There was a lot of interest in a Retro Video Game Club. I'm thinking it would be cool to get it off the ground!

Use this topic as brainstorming/planning for how we think it should run.

1. We need a facilitator/emcee.

• Is anyone interested in stepping up and running this?

2. We need to figure out logistics.

• Schedule
• Game selection process
• Parameters on what counts as "retro" (if necessary)
• Maybe a name for the club?

3. Anything else?

• Is there anything else we need to consider?

Introducing: Colossal Game Adventure

Colossal Game Adventure is Tildes' brand new retro video game club.

Each month we will play a different retro game/games, discuss our thoughts, and bask in the glorious digital experiences of yesteryear!

Colossal Game Adventure is a reference to Colossal Cave Adventure. It's one of the most influential games of all time, one of the first text-based interactive games, and one of the first games to be shared online.

What do we want to do with this group? Play influential games; interact with each other through text; and share the love for retro games online!

It also abbreviates to CGA (because we love chunky pixel art), and its name communicates the Colossal amount of fun and excitement that we have with retro video Games in our shared Adventure of playing them together.

Nominations

In this topic we will be gathering nominations for games to be played.

If you're looking for ideas:

• This Wikipedia list of "games considered the best" is a great place to start.
• RacketBoy has "hidden gem" lists for many retro systems.

Importantly, not all games for CGA have to be "significant" games. Zany, offbeat, and experimental games are welcome too. Anything you think might make for good discussions.

We will also have some "Arcade Special" months where we play several smaller/shorter games together in one batch (e.g. Pac-Man, Frogger, and Galaga). If you're not sure how big/long a game is, HowLongToBeat can help.

Single Game Nomination Rules

• Choose any game you feel is "retro" -- there is no hard and fast rule on what does or doesn't count
• Maximum of TWO game nominations per person
• Link to the game(s) on MobyGames

"Arcade Special" Nomination Rules

An "Arcade Special" is a batch of games that you feel could be played together in the same month.

(They do not have to be proper arcade games and can be from any system or genre.)

You might choose them because they're shorter or don't have as much staying power. You also might choose them based on a theme, series, or franchise. You also might do a completely random grab bag! There's no wrong way to make an Arcade Special (except for choosing games that are too big to fit in a month together).

• 2-5 games per Arcade Special
• Maximum of ONE Arcade Special nomination per person
• Link to the games on MobyGames

So, one person can nominate up to TWO single games and ONE arcade special (of up to five games).

Optional Extras

None of the following are required, but they make things more interesting:

• Explain why you're interested in nominating the games
• Explain why you think they'd be a good choice for the group
• If the game has multiple releases or multiple platforms, you can choose to specify which release/platform to target if you feel it's important. (Note: participants are still free to play whichever version they want.)
• For Arcade Specials: list why you think the games would be a good candidate to be played together.
• For Arcade Specials: give the batch its own cool name!

Next Steps

Nominations will be open for 48 hours from the time of this posting.

The voting topic will open on August 29.

Once the voting is over, we will post the schedule for the next six months and start our first official month on September 1st.

Notifications

If you want to be added to the notification list for our Colossal Game Adventure, simply comment in this topic. I will add all commenters here to the list unless they explicitly mention otherwise.

IMPORTANT

We now have a splash screen. (Thanks @Boojum!)

ALSO IMPORTANT

Please read all directions for submitting a proper ballot.

Any improper ballots will NOT be counted, but you will get a polite message from me before the count asking you to fix them. XD

• All ballots must be top-level comments.
• All top-level comments should be ballots ONLY.

I will be using the Collapse Replies button to tally votes, so any ballots not in top-level comments will not be counted.

After you submit your ballot, you can respond to your own post in a new comment to lobby for your choices (which is optional but highly recommended). It's completely fine to have conversations downthread from the ballots, but please make sure that the top-level remains clean.

Submitting Your Ballot

• Each person has 20 votes to distribute among games they see fit.

• Each person can allocate a maximum of 5 points per Single Game/Arcade Special.

• Arcade Specials count as one block (do not vote for each game in them individually).

