I honestly wish they had a third group who had to drink decaf (basically give them the illusion they were drinking coffee, but with none of the caffeine), so they could see which effects were...
I honestly wish they had a third group who had to drink decaf (basically give them the illusion they were drinking coffee, but with none of the caffeine), so they could see which effects were truly placebo.
I'd also assume there are other substances in coffee besides caffeine that could have an impact on alertness and focus, though. Maybe trying one of those cereal-based drinks that looks like coffee? That doesn't taste the same tho.
It depends. I'm extremely sensitive to caffeine due to medication and mental health. And even decaf makes me jittery. I can't even drink soda without it keeping me up half the night. Which isn't...
It depends. I'm extremely sensitive to caffeine due to medication and mental health. And even decaf makes me jittery.
I can't even drink soda without it keeping me up half the night. Which isn't too bad of a problem to have.
I agree with you about 99.99% of the time. Because I absolutely love coffee. I've been drinking it for years. And I just love it. But I just can't drink it anymore. Decaf is ok. But I haven't...
I agree with you about 99.99% of the time. Because I absolutely love coffee. I've been drinking it for years. And I just love it. But I just can't drink it anymore. Decaf is ok. But I haven't found one I loved as much as the coffee I had before my sensitivity. But yeah one less thing to be addicted to is absolutely a great thing.
And it's the same thing with alcohol. I had a drinking problem before and the sensitivity has really helped me stop. A single beer makes me just feel uncomfortable. Not relaxed like it used to.
I don't know if it's available where you are but Lavazza has a whole bean decaf that really scratched the itch for me (switched due to blood pressure). Fair warning, though, it's not cheap. But as...
I don't know if it's available where you are but Lavazza has a whole bean decaf that really scratched the itch for me (switched due to blood pressure). Fair warning, though, it's not cheap. But as you seem unable to drink a lot anyway that's maybe not that important to you.
Thank you for the recommendation! I've seen ads for that brand before. But didn't think twice about it. I will absolutely check my store next time I'm there.
Thank you for the recommendation! I've seen ads for that brand before. But didn't think twice about it. I will absolutely check my store next time I'm there.
I don’t know where your caffeine intolerance comes from but I went from not believing caffeine did anything to not being able to drink a can of soda in my late twenties. I started taking an anti...
I don’t know where your caffeine intolerance comes from but I went from not believing caffeine did anything to not being able to drink a can of soda in my late twenties. I started taking an anti anxiety medication and while I still try not to drink caffeine I at least can. I would like to find something that works because it helps working at home so much but my body hates coffee and iced tea gives me kidney stones (I think, being overly cautious of my genetics).
Mine comes from my bipolar, but it has only been an issue for the last three years or so. Before that I could drink a 6 shot espresso and gone to sleep an hour later. Now I risk it and get a decaf...
Mine comes from my bipolar, but it has only been an issue for the last three years or so. Before that I could drink a 6 shot espresso and gone to sleep an hour later. Now I risk it and get a decaf coffee somewhere. But I have to pay close attention because if they give me regular by accident i have to take the anxiety meds to counteract. Otherwise I become manic and it causes a whole mess of other issues.
There’s decent decaf out there, you won’t find it in a grocery store. The decaf process seems to knock out the subtle notes of coffee like those fruity notes. I drink a lot of iced coffee now,...
There’s decent decaf out there, you won’t find it in a grocery store. The decaf process seems to knock out the subtle notes of coffee like those fruity notes.
I drink a lot of iced coffee now, which seems to help minimize the bitter taste decaf is more prone to getting. Plus I feel like I can sip at the same iced coffee all day.
Oh man iced coffees have been my jam for a while now. I agree it makes the decaf a little better. But I'm definitely still on the hunt for a new one. I also just live in one of the worse places in...
Oh man iced coffees have been my jam for a while now. I agree it makes the decaf a little better. But I'm definitely still on the hunt for a new one.
I also just live in one of the worse places in the US for coffee. You can either brew it yourself. Or get Dunkin donuts coffee. Which I'm sorry to people who like it, but it's horrible.
I had no idea they had unsweetened! That's great to know. Because one of my biggest problems in getting coffee from places is, at least where I live, they put in about 6-8 pumps of sugary syrup in...
I had no idea they had unsweetened! That's great to know. Because one of my biggest problems in getting coffee from places is, at least where I live, they put in about 6-8 pumps of sugary syrup in with a shot or two of coffee. I want it reversed.
It’s really cool that they exist, I’m always afraid they’ll vanish from the menu. Be aware not every employee understands that the swirl is not the same as a shot. The swirl is the usual sweetener...
It’s really cool that they exist, I’m always afraid they’ll vanish from the menu.
