28 votes

Sleep discipline

I have trouble setting a time to sleep and following through on it, and it's made my life needlessly worse. I find it especially difficult when I've had a really productive or busy day. I've tried setting a schedule on my phone that turns off certain apps past a certain time, but I keep manually turning it off. Any tips?

25 comments

  1. [3]
    chundissimo
    Link
    The biggest thing that has helped my sleep is reading every night before bed, no compromises. Even if it’s just for two minutes, or up to an hour. It helps my brain unwind and naturally drift...

    The biggest thing that has helped my sleep is reading every night before bed, no compromises. Even if it’s just for two minutes, or up to an hour. It helps my brain unwind and naturally drift towards sleep. Having a kindle has helped me with this too so I can have the lights pretty dim or even completely off while I read. I used to take melatonin every night, but now I’ve been able to stop doing that

    18 votes
    1. [2]
      sparkle
      Link Parent
      I will second reading. I used to just kinda doom scroll reddit before bed until I got bored enough to try and maybe sleep. It was not a very useful system. After quitting reddit due to the API...

      I will second reading. I used to just kinda doom scroll reddit before bed until I got bored enough to try and maybe sleep. It was not a very useful system. After quitting reddit due to the API fiasco, I picked up reading in bed. Almost always I am asleep within 20-30 minutes. I'm also using a Kindle Paperwhite which is fantastic for night time reading!

      The only problem is now I've somewhat Pavloved myself into thinking that reading=sleeping... But then again not always a bad thing since naps are quite nice

      7 votes
      1. chundissimo
        Link Parent
        Count your blessings! Some of us are fully incapable of naps :(

        Count your blessings! Some of us are fully incapable of naps :(

        5 votes
  2. [2]
    snake_case
    Link
    I make bed time a thing that I want to do by having a strict routine that involves something I really like doing, and ends with falling asleep in bed. First shower Brush teeth Get in bed Nature...

    I make bed time a thing that I want to do by having a strict routine that involves something I really like doing, and ends with falling asleep in bed.

    First shower
    Brush teeth
    Get in bed
    Nature documentaries (the thing I want to do)

    I cannot watch the nature documentaries without doing all the tasks first, it is the rules, so I’m motivated to do the self care tasks so I can do the thing I want to do.

    15 votes
    1. [2]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. DisasterlyDisco
        Link Parent
        That sounds fascinating! Falling asleep to that would be nice, but actually staying awake through seems just as appealing; if there is a way you could make it available, I'd be happy to avail...

        That sounds fascinating! Falling asleep to that would be nice, but actually staying awake through seems just as appealing; if there is a way you could make it available, I'd be happy to avail myself of ot!

        3 votes
  3. irren_echo
    Link
    One thing that has helped me with (some) good-habit discipline is note taking/record keeping. Ex: Monday: productive day (details if desired) Sleep at 1 am Tuesday: hard day (details) sleep at 11...

    One thing that has helped me with (some) good-habit discipline is note taking/record keeping. Ex:

    Monday: productive day (details if desired)
    Sleep at 1 am
    Tuesday: hard day (details) sleep at 11 pm
    Wednesday: mid-range day sleep at 12 am

    I like to color code it, or have a 1-10 scale of bad to good or something that I can glance at and take in quickly and notice patterns with. So if I have a lot of red (bad) days and they correspond to a lot of red (late) bedtimes, it helps me "connect" to those things in a way that's more meaningful to me. It helps because I have terrible emotional permanence (I feel like there's a better qualifier than "emotional" for this, but that's the easily-searchable phrase for "intellectually I remember that thing was a thing, but it's almost like it happened to someone else and has no bearing on current situation." No idea if this is the issue for you, but I figured it was worth mentioning because it's not a typical response to a question like this.

    Also worth mentioning is: don't be too hard on yourself about good-habit-forming. Missed a few days of recording? That's ok, you're doing it now. Went to bed 10 minutes earlier than yesterday? Great! 10 minutes later? That's ok too, better than 20 minutes later, etc.