• Votes should be listed as NAME (VOTES) -- e.g. Pong (3)

• Voting closes 48 hours from the posting of this topic.

Please ensure your titles match mine exactly (copy/paste highly recommended). I will be using CTRL+F to tally votes u/Spore_Prince has written a program to tally the votes, so any different spellings will not being counted. See examples below, as well as my actual ballot in the topic.

Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing (5)
Portal 3 (5)
Half-Life 3 (3)
Team Fortress 3 (2)
Night Trap (2)
Xexyz (1)
Zelda: The Wand of Gamelon (1)
Left 4 Dead 3 (1)

Big Rigs: Over the Road Racing (10)
Protal 3 (7)
Wand of Gamelon (5)

Voting Outcomes

• The top 6 games/Arcade Specials will become the next 6 months of CGA.
• Of the remaining games, the bottom 50% will be cut from the list.
• The remaining 50% will stay on the list and will enter the next voting round starting at their current point totals instead of 0.
• The next round of nominations will happen in 6 months, and participants will be limited to nominating 1 new game OR 1 new Arcade Special.

Nominees

Arcade Specials

I had an idea for a game some weeks ago, just as the title says. It would be something like Crusader Kings, it's all about dinasties and roleplay, but set in more modern eras, from the beginning of the industrial revolution until today, or maybe the future, we'll see. And instead of kingdoms, it's all about businesses. It's all about owning global company empires. Being a kind hearted local chain owner, or a sociopathic cutthroat in the 1% that owns the world. Up to you.

And this idea is still stuck with me, and I wanted to get back into game development, so I might as well just try it for fun and see what happens.

I picked Godot, 1) because it's open source, 2) it's going to be fun to see how much it developed in the last decade and 3) it's free, and especially 4) I don't want to use commercial engines and risk being affected by something similar to the runtime fee fiasco

I still have to finish some tutorials and make some simple games to get a grip on the engine and see how everything works, but as a data analyst I already have programming foundations and, I think, this project is monumental for someone like me, but I also think it's doable.

I have a very rough idea of how the code will work for the AI. It will incorporate "ticks" like CK, each tick being a day, and some events fire weekly or monthly, where based on the stats and traits, each individual character will calculate how likely they are to accept or reject that event. This event can be about buying shares, accepting proposal marriages, going on a trip, etc.

My main worry here is if GDScript is good enough to handle "intensive" algorithms. If not, I can always use C#, or C++ if I really have to, and adapt the problematic algorithms.

Another is what would be the best database manager for this, but I'll cross that bridge when I get there.

As for the world, initially I was thinking about being about the real one, but I realized that I may not want to deal with... Well, accuracies. For example, I don't want these businesses to exist in a vacuum, I'm going to try to make a system that interacts both the world's political events and these businesses. I want to create events, like, a country invades another, which creates demands for weapons, and if you own a weapon factory, good news for you! If you own businesses in the invaded country, well, sucks to be you.

So, I want to do those kind of events, but without needing to worry about things like "Portugal would never invade Japan. What is your AI thinking!?" or "Why is Greece an industrial power house?". If a big studio like Paradox has trouble fine tuning their hundreds of nations in their games, me by my alonesome certainly will not be able to do it.

So I'm thinking just making a fictional world, populated by several countries and empires but not as many as the real world. This way I can fine tune it to my liking and without worrying about being accurate with the real world. This is another challenge by itself, with its own cliffs, but it's more doable.

And so far, that's it. After I'm done with the learning phase, I'm going to start a proper planning phase, lay down some key mechanics and develop a prototype.

I wrote this post as a way to put my thoughts down, double check with myself if the idea is good.

But also, to check with the tildes community if you have any inputs. It can be anything: ideas, suggestions, warnings, problems that you know that I'll face, etc. I'll appreciate anything that you can give me

Hi everyone,

I was never so lucky as a kid to have a gaming console (forbidden by my parents) so I could only be jealous of my school friends getting gameboys and super nintendos. But I’m an adult now, so I got myself a RG35XX H to try all these games out, and enjoying myself.