Be aware not every employee understands that the swirl is not the same as a shot. The swirl is the usual sweetener that’s super sweet. You’ll know the difference because the swirl will make your lips pucker if you’re not used to overly sweetened drinks. The shot has a little sweetness to it, like what you would get if you had a cold glass of milk.
Yup, it's basically 0, I'm super sensitive to caffeine as well and haven't had it in nearly a decade now. I have one cup of decaf that uses the swiss water removal and that's it. The warmth of the...
Yup, it's basically 0, I'm super sensitive to caffeine as well and haven't had it in nearly a decade now. I have one cup of decaf that uses the swiss water removal and that's it. The warmth of the drink and the taste I think is what gives me the placebo effect... I'm under no illusion that that's what is happening but even though I know this, it still helps me in the morning.
That was my immediate thought too. I'm a decaf drinker because I react quite strongly to caffeine. I still have a coffee habit, and it's unlikely to be anything to do with the small amounts of...
That was my immediate thought too. I'm a decaf drinker because I react quite strongly to caffeine. I still have a coffee habit, and it's unlikely to be anything to do with the small amounts of caffeine in the decaf. It's just an enjoyable part of my daily routine. It would have been interesting to see if this study showed similar changes among decaf drinkers.
I'm a regular coffee drinker too. I kinda want to reduce my caffeine intake because it's too strong of a diuretic for me, but I haven't been impressed with alternatives. I just need my morning...
I'm a regular coffee drinker too.
I kinda want to reduce my caffeine intake because it's too strong of a diuretic for me, but I haven't been impressed with alternatives.
I just need my morning latte macchiato, and nothing can mimic both the taste and texture of it.
I accidentally bought decaf once during the peak of my coffee usage (8+ cups a day, usually made on the stronger side). After getting through the first cup, I knew something was wrong but I...
I accidentally bought decaf once during the peak of my coffee usage (8+ cups a day, usually made on the stronger side). After getting through the first cup, I knew something was wrong but I couldn't tell what. It was a significant feeling of dread that crept up out of nowhere. That's when I knew I had a real problem with caffeine.
So that's my anecdotal experience, take that for what you will.
Disappointed that genetic variances in how caffeine is metabolized were not at least mentioned. It is, at best, a confound in the interpretation of these data. At worst, it makes the conclusions...
Disappointed that genetic variances in how caffeine is metabolized were not at least mentioned. It is, at best, a confound in the interpretation of these data. At worst, it makes the conclusions useless.
I had my DNA done (adopted, wanted information on basic genetic information for informed family planning decisions: I'm childfree as a result). I learned through extensive analyses that I am a rapid metabolizer of caffeine (its stimulant properties have almost no effect in waking me up or keeping me alert; I drink coffee right up until bedtime without consequence). Before that, I had no idea such a gene existed.
I've always been skeptical about people who say coffee "does nothing" for them, and immediately assume they do nothing but consume caffeine day in and day out. I did not know a "rapid...
I've always been skeptical about people who say coffee "does nothing" for them, and immediately assume they do nothing but consume caffeine day in and day out. I did not know a "rapid metabolization" gene was a thing.
I am one of those people, I don't drink coffee at all because I think it tastes disgusting and it's never had any effect on me. I tried energy drinks a couple times in college and I don't remember...
I am one of those people, I don't drink coffee at all because I think it tastes disgusting and it's never had any effect on me. I tried energy drinks a couple times in college and I don't remember them doing much either. This gene is also news to me, until now I was convinced there was either a massive conspiracy of people pretending to like coffee or some sort of society-wide placebo effect.
caffeine has an imperceptible effect on me, and i don't drink it much at all. (never drink coffee). pain meds also seem to do very little for me, perhaps they are related but it probably depends...
caffeine has an imperceptible effect on me, and i don't drink it much at all. (never drink coffee). pain meds also seem to do very little for me, perhaps they are related but it probably depends on the meds in question.
Porque no los dos? Same though. I mean the coffee does SOMETHING but it's very weak sauce and the number of times I've gotten MORE tired after drinking coffee... needless to say the ADHD diagnosis...
Porque no los dos?
Same though. I mean the coffee does SOMETHING but it's very weak sauce and the number of times I've gotten MORE tired after drinking coffee... needless to say the ADHD diagnosis was not a shock on that front. Coffee is vital for when the Vyvanse starts wearing off though, otherwise I crash hard and nap for hours.
It's a feature, not a bug ... I do wish more people were aware of this gene, however. We could all be more accepting of individual differences if only we knew these fundamental factors.
It's a feature, not a bug ... I do wish more people were aware of this gene, however. We could all be more accepting of individual differences if only we knew these fundamental factors.
This prompted me to look back through my 23andMe results. I have CC, which is the slowest processing of caffeine. This lines up with my personal experience. I can never have more than 1 coffee in...
