I fully blame the airlines -- they charge too much for checked baggage and try to cram ever more seats into a small space. I guess having more and more people crammed into the space is better for...
I fully blame the airlines -- they charge too much for checked baggage and try to cram ever more seats into a small space. I guess having more and more people crammed into the space is better for the environment, if we're going to fly, we might as well get as many passengers moved per unit of fuel as possible, but they need to ease up on the checked back costs so that people will be more likely to check their bags rather than trying to stuff as much as they can into the main cabin.
EDIT: It feels to me as if they could actually provide more legroom and install more seats if they'd put in staggered stadium type seating, using the overhead bin space for headroom, IF they'd replace that space with free checked bags.
You don't blame the people that lay their suitcases across lengthwise? Or the passengers that stuff their jackets and backpacks and purses and whatnot in when there's still 3/4 left of the plane...
You don't blame the people that lay their suitcases across lengthwise? Or the passengers that stuff their jackets and backpacks and purses and whatnot in when there's still 3/4 left of the plane to board? They still have room at their feet!
Those are the same people that close the bin when it's still clearly got room left, either out of ignorance of selfishness. I see this on every flight I've flown for the past 3 years. I have little hope that people like that would pay for checked bags at $40 but not at $60. I see this on Southwest where 2 checked bags are free.
To be fair to some, the seat pitch is so tight these days, I need that space underneath for my feet, or I will be in pain by the end of the flight. All part of the squeeze/race to the bottom by...
To be fair to some, the seat pitch is so tight these days, I need that space underneath for my feet, or I will be in pain by the end of the flight. All part of the squeeze/race to the bottom by the airlines.
Yes, it's quite ridiculous. I'm not a tall person, yet with a backpack in the space underneath, I'll get uncomfortable after 3 or 4 hours. I cannot imagine being tall and flying from NY to CA.
Yes, it's quite ridiculous. I'm not a tall person, yet with a backpack in the space underneath, I'll get uncomfortable after 3 or 4 hours. I cannot imagine being tall and flying from NY to CA.
I'm not tall either, but I am a bit too round, almost all airplane seats put my chronic pain into a flare because of the pitch of the seat. I'm still going to fly because I have places to go, but...
I'm not tall either, but I am a bit too round, almost all airplane seats put my chronic pain into a flare because of the pitch of the seat. I'm still going to fly because I have places to go, but I can complain about it. Even the extra room seats are a problem for me. But since I'm short, I always try to take either my husband's stuff so he can have his legroom since he's 6+ feet tall, or I share my space with him so he can have a bit better spacing. The extra leg space I have doesn't matter to me, even given how the stupid seats are set up.
Huh. I'm 6'1" and gladly give up all of my leg space to a backpack, while refusing to use the recline button, for all of my cross-country flights. Maybe it's a youth privileged thing? I could see...
Huh. I'm 6'1" and gladly give up all of my leg space to a backpack, while refusing to use the recline button, for all of my cross-country flights. Maybe it's a youth privileged thing? I could see that getting too uncomfortable as I age.
Just shy of 2m here and I need my leg space. I turn 44 this year and can confirm that I am using my recline function more liberally. Not the maximum, only an inch or two. I'm in big trouble if the...
Just shy of 2m here and I need my leg space. I turn 44 this year and can confirm that I am using my recline function more liberally. Not the maximum, only an inch or two. I'm in big trouble if the person in front of me wants to recline, though. My knees are almost always indented from the seat in front of me. It's going to get worse before it gets worse.
Totally agree, which is why I can only being myself to do an inch or two. I'm sure as I age and my hips/back get worse then I'll have to do more. No telling what the person in from of me is...
Totally agree, which is why I can only being myself to do an inch or two. I'm sure as I age and my hips/back get worse then I'll have to do more. No telling what the person in from of me is dealing with. Sciatica, chronic pain, being 2m+ themselves, I won't judge. It'll just be a bad time for me.
Every overhead compartment is a bit different -- some work best wheels out, some work best wheels in, some work best sideways, some upright. I do blame the airlines for not having better...
You don't blame the people that lay their suitcases across lengthwise?
Every overhead compartment is a bit different -- some work best wheels out, some work best wheels in, some work best sideways, some upright. I do blame the airlines for not having better illustrations or silhouette images in the compartments to give some guidance as I often find myself trying 2 or 3 different orientations before settling on the best one for that particular plane.
Yes, I'm aware of this. I'm only complaining about the cases where people could have done better and didn't. It's pretty easy. Wheels in first, if not fit, try other configuration. Too many people...
Yes, I'm aware of this. I'm only complaining about the cases where people could have done better and didn't. It's pretty easy. Wheels in first, if not fit, try other configuration. Too many people go for "lengthwise because it's easy and then I sit down".
I don't mind if people put whatever they want up there, as long as they're not taking up more space than they're "allotted." They paid for that space, too, after all. It's certainly different if...
jackets and backpacks and purses
I don't mind if people put whatever they want up there, as long as they're not taking up more space than they're "allotted." They paid for that space, too, after all. It's certainly different if they have a carry-on luggage, plus a backpack, plus a jacket up there. That's not OK.
My carry-ons are usually a backpack and a laptop bag (sometimes I forgo the laptop bag). I put my backpack underneath the seat, since it has what I need during the flight. Plus, it's bulkier than my laptop bag and I'm a short person, so I don't need all the leg room. So I'll toss my thin laptop bag up top. It's only like 4in wide. No one's ever given me any flack for it, and I'd hope that no one ever would. But if I wanted to toss a jacket up instead of a laptop bag, I should be able to.
this one person put a large artsy LAMPSHADE in there, on one of my flights, and was all worried that it would get smushed. It didn't. But yeah. On the other hand I've also had to fly with a cello...
this one person put a large artsy LAMPSHADE in there, on one of my flights, and was all worried that it would get smushed. It didn't. But yeah.
On the other hand I've also had to fly with a cello once, and understand how tough it is to necessitate travel with delicate, oversized items. I didn't super enjoy paying for my cello's seat either, so I can see what they were going for.
Yeah it’s not a great feeling to see other passengers take up tons of space with e.g. soft but large and bulky carry-ons. I hard-cap my carry-ons to a 21”x10”x14” roller bag and laptop bag. It’s a...
Yeah it’s not a great feeling to see other passengers take up tons of space with e.g. soft but large and bulky carry-ons.
I hard-cap my carry-ons to a 21”x10”x14” roller bag and laptop bag. It’s a bit restrictive when packing for a cold-weather destination but I don’t want to feel like I’m stuffing half my wardrobe in the overhead compartment.
Unless a flight is half empty, cabin crews are always ensuring baggage is arranged in the most efficient fashion. On flights where they know it's full and going to be an issue they're quite...
Unless a flight is half empty, cabin crews are always ensuring baggage is arranged in the most efficient fashion. On flights where they know it's full and going to be an issue they're quite aggressive about moving out coats and personal items too.
The move is for all airlines to go back to including a complimentary checked bag with every ticket.
I flew 21 times in 2023 and on the flights that were full, it was roughly 50/50 to see cabin crew get aggressive about rearranging baggage or denying people space if they stuffed more than their...
I flew 21 times in 2023 and on the flights that were full, it was roughly 50/50 to see cabin crew get aggressive about rearranging baggage or denying people space if they stuffed more than their fair share on there. 50/50 probably because people would close the bins themselves even when arranged suboptimally or with space left, and if the crew didn't notice, they usually assumed it was full.
I contest that they are aggressive about moving coats and personal items out on full flights. I've been on a United flight where I boarded at the head of group 3 and seen that people behind me were starting to get their carry-ons checked instead, because the plane communicated with them that they were running low on space. When I boarded, I still saw way too many coats and small bags in the bins. I grant that perhaps those people didn't bring suitcases, but I have no faith that all were like that. EDIT: It's possible the United crew was overly conservative about when to start cutting people off. I didn't see the entire length of the plane.