So I was thinking why not create something like a book club but for these old games? We’d play (and attempt to beat) one game per month or something along these lines and then discuss the game itself, the story, context around how and when it was made, etc.

I’m looking to share this hobby with others (as it is rather solitary otherwise), and create a social aspect around it.

What do you think? Would anyone be interested?

I'm attempting to change my phone habits and swap out some unhealthy ones (doomscrolling the news) with healthy ones (solving puzzles instead!).

I just set up the incredible RetroArch on my phone now that you can do that on iOS, and I even got a little controller for games that need it (I tried playing Tetris with touch controls, and it was like, 95% good, but missing a spin or move when things were getting tense was frustrating and took me out of it).

What I'm looking for are puzzle game recommendations up through the PlayStation/N64 era (including handhelds) that can run on my phone.

In particular I want to explore more "novel" puzzle game ideas -- ones that kind of take their own swing at things. For example, Intelligent Qube on the PlayStation is one of my favorite games of all time, in part because I've never played anything like it in the nearly 30 years since its release.

That said, I'm also open to just regular old "pure" puzzler games. The first game I set up (and have been thoroughly enjoying) on RetroArch is Picross 3D on the DS. I love games like this that are just lists of puzzles and I can play one or two of them rather than, you know, doomscrolling.

Any recommendations you can give are appreciated!

Hey all,

I just recently got a Switch 2, and am looking for some games to play on it. I currently have Mario Kart World (and have been enjoying it), but nothing else.

I have not owned a Switch before, so if there are good switch games that work on the switch 2 I would appreciate those recommendations as well.

Looking primarily for single-player & local 2-player games. No real genres I dislike, except I don’t play a lot of horror games. I have played a bit of splatoon on a friends switch, and that wasn’t my cup of tea.

I do have a PC and have played a lot of games there (like Cyberpunk, Elden Ring, Tunic, Hollow Knight, etc), so mainly looking for games that are console-exclusive, or that might’ve slipped by my radar.

The concept of achievements in games has existed for quite a while now. According to Wikipedia's article on video game achievements, they were first programmed into some games in the 90s, and perhaps first made it big with the Xbox 360 in 2005. Steam achievements shortly followed in 2007.

Some of them are very easy - "Complete the tutorial" is a comment achievement. Some of them are silly - "Pet all the dogs in the game" has become a bit of a meme. But some require an incredible amount of patience, luck, and/or skill.

What are some achievements that you or others you know have put time into that felt significant? Or perhaps even ones that stand out for being a clever addition by the game developers.

What are some newer obscure titles that you would personally recommend?

Let's say something from a five years ago and that is really unlikely to be known by somone else unless you told them about it. But it really is not that important.

I am looking for some small studio or personnal project that manages to take whatever it is based around and create an entertaining experience.

Also I am posting this as hopefully a way to surface smaller titles that someone considers good.

Do you base it solely on age? On the year/console of release? Graphical style? Vibes? Divination?

Additionally: based on your criteria, what are some complicated edge cases?

For example: is DOOM 3 "retro" because it's over 20 years old and its series was rebooted, or is it modern because it's got nice 3D graphics and lighting and whatnot? Is Crow Country retro even though it came out last year?

The point of this isn't to find the hard line of what is/isn't retro -- it's to play around in the gray areas for what "retro" potentially does or doesn't describe.

Maybe you spoiled the story.

Maybe you min-maxed the fun out of it.

Maybe you played it SO much that eventually its tiny little flaws were all you could see.

Maybe you spent so much time excitedly modding it that, when it came time to finally play it, the fire was out.

Whatever the reason: what was the game, and how did you ruin it for yourself?

There's some moral issues about big publishers' business practices. Somehow, almost all racing games for example are EA. Like it's actually crazy lol - so despite wanting to play them, we do not wish to do that. Similarly, a lot of other co-op games are Ubisoft.

So looking for recommendations! Almost any genre and type are appreciated - only exception is games with pixel graphics (just really unpleasant to look at for me).

I sometimes feel like I am the only person who loses interest in a video game as soon as I have to spend any amount of time consulting an online guide or wiki to figure out how to progress.