This prompted me to look back through my 23andMe results. I have CC, which is the slowest processing of caffeine. This lines up with my personal experience. I can never have more than 1 coffee in the morning, otherwise my sleep schedule is absolutely wrecked. I have experimented in the past with doing no caffeine, and I think I might keep that going permanently now.
Wait wtf? TIL people metabolize caffeine at different rates. Then again, now I'm aware and think about it it's not that surprising. I can drink a shitload of caffeine... always just assumed it was...
Wait wtf?
TIL people metabolize caffeine at different rates. Then again, now I'm aware and think about it it's not that surprising. I can drink a shitload of caffeine... always just assumed it was tolerance.
Question from ignorance, asking because it sounds like you may have chances upon an answer: was there anything in your research or reading that indicated that there is an inverse to the gene you...
Question from ignorance, asking because it sounds like you may have chances upon an answer: was there anything in your research or reading that indicated that there is an inverse to the gene you mention? I.e., a gene which makes a certain person more sensitive to caffeine in some way?
There's a huge accumulation of academic research on caffeine and its possible contributions to heart attacks, breast cancer, lung cancer, diabetes, insomnia, etc. TL:DR but at the end of the day...
There's a huge accumulation of academic research on caffeine and its possible contributions to heart attacks, breast cancer, lung cancer, diabetes, insomnia, etc. TL:DR but at the end of the day our bodies look at caffeine, much like they look at nicotine, as a toxin. Your body trys to rid itself of caffeine - all toxins - in the most efficient way it can (pooping, sweating, increased heart rate, etc.) Depending on if you are a fast or slow metabolizer, your body will use different tools. Slow metabolizers have a much harder time (and it takes much longer) ridding themselves of the toxin, hence the headaches, jitters, heart palpations, etc. that fast metabolizers somehow bypass.
The Gene does a lot, not just caffeine regulation (slow metabolizers are
I tried, but I couldn't make sense of that link lol. Also tried googling some more but alas, I remain clueless. It'd be nice to know if I'm sensitive to caffeine or not given my insomnia issues,...
I tried, but I couldn't make sense of that link lol. Also tried googling some more but alas, I remain clueless. It'd be nice to know if I'm sensitive to caffeine or not given my insomnia issues, since sometimes a cup of tea does nothing and some days whoa I'm wired.
Caffeine does make me go poop, though. THAT I've got a pretty clear line of cause/effect happening, even if science apparently doesn't know why that is or why only some people are affected in this manner (genes?).
Sorry about that ... wild guess from me from your description says you're a slow to very slow caffeine metabolizer: use with caution/extreme caution (i.e. avoid or eliminate coffee, tea,...
Sorry about that ... wild guess from me from your description says you're a slow to very slow caffeine metabolizer: use with caution/extreme caution (i.e. avoid or eliminate coffee, tea, chocolate, energy drinks, Coke/Pepsi/Mountain Dew, especially after noon).
I'm CYP1A2 -163C>A - C/A, 5347C>T - C/T which apparently means I'm normal. Well, theoretically? It's why I got excited and tried making sense of the link and googled stuff, only to find no real...
I'm CYP1A2 -163C>A - C/A, 5347C>T - C/T which apparently means I'm normal. Well, theoretically? It's why I got excited and tried making sense of the link and googled stuff, only to find no real answers. Sometimes caffeine works, sometimes it doesn't.
That's interesting. I always suspected I metabolized coffee faster than most people. If I sit down with a cup of coffee and start sipping it, over the next 2 or so hours I have multiple...
That's interesting. I always suspected I metabolized coffee faster than most people. If I sit down with a cup of coffee and start sipping it, over the next 2 or so hours I have multiple gargantuan, urgent pisses. I always wondered how people drink 2-3 coffees a day at work, or during 2-3 hour meetings, without having to get up and constantly piss. I have to actively avoid drinking coffee 1-2 hours before driving or attending an event because I don't want to get stuck with a painfully engorged bladder.
https://clinics.acmg.net/ and my primary care physician with input from my rheumatologist got me to a licensed practitioner in my area (not covered by insurance btw). Had I not had pre-existing...
https://clinics.acmg.net/ and my primary care physician with input from my rheumatologist got me to a licensed practitioner in my area (not covered by insurance btw). Had I not had pre-existing autoimmune issues that were fertility threatening, I would, for at least a screening first step, have used 23andme.com or ancestry.com which cost a fraction of genetic testing with counseling.
fwiw today's my gotcha day (day I came home from the orphanage). Mom always had some kind of mini celebration with gifts on July 8 but didn't actually explain why until I was 18. I wonder how many...
fwiw today's my gotcha day (day I came home from the orphanage). Mom always had some kind of mini celebration with gifts on July 8 but didn't actually explain why until I was 18.
I wonder how many adoptees even know their gotcha days...