I did 18 last year and only saw crew aggressively denying space twice, but going through the bins systematically has become very common. But only one trip was to the US. I don't think a single Air...
I did 18 last year and only saw crew aggressively denying space twice, but going through the bins systematically has become very common. But only one trip was to the US. I don't think a single Air Canada flight skips this now though. When they know it's going to be a tight day they're also sizing carry ons at the gate or even before the security checkpoint.
They have to show through testing that each configuration of the airplane can be safely evacuated in a very short period of time. A lot of these optimizations would make it harder to meet this...
It feels to me as if they could actually provide more legroom and install more seats if they'd put in staggered stadium type seating, using the overhead bin space for headroom, IF they'd replace that space with free checked bags.
They have to show through testing that each configuration of the airplane can be safely evacuated in a very short period of time. A lot of these optimizations would make it harder to meet this requirement, which is one reason I don't think you see more of it.
I think these optimizations need to include more space between seats again, then. As someone with mobility issues, I wouldn't be able to evacuate quickly and safely in any reasonable amount of...
I think these optimizations need to include more space between seats again, then. As someone with mobility issues, I wouldn't be able to evacuate quickly and safely in any reasonable amount of time. Even two inches between the seats would be enough to make my mobility issues fixed, especially since I fly with my cane 100% of the time now.
I believe (but have no proof) that the much tighter seat pitch we are seeing today probably doesn't meet the evacuation requirements. With everything we are seeing with the 737 max, it's pretty...
I believe (but have no proof) that the much tighter seat pitch we are seeing today probably doesn't meet the evacuation requirements. With everything we are seeing with the 737 max, it's pretty clear that all the I's are not being dotted nor T's crossed, so I would not be surprised if profit won out over safety when getting the tighter pitch approved. Unfortunately, it will take an evacuation failure (probably in a first world country) before anything is done about it.
It's everyone's fault. It's our fault for being greedy, for being inconsiderate. It isn't as if you can't easily find information on the expected size of carry-on luggage, it's that people don't...
It's everyone's fault. It's our fault for being greedy, for being inconsiderate. It isn't as if you can't easily find information on the expected size of carry-on luggage, it's that people don't want to be limited to that, they want more and they don't want to have to pay for it, or they don't want to put their bag in the bin in a way that makes room for others. And it's the airline's fault because this behavior is extremely predictable consequence of the decoupling of bag fees and airline tickets.
Of course, airlines decoupling fees is also our fault, since we're always going to go for the lower price, and any airline that can make their price lower be decoupling fees is going to win against an airline that has the fees included in the ticket price.
To me, it's less about fees and more not wanting to chance my luggage getting lost. My apprehension to checking bags is attributable 100% to the airlines.
To me, it's less about fees and more not wanting to chance my luggage getting lost. My apprehension to checking bags is attributable 100% to the airlines.
You are lucky - or I'm unlucky. I fly what I'd consider an average amount and have had my luggage lost twice. Granted in both cases that eventually did find my suitcase but in one instance took 3...
You are lucky - or I'm unlucky. I fly what I'd consider an average amount and have had my luggage lost twice. Granted in both cases that eventually did find my suitcase but in one instance took 3 weeks to find and get it to me (replacing a wardrobe on vacation ain't cheap!) and the other they found soonish but I had to drive an hour back to the airport to get it. I go carry-on now.
I've never had luggage lost but I've had checked suitcases not arrive with me and need to be shipped to me twice just since covid restrictions lifted (I travel internationally by plane about 2-3...
I've never had luggage lost but I've had checked suitcases not arrive with me and need to be shipped to me twice just since covid restrictions lifted (I travel internationally by plane about 2-3 times a year). Once being completely my fault, to be fair, but still. Luckily both times were on return journeys home, so waiting for the suitcases to arrive wasn't too painful.
I was just on a flight a few weeks ago (and will be on another tomorrow) with Delta and they specifically asked everyonet o place their bag a certain way. I guess they figured out the best way to...
I was just on a flight a few weeks ago (and will be on another tomorrow) with Delta and they specifically asked everyonet o place their bag a certain way. I guess they figured out the best way to get bags to fit (they told them to place the bag horizontally and then flip it to place it like a book).
A number of planes have had the overhead bins reconfigured to accommodate more of these rollaboard style bags by making the bin tall enough to accommodate he bag on its side.
A number of planes have had the overhead bins reconfigured to accommodate more of these rollaboard style bags by making the bin tall enough to accommodate he bag on its side.
This is suggested in every flight I've been on for years now. It's very rare for me to see people listen to the suggestion though and often flight attendants are left scrambling repacking the...
This is suggested in every flight I've been on for years now. It's very rare for me to see people listen to the suggestion though and often flight attendants are left scrambling repacking the overhead bins to fit a few extra bags in.
archive link for anyone who hits the paywall: https://archive.is/ad0wU Every time I fly I watch people struggle with their carry-on bags as they board and leave the plane, and I always mumble to...
Every time I fly I watch people struggle with their carry-on bags as they board and leave the plane, and I always mumble to myself "there must be a better way." This article takes a look at what we're all doing with carry-on bags and why.
the article also links to "Gate Lice" - spoiler alert, once again, maximizing profits make humans miserable I'm old enough to remember when flying wasn't like this: there wasn't any security...
Psychologists explain. We all know those travelers: The ones who line up before their boarding group is called
spoiler alert, once again, maximizing profits make humans miserable
And increasingly, airline policy is such that there can be a real, tangible benefit to lining up early. Flights are often full, or even overbooked, which can lead to a sense of pressure among travelers to claim their space early. [...]
“The consequence of these structural [airline] issues is that they set up uncertainty (on any flight, I might have problems) and competition (this is a zero sum game: others getting on with bags lowers the chance of me getting on with bags),” Stephen Reicher, a professor of psychology at the University of St. Andrews, said in an email. “This leads to anxiety and antagonism.” The antagonism is what motivates people to line up even if it means cutting in front of people.
I'm old enough to remember when flying wasn't like this: there wasn't any security theatre; the seats had enough room (or people were thin) that you don't need to "beach towel spread" your stuff; they didn't oversell tickets so there's literally room to spare; they didn't pack connecting flights so close together with only 15 minutes allotted to de-plane; the airplane food is included and sometimes even quite pleasant so we have fewer hangry people. It's terrible what they've done to us all.
Probably nobody wants to gate lice: but they forced the zero-sum game on us. When I travel solo I don't do it, I'm super happy to be final-called. But when I am with dependents it can feel like a necessity.
I remember putting my sister on a flight back to her college right after 9/11. Soldiers with machine guns were guarding the metal detectors, and for the first time ever, you couldn't pass security...
I remember putting my sister on a flight back to her college right after 9/11. Soldiers with machine guns were guarding the metal detectors, and for the first time ever, you couldn't pass security to take your family member all the way to the gate. It's wild to think how normalized that has become since then.
I remember having family nearly all the way to the gate as well. I'm okay with scanning bags, I guess. What I really abhor are those nudie scanners and the pat down and making you pour out water...
I remember having family nearly all the way to the gate as well. I'm okay with scanning bags, I guess. What I really abhor are those nudie scanners and the pat down and making you pour out water and having to put liquids in the plastic bags. And sometimes some horrible little person would be shouting at people in the line up and puff themselves up with made up importance over this theatre and the small amount of power rush. Those people are the worst.
I think the US stopped using nudie scanners more than 10 years ago? I make a point of refusing them every single time. Oh they said images are deleted whatever, but I'm opposed to that kind of technology out of (probably dumb) principle.