    Figuring out exactly why you're struggling also helps. Are you dreading the next day? Enjoying activity too much? Too warm/cold/uncomfortable to sleep? You get the idea.

    11 votes
  4. [9]
    smithsonian
    Link
    Do you have a strict wake-up time? If not, then it will always be a fight to go to bed at a consistent time. What helped me more than any alarm clock (or combination of clocks) was putting bedroom...

    Do you have a strict wake-up time? If not, then it will always be a fight to go to bed at a consistent time.

    What helped me more than any alarm clock (or combination of clocks) was putting bedroom lights on a timer to turn on 30 minutes before my alarm. With smart bulbs, you can have them gradually get brighter and simulate sunrise, which will naturally cause you to go into lighter stages of sleep and wake up.

    Just make sure you continue this even on the weekends, and that you don't turn the lights off and go back to sleep; starting the day with less than a full charge is what will make getting to bed at your target time easier.

    Once you're waking up at the same time consistently, it will be significantly easier to go to bed consistently.

    7 votes
    1. [7]
      first-must-burn
      Link Parent
      They are a bit spendy (I don't know what the cost/complexity of programming smart lights is), but Phillips makes an alarm clock that has a light that gradually turns on. My wife has one and it's...

      They are a bit spendy (I don't know what the cost/complexity of programming smart lights is), but Phillips makes an alarm clock that has a light that gradually turns on. My wife has one and it's quite nice to wake up to.

      3 votes
      1. [5]
        krellor
        Link Parent
        There are cheaper versions as well. I have those and I'm addition to slowly lighting up, you can have them slowly dim to off at bed. Honestly, the main selling point for me is an alarm that isn't...

        There are cheaper versions as well. I have those and I'm addition to slowly lighting up, you can have them slowly dim to off at bed. Honestly, the main selling point for me is an alarm that isn't panic inducing as I'm already a light sleeper. The light dims on slightly and I get up without any noise needed.

        4 votes
        1. [4]
          cfabbro
          (edited )
          Link Parent
          You can also DIY something for pretty cheap too. E.g. I used an old 10k lumen light therapy lamp that I had lying around, pointed it directly at my bed, and hooked it up to a smart plug. Then I...

          You can also DIY something for pretty cheap too.

          E.g. I used an old 10k lumen light therapy lamp that I had lying around, pointed it directly at my bed, and hooked it up to a smart plug. Then I set up an Alexa routine to turn it on at 8am every single day, and blast me with the light to force me to get up. It was pretty harsh, but I absolutely needed it because I could sleep through most anything else, even multiple alarms going off.

          That setup worked great for finally fixing my super inconsistent sleep schedule though. And after about a year of using it I haven't had to use it again since now my sleep schedule is set in stone and I naturally wake up at around 8am no matter when I go to bed. And if @thearctic is like me, they may need that level of harshness too, to finally force their wake schedule to become consistent.

          3 votes
          1. [3]
            krellor
            Link Parent
            That's funny, and I'm glad it helped your schedule! Personally I'd be looking at that smart bulb slowly dims on option in Alexa routines, but it sounds like you needed the "stabbing dagger of...

            That's funny, and I'm glad it helped your schedule! Personally I'd be looking at that smart bulb slowly dims on option in Alexa routines, but it sounds like you needed the "stabbing dagger of sunlight slays the vampire" approach.

            3 votes
            1. [2]
              cfabbro
              (edited )
              Link Parent
              When my nephew was little he once very seriously asked my sister if I was a vampire because I slept so much during the day. So that's actually a remarkably apt description. :P

              When my nephew was little he once very seriously asked my sister if I was a vampire because I slept so much during the day. So that's actually a remarkably apt description. :P

              3 votes
              1. krellor
                Link Parent
                I raised my kid brother and remember him holding his fingers in a cross and extending his hand at a teacher saying "back evil demon, back." That got me a look. Kids say the darndest things...