Echoing arqalite’s sentiment that it would have been interesting to see data from a third group of decaf drinkers. Also, the article touched on this but didn’t go into detail: the possibility that...
Echoing arqalite’s sentiment that it would have been interesting to see data from a third group of decaf drinkers. Also, the article touched on this but didn’t go into detail: the possibility that some of the effects measures could have been from the easing of withdrawal symptoms if the participants in the study were daily coffee drinkers. I suppose you’d need to repeat the study with a lot of groups (habitual coffee drinkers, habitual tea drinkers, people who don’t drink caffeine at all, etc.) if you really wanted to control for that though.
Anecdotal or not, this is an interesting way to do it! I'm almost tempted to try it myself but if I'm honest with myself I don't drink coffee for the effect - I just like the way it tastes and I...
I have a friend who uses this information to apparent benefit.
Anecdotal or not, this is an interesting way to do it! I'm almost tempted to try it myself but if I'm honest with myself I don't drink coffee for the effect - I just like the way it tastes and I like the routine of making it for myself in the morning :)
I do something like this as well. I buy caffeine pills (each equivalent to about one cup of coffee) that I split into quarters with a pill splitter. Some days, I will take 1-4 of these quarters,...
I do something like this as well. I buy caffeine pills (each equivalent to about one cup of coffee) that I split into quarters with a pill splitter. Some days, I will take 1-4 of these quarters, but most most days I take none. In the course of a week, I will typically have 1-2 caffeine days (most of those with only one quarter of a pill); but I often go a couple weeks without any caffeine, then maybe take caffeine for several days in a row.
I avoid having a schedule and just go with what I need for that week. For example, if I need to attend a social event on a Friday, I will avoid caffeine all week, and then take half a pill before the event (I am extremely introverted, so the caffeine helps me keep up my mental energy levels).
I like using one quarter of a pill because it's just enough to give me a very noticeable boost without getting jittery. I suspect the small amount is so effective for me because my consumption method prevents developing a tolerance. (I may also be a slow metabolizer.)
Another weird coffee effect is the infamous coffee 💩. The effect comes so fast that the actual ingredients of coffee haven't had time to be absorbed into the body. Sometimes just the smell of...
Another weird coffee effect is the infamous coffee 💩.
The effect comes so fast that the actual ingredients of coffee haven't had time to be absorbed into the body. Sometimes just the smell of coffee is enough =)
For me, it's not so much the effect of the coffee, it's more of my body clock recognizing a certain point in the day (morning) when it's usually bathroom time since I am very routined these days.
For me, it's not so much the effect of the coffee, it's more of my body clock recognizing a certain point in the day (morning) when it's usually bathroom time since I am very routined these days.
Mine too. I’m quite regular, but I also drink plenty of water and I exercise 5x a week. But my bathroom trips do happen around the same time each day, so I’m sure in my case it contributes to my...
Mine too. I’m quite regular, but I also drink plenty of water and I exercise 5x a week. But my bathroom trips do happen around the same time each day, so I’m sure in my case it contributes to my regularity. And probiotics, too
I've always been interested in this effect and done my own unscientific tests. Turns out that tea and other hot drinks also work. Black tea also has caffeine, but I recorded similar results from...
I've always been interested in this effect and done my own unscientific tests. Turns out that tea and other hot drinks also work. Black tea also has caffeine, but I recorded similar results from decaf tea and rooibos tea. I have hypothesized that hot water may also stimulate peristalsis but have yet to start this stage of the tests.
The scientists aren't clear on why that happens either, since it doesn't affect everyone the same way. I know because I looked it up once I realized that no matter what time of day it was, if I...
The scientists aren't clear on why that happens either, since it doesn't affect everyone the same way. I know because I looked it up once I realized that no matter what time of day it was, if I had a cup of matcha, a mere 30 mins later I was likely ready to poop.
I think the original poster was using calories as an analogy. So, basically - saying "yes, it's obvious that an enjoyable experience does more for you than a bland experience."
I think the original poster was using calories as an analogy. So, basically - saying "yes, it's obvious that an enjoyable experience does more for you than a bland experience."
Coffee in the morning is as much a ritual as it is a source of wakefulness for me, and I think that's really interesting--Usually you hear with other kinds of food you prepare, you enjoy the...
Coffee in the morning is as much a ritual as it is a source of wakefulness for me, and I think that's really interesting--Usually you hear with other kinds of food you prepare, you enjoy the result less after you've cooked it yourself because your senses have adapted to the aromas/tastes of what you've made.
Coffee seems to be the other way around--Preparing it yourself to me makes it taste so much better than what I get at cafes., even when I haven't dialed in a particular coffee very well yet.
It's all about the ritual for me. I like to brew that cup, sit down and not really do anything for the 15 min it takes me to drink it. Relax, pet my dog and enjoy easing myself into the day. I...