Maybe it’s because I grew up playing games like Super Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time, along with their equivalents and sequels on the Gamecube, and later the Wii. I got either to 100% completion or close to on those, without getting any outside help.

The games themselves made it very clear what the objectives were and what collectibles and unlockables were available.

But at some point in recent years, it just became impossible to play a video game without having to consult a guide or a wiki to figure out not just how to progress in it, but sometimes even how to play it. 💀

And a good year ago or so, I began to subconsciously fight against this, because it annoyed me to no end. I began to just take breaks from a game if I couldn’t figure out how to progress, rather than go online and read some guide or wiki, because it was making me feel like I was wasting my time reading about the game, rather than just playing it, taking me out of the immersion in the process.

You know what? I’m making this a resolution. If I can’t figure out how to progress in a game on my own, then I just won’t. I’ll go play something else.

I have recently played some indie games where I needed zero assistance, and boy did it feel good to figure those games out on my own. Those are the best games (for me), games that “explain themselves”.

Anyone else feel similarly?

Tangentially related side note: I hate, hate, hate “Fandom” wikis. They’re probably a big part of the reason why I began to hate consulting online guides. They’re impossible to navigate, are riddled with ads, and link to unrelated content, everywhere on their pages. There is a good alternative to these for some Nintendo franchises, which are independent wikis, in case anyone is as frustrated by the Fandom slop as I am.

The other day, I happened to stumble on a YouTube video where the creator explored the problem of “discoverability” of video games on platforms like app stores, Steam, and Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo’s shops. That’s something that has been bothering me for a long time about the Apple App Store.

By pure coincidence though, this morning, as I was browsing through the “You Might Also Like” section at the bottom of a game that I am interested in, I began to go down a rabbit hole where I ended up finding a good handful of games I had played on Steam that I wasn’t aware were available on iOS/iPadOS as well. It’s quite sad, because these are games that I really enjoyed, and I paid for them on Steam, a platform that Valve (understandingly) neglects on macOS, whereas I could have played them optimized for iOS/iPadOS.

The creator in the YouTube video didn’t really have a solution for this problem, and it seems to me that as the industry grows, and more and more “slop” begins to flood these platforms, it will only become harder and harder to discover the good indie games buried underneath it all.

I feel this intense urge inside me to start some kind of blog or website to provide short reviews so that at least some people will discover these games. We definitely need more human curation.

I’m also appalled that so many of these games on the Apple App Store have little to no ratings. No one makes an effort to leave behind a few words so that other people can get an idea of whether it’s worth to invest their money in a game.

I guess that there isn’t really anything that can be done about the issue of discoverability. As an indie developer and publisher, you just have to do the that best you can to market your game, and hope to redirect potential customers to your website or socials, where you should clearly list all the platforms that your game is available on (surprisingly, a lot of developers don’t do this). But that’s about all that you can do. The rest is luck.

I've been deep in learning how to rewire sections of my house, trying to understand the logic behind my older (1950s-era) electrical system. In the process, I came across a free game on Steam called Wired developed by the University of Cambridge's Engineering Department. It's a puzzle game that gradually introduces core concepts in circuitry and logical flow. It doesn't replace proper training, but it is an engaging supplement compared to reading electrical code books.

But anyways, I though I would ask about games that don't just entertain but also teach. Not strictly edutainment in the shallow sense, but games that impart understanding, intuition, or practical knowledge through their mechanics.

What are some games you've played that taught you something substantial? I'm thinking anything from real world skills, conceptual insights, functional knowledge, or anything that stuck with you after playing.

Inspired by my long-ago try at Witcher 3, during which I died in the tutorial by falling off a platform. Yeah, definitely one of the lamest deaths possible. Gotta wonder what the others present thought about the legendary Geralt of Rivia dying from a simple fall, like geez isn't this guy supposed to be a living legend who's faced giant monsters that could fell armies?? I'm pretty sure the tutorial was a dream of a memory so his death didn't matter, but since then I've wondered:

How screwed would various video game worlds be if the hero dies during the tutorial of all things?