                I raised my kid brother and remember him holding his fingers in a cross and extending his hand at a teacher saying "back evil demon, back." That got me a look. Kids say the darndest things...

                1 vote
      2. artvandelay
        Link Parent
        I recreated crudely this as a college student with a dimmable light bulb with adjustable white colors. Didn't really do any research but I'd have it start to shine light ~15-30 minutes before my...

        I recreated crudely this as a college student with a dimmable light bulb with adjustable white colors. Didn't really do any research but I'd have it start to shine light ~15-30 minutes before my alarm went off and it'd increase in brightness every 5 minutes. Worked well enough for me back then

        3 votes
    2. patience_limited
      Link Parent
      Agreed that it's much easier to arrive at a consistent sleep time if you have a consistent awakening time. The sunrise light is my life hack for traveling across time zones. I carry a cheap...

      Agreed that it's much easier to arrive at a consistent sleep time if you have a consistent awakening time.

      The sunrise light is my life hack for traveling across time zones. I carry a cheap Bluetooth smart light bulb with me, and keep the "sunrise light" schedule fixed to my home time zone. Yes, it may be a 3 a.m. PST wakeup, but it means I can avoid a couple of weeks of miserable 6 a.m. awakenings when I get home.

      You can also reset your sleep schedule by staying awake all night then going to sleep the next day at the time you want to embed in your life. It's miserable, but I just did that via a red-eye flight and I'm back to my usual sleep/wake times.

      3 votes
  5. [3]
    CannibalisticApple
    Link
    A gamified sleep tracker might help. I'm currently struggling to fix my own sleep schedule because I am quasi-nocturnal and tend to fall asleep after 4 am. One thing that's currently helping me is...

    A gamified sleep tracker might help. I'm currently struggling to fix my own sleep schedule because I am quasi-nocturnal and tend to fall asleep after 4 am. One thing that's currently helping me is using Pokémon Sleep because the day rolls over at 4 in that app, so I have incentive to start tracking sleep due to the game aspects...

    And more importantly, my phone does not like me opening other apps while Pokémon Sleep runs. Switching to another app runs the risk of it crashing. And given my sleep schedule is currently right at the rollover point, I'd have to start a new session on the new day which is bad from the game perspective. So once I start sleep tracking, I try to avoid switching to other apps.

    I don't know if all sleep trackers act like that, or if this behavior is unique to my phone. But at bare minimum, the game aspect does give me incentive to try to go to bed, so that might help you too.

    I have some other tips that might help, but it depends. What exactly are you doing on your phone? Do you just compulsively check apps? If so, which apps and why? Or is it your brain refusing to shut up and your mind is too awake? Do you have a blue light filter on your phone?

    3 votes
    1. [2]
      thearctic
      Link Parent
      Hard to say why I do this. When I actually go to sleep, I don't generally have trouble falling or staying asleep. On my phone, I usually watch a bunch of youtube. I use a blue light filter. Maybe...

      Hard to say why I do this. When I actually go to sleep, I don't generally have trouble falling or staying asleep. On my phone, I usually watch a bunch of youtube. I use a blue light filter. Maybe I'm a bit more nocturnal, but I'm guessing not since I don't sleep well through daylight.

      3 votes
      1. CannibalisticApple
        Link Parent
        One thing that might help then: avoid using your phone in bed. Ideally you should only be in your bed to sleep, so your brain associates the bed with sleep on a subconscious level. Doing other...

        One thing that might help then: avoid using your phone in bed. Ideally you should only be in your bed to sleep, so your brain associates the bed with sleep on a subconscious level. Doing other stuff in your bed messes with that, and phones are especially bad since you need to actively interact with them which stimulates the brain. So even without using a phone, you can end up feeling restless.

        This is easier said than done, but worth a shot.