It's all about the ritual for me. I like to brew that cup, sit down and not really do anything for the 15 min it takes me to drink it. Relax, pet my dog and enjoy easing myself into the day. I don't know how people can wake up and run straight to work with their coffee in a to go mug or picked up on the way! It must be a stressful way to start every day.
Similarly to Arqalite I wonder if adding another variable with other morning beverages might come out with interesting results, since coffee is a part of a LOT of people's routines but not...
Similarly to Arqalite I wonder if adding another variable with other morning beverages might come out with interesting results, since coffee is a part of a LOT of people's routines but not everyone's. I myself am a tea drinker, and I like the strong black British style for waking up, so I'd love to see that comparison, as well as decaf and coffee substitutes as others have mentioned. I think the study is interesting but not as comprehensive as it could be, though setting up double blind studies with that many variables would take a lot of time and resources.
Plenty of things are placebo... and there's nothing wrong with that. The placebo effect does NOT mean something is worthless, and there's some interesting hypotheses as to why we evolved to be...
Plenty of things are placebo... and there's nothing wrong with that. The placebo effect does NOT mean something is worthless, and there's some interesting hypotheses as to why we evolved to be able to perceive a placebo effect in the first place.
If you haven't watched Medlife Crisis's video on the placebo effect, you absolutely should. It's long but it is so, so well done: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tefIopDJQBQ
As some one who doesn't drink coffee in the morning (I actually do soda) cause I hate the taste (plus I'm not a fan of hot drinks), I always assumed it was (same as my soda too). But I still like...
As some one who doesn't drink coffee in the morning (I actually do soda) cause I hate the taste (plus I'm not a fan of hot drinks), I always assumed it was (same as my soda too). But I still like having that soda in the morning even if it is placebo effect.
The article doesn't say if the participants were drinking an equal amount of fluids in the morning, but the phrasing (edited, spelling mistake) "taking caffeine" makes me think it was in...
The article doesn't say if the participants were drinking an equal amount of fluids in the morning, but the phrasing (edited, spelling mistake) "taking caffeine" makes me think it was in supplement form. Thus maybe they ended up drinking way less than that, compared to a full cup or more of coffee.
After breathing and sweating out water all night long, hydrating in the morning makes us feel less sluggish and helps get the systems in the body up and running again.
Having a cup or two of fluids in the morning in any form will help wake you up. Same goes for lunchtime and afternoon, the other times we often have coffee.
Since it doesn't say whether they were all given the same amount of fluid without knowing if it had caffeine or not, then all this tells us is exactly what it says. People that assume they feel better because of the coffee might be attributing it to the idea of caffeine, when there are other factors to consider.
I honestly wish they had a third group who had to drink decaf (basically give them the illusion they were drinking coffee, but with none of the caffeine), so they could see which effects were truly placebo.
I'd also assume there are other substances in coffee besides caffeine that could have an impact on alertness and focus, though. Maybe trying one of those cereal-based drinks that looks like coffee? That doesn't taste the same tho.
Just pointing out that decaf coffee has around 97% of the caffeine removed. So not completely caffeine-free, but way way less.
I know, but I would assume the effects of the little caffeine left would be minimal at best.
It depends. I'm extremely sensitive to caffeine due to medication and mental health. And even decaf makes me jittery.
I can't even drink soda without it keeping me up half the night. Which isn't too bad of a problem to have.
Definitely not a bad thing to be intolerant of an addictive drug.
I agree with you about 99.99% of the time. Because I absolutely love coffee. I've been drinking it for years. And I just love it. But I just can't drink it anymore. Decaf is ok. But I haven't found one I loved as much as the coffee I had before my sensitivity. But yeah one less thing to be addicted to is absolutely a great thing.
And it's the same thing with alcohol. I had a drinking problem before and the sensitivity has really helped me stop. A single beer makes me just feel uncomfortable. Not relaxed like it used to.
I don't know if it's available where you are but Lavazza has a whole bean decaf that really scratched the itch for me (switched due to blood pressure). Fair warning, though, it's not cheap. But as you seem unable to drink a lot anyway that's maybe not that important to you.
Thank you for the recommendation! I've seen ads for that brand before. But didn't think twice about it. I will absolutely check my store next time I'm there.
I don’t know where your caffeine intolerance comes from but I went from not believing caffeine did anything to not being able to drink a can of soda in my late twenties. I started taking an anti anxiety medication and while I still try not to drink caffeine I at least can. I would like to find something that works because it helps working at home so much but my body hates coffee and iced tea gives me kidney stones (I think, being overly cautious of my genetics).