I can think of another reason why people might want to line up ahead of time, and that’s to be done as soon as possible. I don’t do it personally but I can see why it happens. As long as I have...
I can think of another reason why people might want to line up ahead of time, and that’s to be done as soon as possible.
I don’t do it personally but I can see why it happens. As long as I have yet to board the plane, I can’t relax… I have to stay vigilant to keep tabs on my luggage and to make sure I don’t miss being called to the counter for some reason. Once you’re sitting in your seat, all that’s done with and all you have to do is wait to arrive.
I stand up because I've been sitting for an hour, sometimes after a lot of airport walking while wrangling my carry-on ,and now I'm going to be sitting for a few more hours and standing is...
I stand up because I've been sitting for an hour, sometimes after a lot of airport walking while wrangling my carry-on ,and now I'm going to be sitting for a few more hours and standing is something different to do for a while. Might as well do it then.
The problems described in the article are compounded by airlines just generally being lax about the size of the carry ons that they allow people to bring on. People are bringing on hard sided...
The problems described in the article are compounded by airlines just generally being lax about the size of the carry ons that they allow people to bring on. People are bringing on hard sided cases that cannot fit on their side in the bins, so they're forced to lay them flat. I'm a very light traveler and I usually only bring a carry on that is at most 2/3rds the maximum size allowed, but I always worry that they'll make me gate check my bag because the people boarding in front of me have brought their gargantuan carry ons and filled up the bins.
The airlines, yes. I dont blame the flight or gate crew at all for not "enforcing" the size rule. They're given hardly any time to get people boarded the passengers are already super on edge, past...
airlines just generally being lax about the size of the carry ons
The airlines, yes. I dont blame the flight or gate crew at all for not "enforcing" the size rule.
They're given hardly any time to get people boarded
the passengers are already super on edge, past security and maybe needing fast transfers
they're alone with no back up and will "cause" delays that cost the airline a ton of money if they say anything to the big-packers
if big-packers go insane on them people will whip out their phones and film gate crew trying to "enforce" something that looks incredibly petty ("it's half an inch!!!") because it is the airlines that are being petty
in a sane world, absolutely: everybody line up knowing first in last out, families with super little kids board last. But this is a capital driven world so you gotta make the plebs wait to...
in a sane world, absolutely: everybody line up knowing first in last out, families with super little kids board last.
But this is a capital driven world so you gotta make the plebs wait to artificially manufacture something worth selling. The first class people probably also get a kick out of boarding/de-boarding first and watching the poor scramble past them to their poor house seats, not find overhead compartment space, or go ALL the way to the back next to the rear washrooms.
there's no other reason why they need like, 5 different "zones"
Yay, I get to link one of my favorite CGP Grey videos! Surprisingly neither back-to-front nor window-middle-aisle are the perfectly optimal strategy, because of the time it takes to stow carry-ons.
from video: from linked article: also from video: in the days of yore before sensible leg rooms were taken away, people took less time to get into the window seats. I'm reminded of the story about...
from video:
It's bags. Bags cause most of the delay
from linked article:
The global airline industry now makes almost $30 billion a year from baggage fees.
also from video:
seat shuffling
in the days of yore before sensible leg rooms were taken away, people took less time to get into the window seats.
I'm reminded of the story about the game, Portal, where on one level play testers kept asking for reset buttons. Valve spent the time to actually look at why, and found out there's a trap that makes a level un-beatable. They fixed the trap, and viola, no more calls for resets.
The story here is that we don't NEED the perfect boarding method if they just go back to NOT charging for checked bags, give us our leg room back, and minimize the horrors of boarding last by not over-selling tickets and having fewer close-connections. Watch Airplane! again: it was a saner world.
When bags are checked at the gate, are those free? I wonder if that sets up some perverse incentive, where people, not wanting to pay the expensive fee for checked bags, hope that they can a free...
When bags are checked at the gate, are those free? I wonder if that sets up some perverse incentive, where people, not wanting to pay the expensive fee for checked bags, hope that they can a free checked bag at the gate.
I'm flying out later today. My brother and I are taking a trip and we started talking about whether we're checking-in vs carrying-on. He was considering doing carry-on only. I, however, always check my luggage. Mainly because my carry-ons are my backpack and laptop bag, both containing electronics. I'm not checking those for fear of damage or theft.
But I also find lugging around luggage through an airport, onto the plane, off the plane, and through the airport again a hassle. All so, what, I can save 15min by not waiting at the baggage carousel?
That said, I do fly Southwest often. Everyone gets two checked bags free. I've also started flying Delta, where bags are not free (at least on the lower-end of tickets). But I signed up for one of their credit cards explicitly to get one free bag per flight. So I almost never pay for checked bags.
I've also never lost a checked bag (though all my bags are AirTagged) nor had one seriously damaged. Maybe my tune will change if/once that happens.
Maybe airlines need to take the example of the ULCCs like Spirit and Frontier and measure carry-ons at the gate or even desk. Though I know the their agents don't always size bags, either. Or remove the silly bag fees. Increase the ticket price so that everyone gets at least one checked bag free. How is it that Southwest manages to provide two "free" bags but no one else can?
I'm just kinda rambling at this point, so I'll stop. I need to finish (start) packing anyway!
The wait for bags to surface at the carousel is a big reason why I try to fly carryon-only when I can. Generally speaking when I’m in airports I’m moving quickly and so I’ll frequently end up at...
The wait for bags to surface at the carousel is a big reason why I try to fly carryon-only when I can. Generally speaking when I’m in airports I’m moving quickly and so I’ll frequently end up at the carousel 15-20m ahead of the bags. I could’ve been out of the airport and halfway to my destination in the time I was standing there awkwardly waiting for my checked bag.
I used to travel a lot for business before the pandemic, usually quick turnaround 2-3 day trips. Especially if your booking a flight around the start or end of a meeting, not checking a bag can...
I used to travel a lot for business before the pandemic, usually quick turnaround 2-3 day trips. Especially if your booking a flight around the start or end of a meeting, not checking a bag can really save a lot of time. I got it down to a science where I could get to the airport 30 minutes before boarding, go through precheck, the walk onto the plane. It also gives you a lot more flexibility to take a different flight (even a different airline) because of delays or whatever without having to have your checked luggage chase you.
Thankfully the zoom meeting has replaced much of that travel, so I don't have to be away from my family nearly as much anymore.
For family vacation though, it's checked bags all the way. We can't (or don't want to) optimize our packing down to the essentials, like a business trip, and we're likely doing a wider variety of activities anyway.
Yes, they are free. A few people I know bring a backpack and a suitcase that is exactly the allowed carry-on size and board last with the knowledge that there's a very low chance there will be...
When bags are checked at the gate, are those free? I wonder if that sets up some perverse incentive, where people, not wanting to pay the expensive fee for checked bags, hope that they can a free checked bag at the gate.
Yes, they are free.
A few people I know bring a backpack and a suitcase that is exactly the allowed carry-on size and board last with the knowledge that there's a very low chance there will be space available when they get on.
That way they'll be able to get on (the bins usually fill up and they're asked to check before they get to the boarding ramp) and off the plane without digging through overhead bins or paying for the bag check.
That doesn't seem very wise? The bags are small enough to carry on and the bins aren't bad unless you board last so it seems to just cost time without much benefit.
That doesn't seem very wise? The bags are small enough to carry on and the bins aren't bad unless you board last so it seems to just cost time without much benefit.
I do this when I travel solo, so please allow me to explain. Depends on personality type. People shuffle off the plane front-to-back, but people don't sit in their seats until their cluster is...
I do this when I travel solo, so please allow me to explain.
the bins aren't bad
Depends on personality type.