        2 votes
  6. chocobean
    Link
    Do you have a hang out and chill couch? One idea is you can use your phone there, but not in the bedroom. Bed is for sleep only and has no charger near it = need to plug in out of reach.

    Do you have a hang out and chill couch? One idea is you can use your phone there, but not in the bedroom. Bed is for sleep only and has no charger near it = need to plug in out of reach.

    3 votes
  7. cloud_loud
    Link
    Perhaps not exactly what you’re looking for: hydroxizine and melatonin. The former makes you drowsy and the latter should help you stay asleep. Probably the easiest way to force yourself to go to...

    Perhaps not exactly what you’re looking for: hydroxizine and melatonin. The former makes you drowsy and the latter should help you stay asleep. Probably the easiest way to force yourself to go to sleep earlier. I personally don’t wake up groggy but your mileage may vary.

    3 votes
  8. d32
    Link
    Just don't take the phone (or any computer) to the bedroom, ever. Define a strict time when you put it down in another room and stick to it. Use the bedroom for sleeping exclusively with the...

    Just don't take the phone (or any computer) to the bedroom, ever. Define a strict time when you put it down in another room and stick to it. Use the bedroom for sleeping exclusively with the sprinkle of occasional sex or reading if that's your thing.

    1 vote
  9. atoxje
    Link
    I wear a whoop tracker and it helped me with my sleep anxiety by illustrating how sleeping long doesn’t necessarily mean sleeping well. So I have some 5 hour nights after which I feel well rested...

    I wear a whoop tracker and it helped me with my sleep anxiety by illustrating how sleeping long doesn’t necessarily mean sleeping well. So I have some 5 hour nights after which I feel well rested (and have great HR, HRV and breathing stats) and I can have 9 hour nights after which I feel awful and have bad stats.

    It made me a lot less anxious about getting enough hours, which makes me feel more relaxed about sleep and helps me sleep better.

    1 vote
  10. [3]
    tomf
    Link
    Try this out for a few nights set an alarm for 1hr before you want to sleep eat a piece of cheese, wash your face, brush your teeth etc a little box breathing is great here -- in through your nose...

    Try this out for a few nights

    1. set an alarm for 1hr before you want to sleep
    2. eat a piece of cheese, wash your face, brush your teeth etc
    3. a little box breathing is great here -- in through your nose for a four count, hold for seven, exhale through your mouth with a whooooosh for eight. do this a dozen times until you feel comfortable with it. I do this sitting up in bed, but you can lay down if that is more comfortable. focus on the breath more than the timing.
    4. in bed, no screens at all. Lay flat with your arms at your sides:
    • close eyes but look to your toes
    • visualize yourself going somewhere you know well -- like the mall. follow your typical route into the space to an escalator
    • in your mind, talk yourself through the steps to get there... 'park on the third floor, enter the mall, pass the photobooth...' -- truly boring stuff
    • once at the escalator, count your way up from 1 - 20
    • at the top, walk around to the escalator going down and go from 20 - 1

    you can modify this and also use the second part to start yourself into a lucid dreaming state if you want to go down that path. I've done a version of this almost my entire life. I don't often do the second half, but the box breathing alone is typically enough to bring me to a state resembling death.

    1 vote
    1. [2]
      LumaBop
      Link Parent
      Fascinating - how do you modify this for lucid dreaming?

      Fascinating - how do you modify this for lucid dreaming?

      2 votes
      1. tomf
        Link Parent
        I've only messed with lucid dreaming a bit, but my method was to tap my middle finger against my leg and repeat aloud, 'Tonight, I will realize I am dreaming.' I would do this before the escalator...

        I've only messed with lucid dreaming a bit, but my method was to tap my middle finger against my leg and repeat aloud, 'Tonight, I will realize I am dreaming.' I would do this before the escalator and maybe even during the ride up and down... every second step or so.

        This worked for me, but I didn't have total control in the dream -- but I was definitely in control for the most part, if that makes sense.

        1 vote