Mine comes from my bipolar, but it has only been an issue for the last three years or so. Before that I could drink a 6 shot espresso and gone to sleep an hour later. Now I risk it and get a decaf coffee somewhere. But I have to pay close attention because if they give me regular by accident i have to take the anxiety meds to counteract. Otherwise I become manic and it causes a whole mess of other issues.
There’s decent decaf out there, you won’t find it in a grocery store. The decaf process seems to knock out the subtle notes of coffee like those fruity notes.
I drink a lot of iced coffee now, which seems to help minimize the bitter taste decaf is more prone to getting. Plus I feel like I can sip at the same iced coffee all day.
Oh man iced coffees have been my jam for a while now. I agree it makes the decaf a little better. But I'm definitely still on the hunt for a new one.
I also just live in one of the worse places in the US for coffee. You can either brew it yourself. Or get Dunkin donuts coffee. Which I'm sorry to people who like it, but it's horrible.
Dunkin’ has these unsweetened flavor shots and those pretty much satisfy me greatly. Wish I could find a home version of the stupid things.
I had no idea they had unsweetened! That's great to know. Because one of my biggest problems in getting coffee from places is, at least where I live, they put in about 6-8 pumps of sugary syrup in with a shot or two of coffee. I want it reversed.
So unsweetened sounds right up my alley!
It’s really cool that they exist, I’m always afraid they’ll vanish from the menu.
Be aware not every employee understands that the swirl is not the same as a shot. The swirl is the usual sweetener that’s super sweet. You’ll know the difference because the swirl will make your lips pucker if you’re not used to overly sweetened drinks. The shot has a little sweetness to it, like what you would get if you had a cold glass of milk.
The swiss water method removes like 99.9% IIRC. It's very effective.
Yup, it's basically 0, I'm super sensitive to caffeine as well and haven't had it in nearly a decade now. I have one cup of decaf that uses the swiss water removal and that's it. The warmth of the drink and the taste I think is what gives me the placebo effect... I'm under no illusion that that's what is happening but even though I know this, it still helps me in the morning.
That was my immediate thought too. I'm a decaf drinker because I react quite strongly to caffeine. I still have a coffee habit, and it's unlikely to be anything to do with the small amounts of caffeine in the decaf. It's just an enjoyable part of my daily routine. It would have been interesting to see if this study showed similar changes among decaf drinkers.
I'm a regular coffee drinker too.
I kinda want to reduce my caffeine intake because it's too strong of a diuretic for me, but I haven't been impressed with alternatives.
I just need my morning latte macchiato, and nothing can mimic both the taste and texture of it.
I accidentally bought decaf once during the peak of my coffee usage (8+ cups a day, usually made on the stronger side). After getting through the first cup, I knew something was wrong but I couldn't tell what. It was a significant feeling of dread that crept up out of nowhere. That's when I knew I had a real problem with caffeine.
So that's my anecdotal experience, take that for what you will.
Disappointed that genetic variances in how caffeine is metabolized were not at least mentioned. It is, at best, a confound in the interpretation of these data. At worst, it makes the conclusions useless.
https://www.matrixagemanagement.com/blog/this-gene-will-tell-you-how-your-body-process-caffeine
I had my DNA done (adopted, wanted information on basic genetic information for informed family planning decisions: I'm childfree as a result). I learned through extensive analyses that I am a rapid metabolizer of caffeine (its stimulant properties have almost no effect in waking me up or keeping me alert; I drink coffee right up until bedtime without consequence). Before that, I had no idea such a gene existed.
I've always been skeptical about people who say coffee "does nothing" for them, and immediately assume they do nothing but consume caffeine day in and day out. I did not know a "rapid metabolization" gene was a thing.
I am one of those people, I don't drink coffee at all because I think it tastes disgusting and it's never had any effect on me. I tried energy drinks a couple times in college and I don't remember them doing much either. This gene is also news to me, until now I was convinced there was either a massive conspiracy of people pretending to like coffee or some sort of society-wide placebo effect.
caffeine has an imperceptible effect on me, and i don't drink it much at all. (never drink coffee). pain meds also seem to do very little for me, perhaps they are related but it probably depends on the meds in question.
I remember getting Vicodin when I was a teenager and it having no impact
Same here.
Porque no los dos?
Same though. I mean the coffee does SOMETHING but it's very weak sauce and the number of times I've gotten MORE tired after drinking coffee... needless to say the ADHD diagnosis was not a shock on that front. Coffee is vital for when the Vyvanse starts wearing off though, otherwise I crash hard and nap for hours.
Vyvanse crashes are no joke. They've had me absolutely wiped to the point of near catatonia.
No worries, it's been a long time since I've taken Spanish class so I didn't remember the spelling difference!
It's a feature, not a bug ... I do wish more people were aware of this gene, however. We could all be more accepting of individual differences if only we knew these fundamental factors.