People shuffle off the plane front-to-back, but people don't sit in their seats until their cluster is next: they "aisle-lice" (see Gate Lice) immediately after they're allowed to take their seat belts off.
So what happens is that the most aisle lice'd individuals have their bags out first, and the aisle becomes immediately inundated with their bags, regardless of how far back they are standing.
If I had my own carry-on bag, I'd have to wait until there was physically room for my bag to be brought down. Which might involve waiting for the entire local cluster to have room to bring theirs down.
Without a bag, I say excuse me and walk right off. The aisles are just big enough for 2 people turned sideways: when the person in front of me is turned sideways getting their bag, I make my escape.
Now, it's true I will have to spend time at the carousel. But the carousel is much roomier than an airplane aisle, and I won't have to worry about people's bags falling onto my head or being elbowed during its descent.
I don't do it for time: I do it for safety. And because I don't want to pay for & carry around a second checked bag: there are carts at the carousel.
When you say that you say excuse me and walk right off, who are you talking to and what are you doing? Are you just cutting past everyone and getting off the plane? Most people just wait their...
When you say that you say excuse me and walk right off, who are you talking to and what are you doing? Are you just cutting past everyone and getting off the plane? Most people just wait their turn regardless of if they have a bag in the overhead bin or not. I also don't see how standing even longer at the carousel is worth more than just staying in your seat on the plane. And I don't get what that has to do with safety.
Usually people leave in clumps, and when there's just me and one dude in front and then open aisle, I'll say excuse me and squeeze past while he gets his bag from the overhead. I'm quite small in...
Usually people leave in clumps, and when there's just me and one dude in front and then open aisle, I'll say excuse me and squeeze past while he gets his bag from the overhead.
I'm quite small in stature and had bags fall on me or been elbowed a few times while people are getting their bags.
It's not a lot of time saving total, but I would gladly trade time away from airplane aisle.
fwiw, if they require you to check carry-ons because of space, they're generally gate-checked and you thus don't have to wait for the baggage carousel.
I also don't see how standing even longer at the carousel is worth more than just staying in your seat on the plane.
fwiw, if they require you to check carry-ons because of space, they're generally gate-checked and you thus don't have to wait for the baggage carousel.
I did this once, I was going for a weekend and only had a backpack with me. I was told I was being so rude to get off as before everyone else, when I had been waiting to go to the bathroom since...
I did this once, I was going for a weekend and only had a backpack with me. I was told I was being so rude to get off as before everyone else, when I had been waiting to go to the bathroom since we couldn't get up during the flight.
Very interesting..... I've not been told I was rude doing this but I can see it being interpreted this way. To be clear I wouldn't "squeeze" past one or max two people, and only if they're busy...
Very interesting..... I've not been told I was rude doing this but I can see it being interpreted this way. To be clear I wouldn't "squeeze" past one or max two people, and only if they're busy grabbing their stuff, definitely not passing folks who are already ready to move.
Which is so funny because once we're out of the plane on the connecting bridge, passing becomes suddenly super acceptable, with folks nearly running others over with their wheelie carry-ons.
Agreed! I wasn't squeezing past anyone, I just got up with my stuff, since it was all under the seat in front of me and walked up the empty aisle as soon as they told us it was ok to get up.
Agreed! I wasn't squeezing past anyone, I just got up with my stuff, since it was all under the seat in front of me and walked up the empty aisle as soon as they told us it was ok to get up.
I was going to say something similar. I've never waited only 15 minutes for baggage. I have waited 4 hours at Pearson to get my bags, being ushered back and forth between numerous carousels while...
I was going to say something similar. I've never waited only 15 minutes for baggage. I have waited 4 hours at Pearson to get my bags, being ushered back and forth between numerous carousels while being told our bags are "arriving soon", after having landed 2 hours late.
That was pre-pandemic, and from what I've heard, it's only gotten worse since. I haven't checked a bag in years, and I don't particularly want to travel with people who need to. Everything I need for a week easily fits in a single carry-on sized suitcase. If I'm going for more than a week, I'll find a laundromat.
(EDIT: to be clear, the 4 hour wait was an anomaly, even for Pearson, though waiting an hour was pretty typical.)
yup. and then during the pandemic things really hit the fan. Wasn't it voted worst airport of north america twice in a row? let me see -- 2022 July: Pearson worst in the world (citynews) different...
Pearson
yup. and then during the pandemic things really hit the fan. Wasn't it voted worst airport of north america twice in a row? let me see --
different ranking, 2023 second worst in North America before Newark Jersey (cp24)
When given a choice I always fly over Toronto. If not, Montreal. They lost our suitcase for a wedding in 2022 and we were stranded for nearly a whole day. yuck.
Jfc. I think the longest I've waited at the carousel is like 30min. Both at my home airport, MCI (KC) and other larger airports. Technically I've waited a longer a couple times as my bags were...
Jfc. I think the longest I've waited at the carousel is like 30min. Both at my home airport, MCI (KC) and other larger airports. Technically I've waited a longer a couple times as my bags were delayed, but I just had the airline drop them off at my hotel/home.
Yeah, that makes sense why you might want to do carry-on only...
It's not worse than that now, though it was bad in the post-covid rush. I'd say 45 minutes on average these days, which is still disgraceful compared to Calgary or Vancouver.
It's not worse than that now, though it was bad in the post-covid rush. I'd say 45 minutes on average these days, which is still disgraceful compared to Calgary or Vancouver.
This has happened to me a few times, and it's always left me more in awe at how hard an airline will try to get a bag back to you than annoyance at it happening in the first place.
I've also never lost a checked bag (though all my bags are AirTagged) nor had one seriously damaged. Maybe my tune will change if/once that happens.
This has happened to me a few times, and it's always left me more in awe at how hard an airline will try to get a bag back to you than annoyance at it happening in the first place.
I've had bags get delayed, but not lost. Once on American, and there was medication in the bag because I was forced to gate check it, and didn't have time to dig through to get my medication. I...
I've had bags get delayed, but not lost. Once on American, and there was medication in the bag because I was forced to gate check it, and didn't have time to dig through to get my medication. I was without for a few days, and it sucked. I tried to get American to get my bag to me sooner, and they just didn't care (edited because I forgot my train of thought).
United delayed our bags by half a day on our honeymoon last year and not only did they give us a whole kit, they gave us each $200 to purchase necessary clothing items at our destination (Disney World), and a flight voucher for $200 each on our next flight with them. Best experience I've ever had flying, and it's made us United customers.
We usually fly Southwest, but for long-haul flights, we will now only fly United. Southwest will stay our Disneyland airline of choice because it's usually under $100/person round trip.
I used to fly back and forth across the US for work on a route that always required a transfer. I would always gladly volunteer to check my bag on the return flight to avoid having to deal with it...
I used to fly back and forth across the US for work on a route that always required a transfer. I would always gladly volunteer to check my bag on the return flight to avoid having to deal with it on the plane and transfer terminal with the thought that I didn't care if it took a few extra days for my dirty clothes to get home -- my important stuff was in my backpack. It helped that my destination airport was a small one and the bags were almost always ready almost as soon as I got downstairs. I've never once had a lost bag.
Can’t check laptops because of the batteries. Anything that fits under a seat the airplane staff will ignore, so laptop bags and small backpacks don’t get checked either. Medical devices don’t get...
Can’t check laptops because of the batteries. Anything that fits under a seat the airplane staff will ignore, so laptop bags and small backpacks don’t get checked either. Medical devices don’t get checked either.
I honestly have never had to wait more than a few minutes for my bags to arrive and the carrousel. I spend more time waiting for a ride share to pick me up.
