review.
I was replying to a user who was saying the sole reason they were unwilling to purchase a Framework was that Linus is an investor. I do agree that LMG tends to over-focus on the positives of products on their channel.
I think the money invested were very well worth for Framework at the time of investment. I believe Linus said back then that such investemnt helps a lot at that stage - beginning - as the money invested is quite big compared to what the company has at the time. I hope I make sense.
Nowadays Framework is kinda established and likely self-sufficient company so his investment is kinda negligible in today's money.
And I also thinm that if Linus don't like something, he says it out loud - put them on the spotlight. He was saying all the time that touchscreen must happen and voila, it's there. If something wasn't ok, he would tell, I believe. Even with his investment.
I think he also said the investment is more like support of the idea of serviceable and ulgradeable laptop and thus was kinda backing his words with money.
Or maybe I'm completely false on tbis.
Sounds kinda petty. Plenty of companies have multiple investors which you don't know about. Linus is just one of them that you have a parasocial grudge on
Just to nitpick. How many stocks would Linus have to buy in your favourite grocery store for you to start boycotting them?
I would bet a hefty sum that every company with more than, say, 100 employees has someone attached to it (as an investor, shareholder, employee, etc) who did something most people would consider an asshole move.
I don't mean this to sound rude, but why?
I know very little about Linus, but is he problematic?
I've had other people bother me on YouTube, like when MKBHD did 90 mph in a school zone on video and never released any statement owning up to that colossal fuck up.
There's NOTHING to gain from a "statement". People will forget and largely already have.
https://x.com/mkbhd/status/1856456570420257166
Oh, I don't use twitter. I guess he did own up to it. That helps a lot in redeeming him, thanks for sharing this DFGdanger.
Why so? Just curious - to me it doesn't seem to be any worse than enriching random legacy vendors and their shareholders who're doing little to change the Linux portable space, but I may be missing something.
He kind of glossed over it a bit. There was lots to go over there and I think all of that stuff may or may not have been actual production units.
For anyone that isnt interested, the one REALLY interesting bit is that they included a usb-c to usb-a adapter slot thing for their laptops that had recessed port so the dongle sits flush with the laptop when plugged in. I don't get the point of using a keyboard like that with my laptop, but Linus mentioned using it for his wireless mouse and it half way fit his mouse dongle.
Hardware like a Macbook, but I can install linux on it? Sign me up. Love that framework's laptops are easy to repair and upgrade. I'm super impressed that even with this new chassis the parts are backwards- and forwards-compatible.
This makes Framework a much more attractive option for me. Battery life is one of the biggest advantages of MacBooks compared to everything else and it's difficult to imagine spending this kind of money on a machine that doesn't have it. It's just too core to what makes a laptop a good laptop, in my opinion at least — if battery life is unavoidably poor I may as well go the route of an SFF PC which will have similar or better power and more capable/more quiet cooling for a marginally larger footprint.
It remains to be seen how well it fares in real life usage though, particularly under Linux. They also claim improved standby time which I hope is true because it's really annoying (and in the long term, bad for the environment) to have to recharge your laptop 2-3x more often due to sleep drain.
I have a 12th Gen Framework 13 and these upgrades are impressive. I'm a bit envious because my current machine runs great and I don't need an upgrade right now. But that's a good problem to have.
I've been daily driving a 13th-gen Intel Framework 13 running Fedora for nearly three years, and the experience has been fantastic overall, with the exception of battery life. I've been begrudgingly eyeing a Macbook Pro for my next laptop simply because no other manufacturer has been able to come close to Apple's power efficiency, but if Framework's battery life claims are to be believed for this new model I'll be happily sticking with Framework for my next purchase. I love their modularity/right to repair ethos and first-class Linux support.
A question for anyone with a better handle on their upgrade paths and their value/dollar than myself - if I want to get the upgraded mainboard, battery, trackpad, and display, is it worthwhile to just do the bottom cover upgrade kit and repurpose the old mainboard as a home server or should I sell my current FW13 and buy the new DIY Pro edition?