This prompted me to look back through my 23andMe results. I have CC, which is the slowest processing of caffeine. This lines up with my personal experience. I can never have more than 1 coffee in the morning, otherwise my sleep schedule is absolutely wrecked. I have experimented in the past with doing no caffeine, and I think I might keep that going permanently now.
Wait wtf?
TIL people metabolize caffeine at different rates. Then again, now I'm aware and think about it it's not that surprising. I can drink a shitload of caffeine... always just assumed it was tolerance.
Question from ignorance, asking because it sounds like you may have chances upon an answer: was there anything in your research or reading that indicated that there is an inverse to the gene you mention? I.e., a gene which makes a certain person more sensitive to caffeine in some way?
There's a huge accumulation of academic research on caffeine and its possible contributions to heart attacks, breast cancer, lung cancer, diabetes, insomnia, etc. TL:DR but at the end of the day our bodies look at caffeine, much like they look at nicotine, as a toxin. Your body trys to rid itself of caffeine - all toxins - in the most efficient way it can (pooping, sweating, increased heart rate, etc.) Depending on if you are a fast or slow metabolizer, your body will use different tools. Slow metabolizers have a much harder time (and it takes much longer) ridding themselves of the toxin, hence the headaches, jitters, heart palpations, etc. that fast metabolizers somehow bypass.
The Gene does a lot, not just caffeine regulation (slow metabolizers are
CYP1A2 C/C
... an interesting Google all by itself)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CYP1A2
Thanks for the detail and link, I appreciate it. I'll have to learn a bit more to map this gene's affects to my personal experiences with caffeine.
I tried, but I couldn't make sense of that link lol. Also tried googling some more but alas, I remain clueless. It'd be nice to know if I'm sensitive to caffeine or not given my insomnia issues, since sometimes a cup of tea does nothing and some days whoa I'm wired.
Caffeine does make me go poop, though. THAT I've got a pretty clear line of cause/effect happening, even if science apparently doesn't know why that is or why only some people are affected in this manner (genes?).
Sorry about that ... wild guess from me from your description says you're a slow to very slow caffeine metabolizer: use with caution/extreme caution (i.e. avoid or eliminate coffee, tea, chocolate, energy drinks, Coke/Pepsi/Mountain Dew, especially after noon).
I'm CYP1A2 -163C>A - C/A, 5347C>T - C/T which apparently means I'm normal. Well, theoretically? It's why I got excited and tried making sense of the link and googled stuff, only to find no real answers. Sometimes caffeine works, sometimes it doesn't.
That's interesting. I always suspected I metabolized coffee faster than most people. If I sit down with a cup of coffee and start sipping it, over the next 2 or so hours I have multiple gargantuan, urgent pisses. I always wondered how people drink 2-3 coffees a day at work, or during 2-3 hour meetings, without having to get up and constantly piss. I have to actively avoid drinking coffee 1-2 hours before driving or attending an event because I don't want to get stuck with a painfully engorged bladder.
I’m adopted also. What sort of testing did you ask for? I’m interested in this. Something beyond ancestry dna I’m assuming?
https://clinics.acmg.net/ and my primary care physician with input from my rheumatologist got me to a licensed practitioner in my area (not covered by insurance btw). Had I not had pre-existing autoimmune issues that were fertility threatening, I would, for at least a screening first step, have used 23andme.com or ancestry.com which cost a fraction of genetic testing with counseling.
https://www.uofmhealth.org/conditions-treatments/medical-genetics This was my provider
fwiw today's my gotcha day (day I came home from the orphanage). Mom always had some kind of mini celebration with gifts on July 8 but didn't actually explain why until I was 18.
I wonder how many adoptees even know their gotcha days...
Mine is May 16th
Echoing arqalite’s sentiment that it would have been interesting to see data from a third group of decaf drinkers. Also, the article touched on this but didn’t go into detail: the possibility that some of the effects measures could have been from the easing of withdrawal symptoms if the participants in the study were daily coffee drinkers. I suppose you’d need to repeat the study with a lot of groups (habitual coffee drinkers, habitual tea drinkers, people who don’t drink caffeine at all, etc.) if you really wanted to control for that though.
Anecdotal or not, this is an interesting way to do it! I'm almost tempted to try it myself but if I'm honest with myself I don't drink coffee for the effect - I just like the way it tastes and I like the routine of making it for myself in the morning :)
I mean, true, I just don’t actually want to change what I’m doing, even for science :)
I do something like this as well. I buy caffeine pills (each equivalent to about one cup of coffee) that I split into quarters with a pill splitter. Some days, I will take 1-4 of these quarters, but most most days I take none. In the course of a week, I will typically have 1-2 caffeine days (most of those with only one quarter of a pill); but I often go a couple weeks without any caffeine, then maybe take caffeine for several days in a row.