This is one of those problems I keep hearing about, but never actually encountered. I always fly with a back pack full of my most breakable/valuable possessions. Now that I have a baby my wife and...
This is one of those problems I keep hearing about, but never actually encountered. I always fly with a back pack full of my most breakable/valuable possessions. Now that I have a baby my wife and I have even more stuff to carry.
But I've never had trouble with storing things. Not once in my life have I gotten to my seat and not been able to find space. On the other hand I've had my checked luggage lost quite a few times. Usually on long flights with a short layover like they just didn't have time to put it on the next plane.
My big problem with the overhead bins are the people who just sit there when the plane lands and don't bother getting their stuff together until it's their turn and they should he walking up the aisle.
I hope you know that you can check a car seat for free. If you put it in something like this carry bag, you can even put some extra clothes and things in the with it, as long as you don't go...
I hope you know that you can check a car seat for free. If you put it in something like this carry bag, you can even put some extra clothes and things in the with it, as long as you don't go crazy. I recommend one with wheels.
You can also gate-check a stroller for free, which is a godsend if you have a connection because you'll get it back in the connecting airport.
When your baby is over 2 and can no longer be on the lap, I highly recommend a CARES harness. This harness is FAA approved, but the parenting win is that it keeps them restrained in the seat during the flight, and
it is much more portable than trying to use a carseat.
You put the tray on the back of the seat down, put the strap around the seat, then put the tray back up again. After that, the person can use the tray normally. Since you are (hopefully) early...
You put the tray on the back of the seat down, put the strap around the seat, then put the tray back up again. After that, the person can use the tray normally.
Since you are (hopefully) early boarding with little kids, then usually you have time to do it before the other person is even there, but I never had anyone give me flack about it. Most people who have kids are understanding, and the ones that don't are at least happy that the child will not be running around the cabin.
You can also bring the car seat onto the plane, secure it with the seatbelt, and strap the kid into that. It's a more familiar environment for them, and the harness tends to be more secure in case...
You can also bring the car seat onto the plane, secure it with the seatbelt, and strap the kid into that. It's a more familiar environment for them, and the harness tends to be more secure in case you have a particularly determined runner.
Fair enough. My daughter was pretty mellow as a toddler. When we tried, our car seat (chicco key fit) proved to be too big to fit. "Approved for air travel", it turns out, does not mean "approved...
Fair enough. My daughter was pretty mellow as a toddler. When we tried, our car seat (chicco key fit) proved to be too big to fit. "Approved for air travel", it turns out, does not mean "approved by airline". With the bulkhead seats all being premium seats these days, it's not so easy for them to swap you.
I remember full size car seats being super hard to install (no LATCH anchors) and can't imagine travelling with one....but maybe things have changed. Friendly note that not all car seats are FAA...
I remember full size car seats being super hard to install (no LATCH anchors) and can't imagine travelling with one....but maybe things have changed.
Friendly note that not all car seats are FAA approved for flight, and they also have a special no bucket seat belt thingy too.
the buckets are so heavy....But if one can push a bucket compatible stroller all the way to the plane door, maybe it's worth it.
The only downside is that it also brings the kid closer to the seat in front of them, so when they kick, it's a lot harder. Though I am 100% ok with kids being safely restrained, even if it means...
The only downside is that it also brings the kid closer to the seat in front of them, so when they kick, it's a lot harder. Though I am 100% ok with kids being safely restrained, even if it means I might get a kick to the head.
Usually, yes. If the gate agent predicts that they'll need to gate-check some certain number of bags, and asks for volunteers to do it, then it's free. If that's not the case, you aren't entitled...
When bags are checked at the gate, are those free?
Usually, yes. If the gate agent predicts that they'll need to gate-check some certain number of bags, and asks for volunteers to do it, then it's free. If that's not the case, you aren't entitled to just waltz up there and ask them to do it for free. They might do it, but they're not obligated to.
I wonder if that sets up some perverse incentive, where people, not wanting to pay the expensive fee for checked bags, hope that they can a free checked bag at the gate.
I don't think so... you won't get through security with a full-size bag. So at best, it'll be just slightly larger than the maximum allowed size carry-on anyway. You've also had to go through the hassle that you've described of lugging your luggage through the airport.
I do think that checked bag fees were the start of this nonsense. At the same time, they reduced the staffing required to deal with checked luggage. So now, the longest line you'll often wait in at the airport is the one to check your bag, unless you have enough status with the airline to get into a priority line. Airlines have made dealing with luggage be a bottleneck of air travel in general.
I fly enough to have platinum status with Delta, so I often check a bag and just carry a backpack that I could stuff under my seat. Status gets me into the shorter bag-check line, the free checked bag, and supposed faster bag retrieval (they tag it with a special tag which is supposed to come out earlier on the luggage carousel, but I've had mixed results with that). Then I can hang out in the lounge a little and arrive at the gate 20m before departure to take my seat without fighting with anyone over bin space.
That being said, I also sometime fly with Breeze airways since they have a nonstop to some places I travel to, which charges for both checked and carry-on bags, and are very restrictive on bag sizes. People are more mindful of their luggage compared to Delta, and I haven't experienced these issues with them.
See the Wikipedia article on Enshittification. It's a term origin coined by Cory Doctorow in reference to media related services, but it's everywhere now.
See the Wikipedia article on Enshittification. It's a term origin coined by Cory Doctorow in reference to media related services, but it's everywhere now.
I fully blame the airlines -- they charge too much for checked baggage and try to cram ever more seats into a small space. I guess having more and more people crammed into the space is better for the environment, if we're going to fly, we might as well get as many passengers moved per unit of fuel as possible, but they need to ease up on the checked back costs so that people will be more likely to check their bags rather than trying to stuff as much as they can into the main cabin.
EDIT: It feels to me as if they could actually provide more legroom and install more seats if they'd put in staggered stadium type seating, using the overhead bin space for headroom, IF they'd replace that space with free checked bags.
You don't blame the people that lay their suitcases across lengthwise? Or the passengers that stuff their jackets and backpacks and purses and whatnot in when there's still 3/4 left of the plane to board? They still have room at their feet!
Those are the same people that close the bin when it's still clearly got room left, either out of ignorance of selfishness. I see this on every flight I've flown for the past 3 years. I have little hope that people like that would pay for checked bags at $40 but not at $60. I see this on Southwest where 2 checked bags are free.
To be fair to some, the seat pitch is so tight these days, I need that space underneath for my feet, or I will be in pain by the end of the flight. All part of the squeeze/race to the bottom by the airlines.
Yes, it's quite ridiculous. I'm not a tall person, yet with a backpack in the space underneath, I'll get uncomfortable after 3 or 4 hours. I cannot imagine being tall and flying from NY to CA.
I'm not tall either, but I am a bit too round, almost all airplane seats put my chronic pain into a flare because of the pitch of the seat. I'm still going to fly because I have places to go, but I can complain about it. Even the extra room seats are a problem for me. But since I'm short, I always try to take either my husband's stuff so he can have his legroom since he's 6+ feet tall, or I share my space with him so he can have a bit better spacing. The extra leg space I have doesn't matter to me, even given how the stupid seats are set up.
Huh. I'm 6'1" and gladly give up all of my leg space to a backpack, while refusing to use the recline button, for all of my cross-country flights. Maybe it's a youth privileged thing? I could see that getting too uncomfortable as I age.
Just shy of 2m here and I need my leg space. I turn 44 this year and can confirm that I am using my recline function more liberally. Not the maximum, only an inch or two. I'm in big trouble if the person in front of me wants to recline, though. My knees are almost always indented from the seat in front of me. It's going to get worse before it gets worse.
Yeah that's why I don't do the recline. Feels like a dick move when it's done to me. Thus I can not do it to others.