Battery life is the big complaint I have with my current Framework, so Im glad to hear it.
I wish they sell it in Thailand. I went to their booth at Computex two years ago, and the answer I got was "you have to get it here while you're in Taiwan". Which is probably not an easy option - they are not selling in retailers and online ordering might not arrive until you've left. I heard that they also actively banning re-shipper and the use of credit cards from other countries (your order may get canceled, or if you admit that you did those your forum account banned and warranty void).
The only asian countries that Framework ships to are Taiwan, Singapore.
I'm so into this. I don't need a new laptop though... so I guess I'll just have to drop my current laptop in the bathtub /s
Seems like a really solid upgrade. Interested in seeing reviews of it in the near future. I'm sorta in the market for a new laptop. I have a desktop and used to have a 16in M1 MacBook Pro but I recently lent that to my mother and she's keeping it. My desktop is powerful to do anything I need but I miss having a laptop for couch and on-the-go computing. I partially replaced the couch computing with using a different browser on my work laptop but it was very limiting and new corporate policies as of today are further restricting personal use.
I'm very much spoiled by my MacBook so I was thinking of picking up a refurbed one though the Framework is also on my radar. I miss having a Mac since it integrated nicely with my other Apple products (vendor lock-in woohoo!), I genuinely enjoy and kinda prefer macOS nowadays, and the hardware was genuinely a good value for its price. The Framework 13 Pro basically matches the 14in M5 MacBook Pro on price and scales in a fairly similar manner too so the choice isn't as clearcut for me.
Ya that's not clear cut.
For me the vendor lock in with apple got to be too much and I switched to Linux where I can, started with MacOS when I have to, and grapheneOS for my phone. So I'd go with the framework and run Linux and have the repairable platform.
If you're looking at Mac vs the FW running windows... the framework is way more repairable and has those swappable dongle things vs apple with a (probably) smaller device that integrates your stuff.
Forget both of those options though. Go full linux; grow a neckbeard and buy a used thinkpad.
I don't mind the vendor lock-in too much just yet, things work great but we'll see how that holds up in the future. I genuinely appreciate the notification sync between iPhone/Mac, having my messages be easily accessible on my computer, screen mirroring, and smaller features like having MFA codes that come to my phone automatically be available on my computer. I know that KDE Connect enables most of the same with Linux but it's always been super flakey for me. I'll have to put overall repairability to the test soon as my iPhone's battery health is currently in the low 80s percent-wise and due to be replaced once it drops below 80. I've had good experiences with repairs from Apple in the past, though I've also heard plenty of horror stories lol.
I actually did try a used Thinkpad with Linux for the last 3-4 months, my family had a T490s just collecting dust so I dusted it off and installed Ubuntu. Overall, the experience wasn't too bad but the touchpad and speakers really hurt the experience for me. The touchpad would always lag a heartbeat or two behind my fingers and gestures would take a few hundred milliseconds for the system to recognize I was trying to use a gesture. I get that Linux power users never leave the keyboard but I'm a casual user and I prefer poking around with the trackpad using gestures. The speakers were genuinely terrible though, it hurt to actually listen to anything. I think these are more issues with the Thinkpad rather than Linux though which is why I'm considering the Framework to begin with.
I've already switched my desktop to Linux and have been Windows-free for a few years now thankfully. Windows 11 is somehow worse than both macOS and Linux distros to me.
See... I can't stand extra notifications on my computer and my phone mostly lives on do not disturb mode now. I tried KDE Connect and didn't like the additional stuff on my computer, and its not amazing like you said.
ONE OF US!
The touchpad is just never as good :-( and I never listen to anything on my thinkpad because its too terrible. Maybe look into some reviews on the framework trackpad on linux before buying (if you go that route) because a LOT of how well the trackpad works seems to be software.
Yeah matching the Mac trackpad is a difficult task but if they get like 90% of the way there, that'd be good enough for me to be honest. I just want reliable trackpad gestures and I think Wayland has unlocked that for the most part. I just need to see if gesture detection has improved. I'm not in a rush to get a computer so I'll definitely be waiting for reviews!