I avoid having a schedule and just go with what I need for that week. For example, if I need to attend a social event on a Friday, I will avoid caffeine all week, and then take half a pill before the event (I am extremely introverted, so the caffeine helps me keep up my mental energy levels).
I like using one quarter of a pill because it's just enough to give me a very noticeable boost without getting jittery. I suspect the small amount is so effective for me because my consumption method prevents developing a tolerance. (I may also be a slow metabolizer.)
I love Hoffman on ANYthing.
On toast?
Another weird coffee effect is the infamous coffee 💩.
The effect comes so fast that the actual ingredients of coffee haven't had time to be absorbed into the body. Sometimes just the smell of coffee is enough =)
For me, it's not so much the effect of the coffee, it's more of my body clock recognizing a certain point in the day (morning) when it's usually bathroom time since I am very routined these days.
Mine too. I’m quite regular, but I also drink plenty of water and I exercise 5x a week. But my bathroom trips do happen around the same time each day, so I’m sure in my case it contributes to my regularity. And probiotics, too
I don't even care how it works metabolically tbh it keeps me regular SO well... I don't get it from just the smell tho lol
I've always been interested in this effect and done my own unscientific tests. Turns out that tea and other hot drinks also work. Black tea also has caffeine, but I recorded similar results from decaf tea and rooibos tea. I have hypothesized that hot water may also stimulate peristalsis but have yet to start this stage of the tests.
The scientists aren't clear on why that happens either, since it doesn't affect everyone the same way. I know because I looked it up once I realized that no matter what time of day it was, if I had a cup of matcha, a mere 30 mins later I was likely ready to poop.
Is this not akin to the difference between drinking a flavorless sludge with 800 calories and eating a homecooked meal's worth of 800 calories?
I think the original poster was using calories as an analogy. So, basically - saying "yes, it's obvious that an enjoyable experience does more for you than a bland experience."
Coffee in the morning is as much a ritual as it is a source of wakefulness for me, and I think that's really interesting--Usually you hear with other kinds of food you prepare, you enjoy the result less after you've cooked it yourself because your senses have adapted to the aromas/tastes of what you've made.
Coffee seems to be the other way around--Preparing it yourself to me makes it taste so much better than what I get at cafes., even when I haven't dialed in a particular coffee very well yet.
It's all about the ritual for me. I like to brew that cup, sit down and not really do anything for the 15 min it takes me to drink it. Relax, pet my dog and enjoy easing myself into the day. I don't know how people can wake up and run straight to work with their coffee in a to go mug or picked up on the way! It must be a stressful way to start every day.
Similarly to Arqalite I wonder if adding another variable with other morning beverages might come out with interesting results, since coffee is a part of a LOT of people's routines but not everyone's. I myself am a tea drinker, and I like the strong black British style for waking up, so I'd love to see that comparison, as well as decaf and coffee substitutes as others have mentioned. I think the study is interesting but not as comprehensive as it could be, though setting up double blind studies with that many variables would take a lot of time and resources.
Plenty of things are placebo... and there's nothing wrong with that. The placebo effect does NOT mean something is worthless, and there's some interesting hypotheses as to why we evolved to be able to perceive a placebo effect in the first place.
If you haven't watched Medlife Crisis's video on the placebo effect, you absolutely should. It's long but it is so, so well done: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tefIopDJQBQ
Link for those on Nebula: https://nebula.tv/videos/medlifecrisis-how-to-use-the-placebo-effect-to-feel-better
As some one who doesn't drink coffee in the morning (I actually do soda) cause I hate the taste (plus I'm not a fan of hot drinks), I always assumed it was (same as my soda too). But I still like having that soda in the morning even if it is placebo effect.
The article doesn't say if the participants were drinking an equal amount of fluids in the morning, but the phrasing (edited, spelling mistake) "taking caffeine" makes me think it was in supplement form. Thus maybe they ended up drinking way less than that, compared to a full cup or more of coffee.
After breathing and sweating out water all night long, hydrating in the morning makes us feel less sluggish and helps get the systems in the body up and running again.
Having a cup or two of fluids in the morning in any form will help wake you up. Same goes for lunchtime and afternoon, the other times we often have coffee.
Since it doesn't say whether they were all given the same amount of fluid without knowing if it had caffeine or not, then all this tells us is exactly what it says. People that assume they feel better because of the coffee might be attributing it to the idea of caffeine, when there are other factors to consider.
As long as it works it doesn't really matter though, does it?
Caffeine has been proven safe to consume numerous times though.
I don't care if it's a placebo or not.
It's something I enjoy and will continue to do so.
No it doesn't! But I felt the need to say my piece LOL!
Just a bit of humor combined with coffee defensive behavior.
I'm in the same boat as you.
"HISSSSS!!! COFFEE IS OUR PRECIOUS!!"
It's just morning ritual.