Figured this might be a fun question to ponder since there's so many possibilities. So think of any game with a tutorial where you can die, and then think about the consequences! Maybe you did die, maybe you didn't or came close. And maybe those potential deaths were super lame and super anticlimactic, leaving the other characters to just stare blankly because this guy casually walked right off a cliff, as if expecting some invisible barrier to stop them.

It's just fun to think of how the rest of the cast moves on without the protagonist—you know, assuming they can actually survive the game's plot without you. Or maybe they'll actually be better off...

I was a fan of GameRevolution’s reviews for a long time. They always seemed to have a criteria to reviews that not only sold me on what to pursue, but what to truly avoid even if I loved the franchise. (MGS: Ground Zeros, I’m looking at you.) They have seemingly reduced to one reviewer…

I love the weekly Tildes thread of “what games are you playing” and it has truly opened my eyes to some games I would never have heard of, or even tried (Balatro).

Anywho the point of this is to ask where everyone else looks for reputable/intelligent reviews currently? I enjoy listening to Luke Stephens talk about the industry, but it’s not as concise as an A-F or star or 1-10 rating system. IGN doesn’t have my attention… I just don’t know where to turn, as there are so many options.

I just got back from the 'Nintendo Switch 2 Experience', so I though I'd share my thoughts on the console for those who didn't/won't get a chance to check it out.

The Console Itself - 8/10

The S2 is a decent amount larger than the original, which really helps with the ergonomics. Pretty much all the controls are bigger, and the rounder shape might alleviate fatigue when holding it (I never got to hold it for long, the demos were mostly on TVs). I think it looks a lot worse than the original, but that's neither here nor there. The pro controller was a huge upgrade from the (already great) original, super comfortable materials and nice buttons. The screen is not OLED, which I think is ridiculous for the price tag. It theoretically has HDR, but I could not tell. Overall, it's bigger and better, but nothing super special.

Nintendo Switch 2 Welcome Tour - 0/10

For the price of $10, Welcome Tour is a complete joke. There's absolutely nothing to say about it, it's basically an ad for hardware you'll already own. Should be free, don't buy it.

Donkey Kong Bananza - 5/10

This is the Mario Odyssey formula applied to Donkey Kong, you run around, collect bananas in some semi-open worlds. All the environments are destructible, which is super fun but adds one huge caveat: the game runs like shit. A nice 60fps when running around, but as soon as you try smashing stuff (the main gimmick of the game) the framerate jumps all over the place, and going to the world map tanks the fps to 20-30. I enjoyed surfing on chunks of the ground I pulled up, but I was constantly pulled out of the fun by performance hiccups. It looked about as good as Mario Odyssey (but at native 4k ~60pfs, of course).

Mario Kart World - 9/10

Okay, now I can start saying nice things! Mario Kart World is–as you might expect–awesome. It's a really fun twist on the formula that was perfected in 8 Deluxe. There's no more kart customisation, which I don't mind, but each kart looks really nice and detailed. I got a slight taste of free-roam mode before each knockout tour I played, and it was... fine? The open world looks great and plays well, but I'm curious to see how it's "gamified". The knockout tour was the main booth on the floor, with 24 people playing at once with the last placing racers getting eliminated at different checkpoints. It was chaos, but that classic Mario Kart chaos that works really well. I managed to come 2nd on my first race. It looks quite a lot better than 8 Deluxe, but that's mostly in the art style and animations.

Drag X Drive - 9/10

This is the gimmicky competitive game for this system (like Arms or Splatoon), showing off the mouse controls in the form of Wheelchair Basketball. I was super surprised by this game, the gimmick clicked with me instantly. I got dunked on like twice, but I also only had 5 minutes to prepare, so cut me some slack!

Metroid Prime 4: Beyond - 7/10

Again, the mouse controls work super well. It all felt pretty simple and intuitive, but that might be because I'm a PC player most of the time anyway. I don't know anything about the Metroid series, so I can't comment on the story or gameplay beyond that. It looked pretty good and ran at (I think) the full 120FPS the whole time.

Cyberpunk 2077 - 4/10

Cyberpunk was... rough. It had that classic "really really upscaled" look, and dipped down to 10fps a lot in combat. I tried both "performance" and "quality" mode, but both looked and played about the same (which might be a bug).