Totally agree, which is why I can only being myself to do an inch or two. I'm sure as I age and my hips/back get worse then I'll have to do more. No telling what the person in from of me is dealing with. Sciatica, chronic pain, being 2m+ themselves, I won't judge. It'll just be a bad time for me.
Every overhead compartment is a bit different -- some work best wheels out, some work best wheels in, some work best sideways, some upright. I do blame the airlines for not having better illustrations or silhouette images in the compartments to give some guidance as I often find myself trying 2 or 3 different orientations before settling on the best one for that particular plane.
Yes, I'm aware of this. I'm only complaining about the cases where people could have done better and didn't. It's pretty easy. Wheels in first, if not fit, try other configuration. Too many people go for "lengthwise because it's easy and then I sit down".
Sure, but you can also just rotate someone's horizontal bag and then put your own in.
I don't mind if people put whatever they want up there, as long as they're not taking up more space than they're "allotted." They paid for that space, too, after all. It's certainly different if they have a carry-on luggage, plus a backpack, plus a jacket up there. That's not OK.
My carry-ons are usually a backpack and a laptop bag (sometimes I forgo the laptop bag). I put my backpack underneath the seat, since it has what I need during the flight. Plus, it's bulkier than my laptop bag and I'm a short person, so I don't need all the leg room. So I'll toss my thin laptop bag up top. It's only like 4in wide. No one's ever given me any flack for it, and I'd hope that no one ever would. But if I wanted to toss a jacket up instead of a laptop bag, I should be able to.
this one person put a large artsy LAMPSHADE in there, on one of my flights, and was all worried that it would get smushed. It didn't. But yeah.
On the other hand I've also had to fly with a cello once, and understand how tough it is to necessitate travel with delicate, oversized items. I didn't super enjoy paying for my cello's seat either, so I can see what they were going for.
Yeah it’s not a great feeling to see other passengers take up tons of space with e.g. soft but large and bulky carry-ons.
I hard-cap my carry-ons to a 21”x10”x14” roller bag and laptop bag. It’s a bit restrictive when packing for a cold-weather destination but I don’t want to feel like I’m stuffing half my wardrobe in the overhead compartment.
Unless a flight is half empty, cabin crews are always ensuring baggage is arranged in the most efficient fashion. On flights where they know it's full and going to be an issue they're quite aggressive about moving out coats and personal items too.
The move is for all airlines to go back to including a complimentary checked bag with every ticket.
I flew 21 times in 2023 and on the flights that were full, it was roughly 50/50 to see cabin crew get aggressive about rearranging baggage or denying people space if they stuffed more than their fair share on there. 50/50 probably because people would close the bins themselves even when arranged suboptimally or with space left, and if the crew didn't notice, they usually assumed it was full.
I contest that they are aggressive about moving coats and personal items out on full flights. I've been on a United flight where I boarded at the head of group 3 and seen that people behind me were starting to get their carry-ons checked instead, because the plane communicated with them that they were running low on space. When I boarded, I still saw way too many coats and small bags in the bins. I grant that perhaps those people didn't bring suitcases, but I have no faith that all were like that. EDIT: It's possible the United crew was overly conservative about when to start cutting people off. I didn't see the entire length of the plane.
I did 18 last year and only saw crew aggressively denying space twice, but going through the bins systematically has become very common. But only one trip was to the US. I don't think a single Air Canada flight skips this now though. When they know it's going to be a tight day they're also sizing carry ons at the gate or even before the security checkpoint.
They have to show through testing that each configuration of the airplane can be safely evacuated in a very short period of time. A lot of these optimizations would make it harder to meet this requirement, which is one reason I don't think you see more of it.
I think these optimizations need to include more space between seats again, then. As someone with mobility issues, I wouldn't be able to evacuate quickly and safely in any reasonable amount of time. Even two inches between the seats would be enough to make my mobility issues fixed, especially since I fly with my cane 100% of the time now.
I believe (but have no proof) that the much tighter seat pitch we are seeing today probably doesn't meet the evacuation requirements. With everything we are seeing with the 737 max, it's pretty clear that all the I's are not being dotted nor T's crossed, so I would not be surprised if profit won out over safety when getting the tighter pitch approved. Unfortunately, it will take an evacuation failure (probably in a first world country) before anything is done about it.
It's everyone's fault. It's our fault for being greedy, for being inconsiderate. It isn't as if you can't easily find information on the expected size of carry-on luggage, it's that people don't want to be limited to that, they want more and they don't want to have to pay for it, or they don't want to put their bag in the bin in a way that makes room for others. And it's the airline's fault because this behavior is extremely predictable consequence of the decoupling of bag fees and airline tickets.
Of course, airlines decoupling fees is also our fault, since we're always going to go for the lower price, and any airline that can make their price lower be decoupling fees is going to win against an airline that has the fees included in the ticket price.
To me, it's less about fees and more not wanting to chance my luggage getting lost. My apprehension to checking bags is attributable 100% to the airlines.
Exactly this, if you fly enough it’s not about if your checked luggage will get lost but when.
Maybe I’ve just been lucky, but I fly pretty frequently and have been for the last 5-6 years, and I’ve never had a piece of luggage lost.
You are lucky - or I'm unlucky. I fly what I'd consider an average amount and have had my luggage lost twice. Granted in both cases that eventually did find my suitcase but in one instance took 3 weeks to find and get it to me (replacing a wardrobe on vacation ain't cheap!) and the other they found soonish but I had to drive an hour back to the airport to get it. I go carry-on now.
I've never had luggage lost but I've had checked suitcases not arrive with me and need to be shipped to me twice just since covid restrictions lifted (I travel internationally by plane about 2-3 times a year). Once being completely my fault, to be fair, but still. Luckily both times were on return journeys home, so waiting for the suitcases to arrive wasn't too painful.
I just use the LTT backpack. It’s the biggest possible backpack that fits under an airplane seat.
I was just on a flight a few weeks ago (and will be on another tomorrow) with Delta and they specifically asked everyonet o place their bag a certain way. I guess they figured out the best way to get bags to fit (they told them to place the bag horizontally and then flip it to place it like a book).
A number of planes have had the overhead bins reconfigured to accommodate more of these rollaboard style bags by making the bin tall enough to accommodate he bag on its side.
This is suggested in every flight I've been on for years now. It's very rare for me to see people listen to the suggestion though and often flight attendants are left scrambling repacking the overhead bins to fit a few extra bags in.
archive link for anyone who hits the paywall: https://archive.is/ad0wU
Every time I fly I watch people struggle with their carry-on bags as they board and leave the plane, and I always mumble to myself "there must be a better way." This article takes a look at what we're all doing with carry-on bags and why.
the article also links to "Gate Lice" -
spoiler alert, once again, maximizing profits make humans miserable
I'm old enough to remember when flying wasn't like this: there wasn't any security theatre; the seats had enough room (or people were thin) that you don't need to "beach towel spread" your stuff; they didn't oversell tickets so there's literally room to spare; they didn't pack connecting flights so close together with only 15 minutes allotted to de-plane; the airplane food is included and sometimes even quite pleasant so we have fewer hangry people. It's terrible what they've done to us all.
Probably nobody wants to gate lice: but they forced the zero-sum game on us. When I travel solo I don't do it, I'm super happy to be final-called. But when I am with dependents it can feel like a necessity.
I remember putting my sister on a flight back to her college right after 9/11. Soldiers with machine guns were guarding the metal detectors, and for the first time ever, you couldn't pass security to take your family member all the way to the gate. It's wild to think how normalized that has become since then.
I remember having family nearly all the way to the gate as well. I'm okay with scanning bags, I guess. What I really abhor are those nudie scanners and the pat down and making you pour out water and having to put liquids in the plastic bags. And sometimes some horrible little person would be shouting at people in the line up and puff themselves up with made up importance over this theatre and the small amount of power rush. Those people are the worst.