Breath of the Wild: Nintendo Switch 2 Edition - 2/10

I can't believe they're charging for this. It's literally just the original game running at 60fps with slightly better draw distances. You can get this look with CEMU. This is how I felt about all the "Nintendo Switch 2 Edition" games that I tried.

Conclusion

While the games were pretty good and the experience was nice, I don't think the console has justified itself costing as much as it does, and so I'm not going to buy it on launch. I'll probably pick it up used when there's a reliable jailbreak, but the preview event really dissolved any feelings of FOMO that I might have had about it, which I'm glad about because now I can save that $800! I hope there's still people playing Drag x Drive when I get to it in a few years.

Feel free to ask me any questions, and hopefully I can answer them.

Message for Deimos or anyone else on Tildes development

I'm putting this here after writing the rest of my post, but could we please get an "expand edit window" option, unless there is one and I'm blind? The preview window's great but the edit window's locked to 6 lines and I would appreciate some more since it would make editing a long post like this much easier. Thanks.

The actual post

There has been a lot of gaming buzz regarding extraction shooters as of late, with the closed alpha of Bungie's Marathon currently underway, the second tech test of Embark Studio's ARC Raiders starting just now, and the recent news of the cancellation of a Titanfall extraction shooter from EA/Respawn. As someone who's played and enjoyed extraction shooters before I've been following these and observing the discourse surrounding them (except the Titanfall one, I didn't even know that was a thing til the news of its cancellation) and I've been somewhat dismayed to see a lot of confusion, mixed messaging, and general disdain for the genre. So I've decided to put my own thoughts and definitions of it down here, and clear up the most common misconceptions or falsehoods I've seen repeated ad nauseam elsewhere.

A brief introduction to extraction shooters

First off, what IS an extraction shooter, what makes it different from other shooters, notably battle royales, and which games qualify as extraction shooters? An extraction shooter, as its core gameplay loop, is a shooter where you enter a map with loot and AI enemies scattered about, and the goal is to gather loot and extract from the map with it. However, you need to get out alive - should you die, you will lose everything (with some exceptions) in your inventory, including the gear you went in with. On top of that, the most popular and successful extraction shooters are PvEvP - you will be competing with other real players for loot, and taking loot off their bodies can be just as profitable if not more so than taking it from PvE enemies. It is optional though, and it is entirely viable to play as a "rat", sneaking around and gathering loot without drawing attention and extracting without anyone noticing.

Not a battle royale

Extraction shooters are also frequently confused with battle royales as both games have players inserted into a PvP map where they scavenge gear. However, the similarities more or less end there. With battle royales, you do not risk losing your items on death as all players are dropped in with nothing and don't have a stash to draw from or store items in, so any "loot" found is merely a means of securing victory for the current round. PvP is also mandatory, as the goal is not to get loot but to be the last team/person standing. To facilitate this in a timely manner, battle royales have a shrinking map mechanic that forces the remaining players into a smaller playable area as time goes on to force them into a confrontation. Extraction shooters do not force PvP or have shrinking maps but do have their own ways of drawing players towards each other, through loot-rich points of interest and extraction zones. Some parts of the map will have greater quality and/or quantity of loot, which will naturally draw players in, and there are a few designated areas where you can actually leave with your loot which will also increase your odds of encountering other players either trying to take your loot before you can leave, or trying to leave themselves. Because it is not forced though, PvP encounters are a much more unpredictable and organic experience in extraction shooters.

What extraction shooters are out there?

So which games count as extraction shooters? The current leaders in the genre, which also happen to be some of the longest-lasting ones, are Escape From Tarkov (EFT) and Hunt: Showdown. EFT is a rather hardcore modern military FPS with a heavy focus on realism - guns are extremely customizable, ammo types and armor can make a huge difference, bullets are extremely lethal even from AI enemies, and a good headshot will drop even the most geared and armored player so there's always risk. It has a cult following but its hardcore emphasis makes it unapproachable for most. It also has periodic progression wipes where players have to start over from scratch to keep things fresh and more fair for newcomers, but is a major turnoff for players that don't like to lose what they've earned. Hunt is an FPS set at the end of the 19th century with a bit of dark magic/voodoo theme. Guns are reflective of the times and rather limited in terms of rate of fire and reload speed, which results in more drawn-out firefights where every bullet counts. For each round, the focus isn't to get loot around the map but rather to track and hunt down a bounty boss monster, then extract with that bounty. These two games are what will come to mind first when extraction shooters are mentioned, EFT more so.