I think the US stopped using nudie scanners more than 10 years ago? I make a point of refusing them every single time. Oh they said images are deleted whatever, but I'm opposed to that kind of technology out of (probably dumb) principle.
They still use them. The software just defaults to only showing pictograms to the operators.
I can think of another reason why people might want to line up ahead of time, and that’s to be done as soon as possible.
I don’t do it personally but I can see why it happens. As long as I have yet to board the plane, I can’t relax… I have to stay vigilant to keep tabs on my luggage and to make sure I don’t miss being called to the counter for some reason. Once you’re sitting in your seat, all that’s done with and all you have to do is wait to arrive.
I stand up because I've been sitting for an hour, sometimes after a lot of airport walking while wrangling my carry-on ,and now I'm going to be sitting for a few more hours and standing is something different to do for a while. Might as well do it then.
The problems described in the article are compounded by airlines just generally being lax about the size of the carry ons that they allow people to bring on. People are bringing on hard sided cases that cannot fit on their side in the bins, so they're forced to lay them flat. I'm a very light traveler and I usually only bring a carry on that is at most 2/3rds the maximum size allowed, but I always worry that they'll make me gate check my bag because the people boarding in front of me have brought their gargantuan carry ons and filled up the bins.
The airlines, yes. I dont blame the flight or gate crew at all for not "enforcing" the size rule.
They're given hardly any time to get people boarded
the passengers are already super on edge, past security and maybe needing fast transfers
they're alone with no back up and will "cause" delays that cost the airline a ton of money if they say anything to the big-packers
if big-packers go insane on them people will whip out their phones and film gate crew trying to "enforce" something that looks incredibly petty ("it's half an inch!!!") because it is the airlines that are being petty
I honestly have no idea why they don't board the plane with the people furthest in the back first. It would save so much time and frustration.
in a sane world, absolutely: everybody line up knowing first in last out, families with super little kids board last.
But this is a capital driven world so you gotta make the plebs wait to artificially manufacture something worth selling. The first class people probably also get a kick out of boarding/de-boarding first and watching the poor scramble past them to their poor house seats, not find overhead compartment space, or go ALL the way to the back next to the rear washrooms.
there's no other reason why they need like, 5 different "zones"
Yay, I get to link one of my favorite CGP Grey videos!
Surprisingly neither back-to-front nor window-middle-aisle are the perfectly optimal strategy, because of the time it takes to stow carry-ons.
from video:
from linked article:
also from video:
in the days of yore before sensible leg rooms were taken away, people took less time to get into the window seats.
I'm reminded of the story about the game, Portal, where on one level play testers kept asking for reset buttons. Valve spent the time to actually look at why, and found out there's a trap that makes a level un-beatable. They fixed the trap, and viola, no more calls for resets.
The story here is that we don't NEED the perfect boarding method if they just go back to NOT charging for checked bags, give us our leg room back, and minimize the horrors of boarding last by not over-selling tickets and having fewer close-connections. Watch Airplane! again: it was a saner world.
When bags are checked at the gate, are those free? I wonder if that sets up some perverse incentive, where people, not wanting to pay the expensive fee for checked bags, hope that they can a free checked bag at the gate.
I'm flying out later today. My brother and I are taking a trip and we started talking about whether we're checking-in vs carrying-on. He was considering doing carry-on only. I, however, always check my luggage. Mainly because my carry-ons are my backpack and laptop bag, both containing electronics. I'm not checking those for fear of damage or theft.
But I also find lugging around luggage through an airport, onto the plane, off the plane, and through the airport again a hassle. All so, what, I can save 15min by not waiting at the baggage carousel?
That said, I do fly Southwest often. Everyone gets two checked bags free. I've also started flying Delta, where bags are not free (at least on the lower-end of tickets). But I signed up for one of their credit cards explicitly to get one free bag per flight. So I almost never pay for checked bags.
I've also never lost a checked bag (though all my bags are AirTagged) nor had one seriously damaged. Maybe my tune will change if/once that happens.
Maybe airlines need to take the example of the ULCCs like Spirit and Frontier and measure carry-ons at the gate or even desk. Though I know the their agents don't always size bags, either. Or remove the silly bag fees. Increase the ticket price so that everyone gets at least one checked bag free. How is it that Southwest manages to provide two "free" bags but no one else can?
I'm just kinda rambling at this point, so I'll stop. I need to finish (start) packing anyway!
The wait for bags to surface at the carousel is a big reason why I try to fly carryon-only when I can. Generally speaking when I’m in airports I’m moving quickly and so I’ll frequently end up at the carousel 15-20m ahead of the bags. I could’ve been out of the airport and halfway to my destination in the time I was standing there awkwardly waiting for my checked bag.
I used to travel a lot for business before the pandemic, usually quick turnaround 2-3 day trips. Especially if your booking a flight around the start or end of a meeting, not checking a bag can really save a lot of time. I got it down to a science where I could get to the airport 30 minutes before boarding, go through precheck, the walk onto the plane. It also gives you a lot more flexibility to take a different flight (even a different airline) because of delays or whatever without having to have your checked luggage chase you.
Thankfully the zoom meeting has replaced much of that travel, so I don't have to be away from my family nearly as much anymore.
For family vacation though, it's checked bags all the way. We can't (or don't want to) optimize our packing down to the essentials, like a business trip, and we're likely doing a wider variety of activities anyway.
Yes, they are free.
A few people I know bring a backpack and a suitcase that is exactly the allowed carry-on size and board last with the knowledge that there's a very low chance there will be space available when they get on.
That way they'll be able to get on (the bins usually fill up and they're asked to check before they get to the boarding ramp) and off the plane without digging through overhead bins or paying for the bag check.
That doesn't seem very wise? The bags are small enough to carry on and the bins aren't bad unless you board last so it seems to just cost time without much benefit.
I do this when I travel solo, so please allow me to explain.
Depends on personality type.
People shuffle off the plane front-to-back, but people don't sit in their seats until their cluster is next: they "aisle-lice" (see Gate Lice) immediately after they're allowed to take their seat belts off.
So what happens is that the most aisle lice'd individuals have their bags out first, and the aisle becomes immediately inundated with their bags, regardless of how far back they are standing.
If I had my own carry-on bag, I'd have to wait until there was physically room for my bag to be brought down. Which might involve waiting for the entire local cluster to have room to bring theirs down.
Without a bag, I say excuse me and walk right off. The aisles are just big enough for 2 people turned sideways: when the person in front of me is turned sideways getting their bag, I make my escape.
Now, it's true I will have to spend time at the carousel. But the carousel is much roomier than an airplane aisle, and I won't have to worry about people's bags falling onto my head or being elbowed during its descent.
I don't do it for time: I do it for safety. And because I don't want to pay for & carry around a second checked bag: there are carts at the carousel.
When you say that you say excuse me and walk right off, who are you talking to and what are you doing? Are you just cutting past everyone and getting off the plane? Most people just wait their turn regardless of if they have a bag in the overhead bin or not. I also don't see how standing even longer at the carousel is worth more than just staying in your seat on the plane. And I don't get what that has to do with safety.
Usually people leave in clumps, and when there's just me and one dude in front and then open aisle, I'll say excuse me and squeeze past while he gets his bag from the overhead.
I'm quite small in stature and had bags fall on me or been elbowed a few times while people are getting their bags.
It's not a lot of time saving total, but I would gladly trade time away from airplane aisle.
fwiw, if they require you to check carry-ons because of space, they're generally gate-checked and you thus don't have to wait for the baggage carousel.
I did this once, I was going for a weekend and only had a backpack with me. I was told I was being so rude to get off as before everyone else, when I had been waiting to go to the bathroom since we couldn't get up during the flight.
Very interesting..... I've not been told I was rude doing this but I can see it being interpreted this way. To be clear I wouldn't "squeeze" past one or max two people, and only if they're busy grabbing their stuff, definitely not passing folks who are already ready to move.
Which is so funny because once we're out of the plane on the connecting bridge, passing becomes suddenly super acceptable, with folks nearly running others over with their wheelie carry-ons.
Agreed! I wasn't squeezing past anyone, I just got up with my stuff, since it was all under the seat in front of me and walked up the empty aisle as soon as they told us it was ok to get up.
15 minutes would be a dream in Toronto. Pearson is a nightmare for luggage.
I was going to say something similar. I've never waited only 15 minutes for baggage. I have waited 4 hours at Pearson to get my bags, being ushered back and forth between numerous carousels while being told our bags are "arriving soon", after having landed 2 hours late.
That was pre-pandemic, and from what I've heard, it's only gotten worse since. I haven't checked a bag in years, and I don't particularly want to travel with people who need to. Everything I need for a week easily fits in a single carry-on sized suitcase. If I'm going for more than a week, I'll find a laundromat.
(EDIT: to be clear, the 4 hour wait was an anomaly, even for Pearson, though waiting an hour was pretty typical.)
yup. and then during the pandemic things really hit the fan. Wasn't it voted worst airport of north america twice in a row? let me see --
2022 July: Pearson worst in the world (citynews)
different ranking, 2023 second worst in North America before Newark Jersey (cp24)
When given a choice I always fly over Toronto. If not, Montreal. They lost our suitcase for a wedding in 2022 and we were stranded for nearly a whole day. yuck.
Jfc. I think the longest I've waited at the carousel is like 30min. Both at my home airport, MCI (KC) and other larger airports. Technically I've waited a longer a couple times as my bags were delayed, but I just had the airline drop them off at my hotel/home.
Yeah, that makes sense why you might want to do carry-on only...
It's not worse than that now, though it was bad in the post-covid rush. I'd say 45 minutes on average these days, which is still disgraceful compared to Calgary or Vancouver.
This has happened to me a few times, and it's always left me more in awe at how hard an airline will try to get a bag back to you than annoyance at it happening in the first place.
I've had bags get delayed, but not lost. Once on American, and there was medication in the bag because I was forced to gate check it, and didn't have time to dig through to get my medication. I was without for a few days, and it sucked. I tried to get American to get my bag to me sooner, and they just didn't care (edited because I forgot my train of thought).
United delayed our bags by half a day on our honeymoon last year and not only did they give us a whole kit, they gave us each $200 to purchase necessary clothing items at our destination (Disney World), and a flight voucher for $200 each on our next flight with them. Best experience I've ever had flying, and it's made us United customers.
We usually fly Southwest, but for long-haul flights, we will now only fly United. Southwest will stay our Disneyland airline of choice because it's usually under $100/person round trip.
I used to fly back and forth across the US for work on a route that always required a transfer. I would always gladly volunteer to check my bag on the return flight to avoid having to deal with it on the plane and transfer terminal with the thought that I didn't care if it took a few extra days for my dirty clothes to get home -- my important stuff was in my backpack. It helped that my destination airport was a small one and the bags were almost always ready almost as soon as I got downstairs. I've never once had a lost bag.
Can’t check laptops because of the batteries. Anything that fits under a seat the airplane staff will ignore, so laptop bags and small backpacks don’t get checked either. Medical devices don’t get checked either.
I honestly have never had to wait more than a few minutes for my bags to arrive and the carrousel. I spend more time waiting for a ride share to pick me up.
This is one of those problems I keep hearing about, but never actually encountered. I always fly with a back pack full of my most breakable/valuable possessions. Now that I have a baby my wife and I have even more stuff to carry.
But I've never had trouble with storing things. Not once in my life have I gotten to my seat and not been able to find space. On the other hand I've had my checked luggage lost quite a few times. Usually on long flights with a short layover like they just didn't have time to put it on the next plane.
My big problem with the overhead bins are the people who just sit there when the plane lands and don't bother getting their stuff together until it's their turn and they should he walking up the aisle.
I hope you know that you can check a car seat for free. If you put it in something like this carry bag, you can even put some extra clothes and things in the with it, as long as you don't go crazy. I recommend one with wheels.
You can also gate-check a stroller for free, which is a godsend if you have a connection because you'll get it back in the connecting airport.
When your baby is over 2 and can no longer be on the lap, I highly recommend a CARES harness. This harness is FAA approved, but the parenting win is that it keeps them restrained in the seat during the flight, and
it is much more portable than trying to use a carseat.
How does that CARES harness work with passenger behind you? Looks like it would cover their screen or get in the way of their tray table.
You put the tray on the back of the seat down, put the strap around the seat, then put the tray back up again. After that, the person can use the tray normally.
Since you are (hopefully) early boarding with little kids, then usually you have time to do it before the other person is even there, but I never had anyone give me flack about it. Most people who have kids are understanding, and the ones that don't are at least happy that the child will not be running around the cabin.
You can also bring the car seat onto the plane, secure it with the seatbelt, and strap the kid into that. It's a more familiar environment for them, and the harness tends to be more secure in case you have a particularly determined runner.
Fair enough. My daughter was pretty mellow as a toddler. When we tried, our car seat (chicco key fit) proved to be too big to fit. "Approved for air travel", it turns out, does not mean "approved by airline". With the bulkhead seats all being premium seats these days, it's not so easy for them to swap you.
Ah, good to know. We never tried it ourselves, but have friends who swear by it. I wonder which car seat model they use.
I remember full size car seats being super hard to install (no LATCH anchors) and can't imagine travelling with one....but maybe things have changed.
Friendly note that not all car seats are FAA approved for flight, and they also have a special no bucket seat belt thingy too.
the buckets are so heavy....But if one can push a bucket compatible stroller all the way to the plane door, maybe it's worth it.
The only downside is that it also brings the kid closer to the seat in front of them, so when they kick, it's a lot harder. Though I am 100% ok with kids being safely restrained, even if it means I might get a kick to the head.
Usually, yes. If the gate agent predicts that they'll need to gate-check some certain number of bags, and asks for volunteers to do it, then it's free. If that's not the case, you aren't entitled to just waltz up there and ask them to do it for free. They might do it, but they're not obligated to.
I don't think so... you won't get through security with a full-size bag. So at best, it'll be just slightly larger than the maximum allowed size carry-on anyway. You've also had to go through the hassle that you've described of lugging your luggage through the airport.
I do think that checked bag fees were the start of this nonsense. At the same time, they reduced the staffing required to deal with checked luggage. So now, the longest line you'll often wait in at the airport is the one to check your bag, unless you have enough status with the airline to get into a priority line. Airlines have made dealing with luggage be a bottleneck of air travel in general.
I fly enough to have platinum status with Delta, so I often check a bag and just carry a backpack that I could stuff under my seat. Status gets me into the shorter bag-check line, the free checked bag, and supposed faster bag retrieval (they tag it with a special tag which is supposed to come out earlier on the luggage carousel, but I've had mixed results with that). Then I can hang out in the lounge a little and arrive at the gate 20m before departure to take my seat without fighting with anyone over bin space.
That being said, I also sometime fly with Breeze airways since they have a nonstop to some places I travel to, which charges for both checked and carry-on bags, and are very restrictive on bag sizes. People are more mindful of their luggage compared to Delta, and I haven't experienced these issues with them.
See the Wikipedia article on Enshittification. It's a term origin coined by Cory Doctorow in reference to media related services, but it's everywhere now.