I won't go over cancelled (Titanfall), discontinued (The Cycle: Frontier), or side game-mode (The Division's dark zone/survival) extraction shooters here, which is basically almost all of them sadly, so I'll talk about the two biggest up-and-coming ones instead, Marathon and ARC Raiders.

Marathon and the surrounding controversy

Marathon is a sci-fi FPS that uses the lore of Bungie's Marathon trilogy from the 90's as its setting. You play as a "runner" in a robotic shell scavenging the remains of the colony on Tau Ceti IV for scrap to fulfill contracts for the megacorporations involved in the colony's development who now seek to find out what went wrong. It checks the usual boxes for an extraction shooter - you go in with your own loadout, scavenge at points of interest to fill your limited inventory, defeat PvE enemies and other runners for loot opportunities, and try to extract alive before time's up. There are a couple things of note that have resulted in mixed opinions:

• The art direction for runners, gear, and architecture is a sort of mass-produced, neon-colored, smoothed plastic, blocky style, which is a "love it or hate it" kind of thing.
• The gunplay is very similar to that of Destiny, Bungie's last game, which in my opinion is very solid. However, they did make the decision to have mouse magnetism enabled for PC (your cursor will magnetize to targets) to give it more parity with console players, and that has been very unpopular.
• The only queueing option is teams of 3 and the devs have stood their ground on not having a solo or duo player queue, which is a turn-off for players that prefer solo, or don't want to play with randoms and don't have 2 friends to play with.
• Players do not have full customization of their runners but must choose from 6 runner archetypes that have a set of abilities and a specific look, which can be partially changed with a skin. This is also largely unpopular, as Bungie's past titles have featured high levels of cosmetic customization and this feels largely restrictive and monetization-focused instead.
• There is no option for proximity voice chat, which the devs have said was excluded to protect players from toxicity. This has also proved to be very unpopular.
• It will have seasonal progression wipes which will reset faction reputation and clean out player vaults, which is unpopular among players that like to hoard their loot, especially many Destiny players.
• Supposedly there will be more "raid-like" PvE experiences on an as-of-yet unreleased map that takes place aboard the Marathon colony ship, but how mechanically complex those are or whether or not that will be enough to attract PvE-oriented players is pure speculation at this point.
• It will not be free-to-play, but rather released at a "premium" but not full game price point, which most people are assuming to be $40 USD.

The game is set to release in September this year, but based on the feedback Bungie is getting from players in this very first alpha, they will need to take this feedback very seriously and make a number of changes in the few months they have left, or risk a very rocky release and potentially financial failure. Many players seem to want Marathon and Bungie to fail, notably vitriolic Destiny veterans that feel like they were snubbed out of Destiny 3 for this, but as someone with over 2000 hours in Destiny 2 myself I want it to succeed, whether I play it or not. I'd rather there be more fun and successful games than major failures, and wishing for something to fail just because it isn't what you want is incredibly petty.

ARC Raiders, the underdog

ARC Raiders is a third person shooter set in a post-apocalypse where robots called ARC have devastated the surface of Earth and humanity has retreated underground, sending "raiders" to the surface to scavenge for tech and goods. It's developed by Embark Studios, which is made up of ex-DICE (Battlefield) developers, and their other title is the well-received but niche PvP shooter The Finals. Mechanics-wise, there isn't anything particularly unique about this extraction shooter - limited mobility, limited inventory space, PvE enemies, points of interest, extraction points, etc. However, it seems to check all the boxes of what players want and it does it well while making the experience more casual and accessible:

• There are "safe pockets" where players can store a few loot items they won't lose on death (Tarkov does also have this, Marathon and Hunt do not).
• There is proximity voice, and also a quick emote menu for giving vocal commands, directions, and responses.
• The art direction is realistic post-apocalypse with high graphical fidelity and semi-futuristic robots, which is "safe", but still good looking.
• The audio design is phenomenal. Distant gunfire, supersonic cracks of rounds, bullets ricocheting off surfaces, large bots stomping around from blocks away, player footsteps on different surfaces and within enclosed spaces, quadcopter drones buzzing, larger bots with unsettling and deep "roars", and more.
• There isn't a solo or duo-only queue, but there is solo-matching priority at least, so you're more likely to be placed with other solo players.
• There is a clear progression path in the form of a workshop you can upgrade with scavenged materials, and a deep skill tree with multiple branches.
• Raiders are not class or hero-based and are freely customizable by the players in terms of loadout and appearance.
• Chaff PvE enemies are relatively easy to defeat but still dangerous. Aside from eliminating them as threats, they can drop materials or items to recharge your shields so they're not just a waste of ammo. Non-chaff PvE enemies can be significantly more dangerous and harder to defeat but will have valuable loot.
• There is already an example of a PvE "boss" robot guarding a point of interest which requires some mechanics to collect the loot within it. The boss itself is very challenging to defeat, even with multiple teams fighting it, but should reward top-tier loot.
• While the game was initially announced as free-to-play, the devs have since switched to selling it at at $40 USD.
• There are "battle passes" in the game in the form of shops players can unlock using a currency that is earnable in-game, or purchased with real money (like warbonds from Helldivers 2 for any helldivers reading this).

Overall, the game is shaping up to be a more accessible extraction shooter for the wider gaming audience and very serious competition for Marathon. No official release date has been announced but they are planning on releasing some time this year.

The stigma around extraction shooters

I've mentioned various things about extraction shooters that may be contributing to their unpopularity amongst the wider gaming audience throughout the post, but for the sake of cohesiveness and for all the folks that just want a TL;DR, I will collate and expand on those ideas here:

• Confusion with battle royales - I've seen some people confuse extraction shooters with battle royales and say "the market is oversaturated with extraction shooters, dead trend chasing game" or something along those lines. It's hard to call a market oversaturated when there's only 2 successful and very niche games in it, but if you incorrectly lump all the battle royales in that makes more sense.

• Escape From Tarkov is a bad poster child - When people do think of extraction shooters (and not mistakenly battle royales), they will default to EFT, which is notoriously hardcore and "sweaty". It would be the same as never having played an RPG, and being introduced to it with Dark Souls, which would understandably turn away anyone that isn't looking for that kind of experience.

• PvP and losing progress - The game always having a PvP element is already discouraging to PvE-focused players, and this is only made worse by the chance to lose your gear if you die. Many players are strongly opposed to losing progress, and losing multiple times in a row due to other players defeating them when they just want to do PvE and get some loot is an awful experience that they don't have to have in a different type of game.

• Progression wipes are anathema to hoarders - On top of potentially losing progress on a round-to-round basis, seasonal progression wipes also threaten to reset progress entirely between seasons, While they are effective at keeping things fresh, players that like to have 400+ items stored away in their vault that they will never use and just admire from time to time revile this concept. Less hoard-minded players may be concerned about their potential inability to max out their progression, the fear of missing out induced by temporary progression, or the pointlessness of even progressing if it gets wiped anyway.

I didn't read any of that, are extraction shooters for me or not?

Well, that depends. If you:

• Don't mind or enjoy a mixed PvEvP experience
• Are ok with the idea of loot and progression being temporary
• Like the higher stakes of potentially losing your inventory and gear, or taking someone else's
• Are ok with inventory management, even in the middle of a round
• Are not terrible at shooters

Then yes, extraction shooters may be fun for you! They certainly aren't for everyone, and there's nothing wrong with not enjoying one or the genre in general, but if you do, they offer a very unique gaming experience. If you are interested, keep an eye on ARC Raiders and Marathon - they aim to be more accessible than previous extraction shooters and it's a lot easier to get in on a new game than join one with a veteran playerbase.