To be honest this whole thing sounds kinda cool. I hope they get the stuff back but at the same time it’s entertaining that this really happened. A glass disc cutter? Speeding away on motorcycles...
To be honest this whole thing sounds kinda cool. I hope they get the stuff back but at the same time it’s entertaining that this really happened. A glass disc cutter? Speeding away on motorcycles through Paris? It’s right out of a movie.
...Okay but that would make for a hilarious sting operation. Movie executives asking the thieves to come forward so they can work out a deal for rights to the story. Would it work? Probably not....
...Okay but that would make for a hilarious sting operation. Movie executives asking the thieves to come forward so they can work out a deal for rights to the story.
Would it work? Probably not. But it'd be hilarious if it did.
There’s a fun Atlantic article about the heist: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/10/praise-louvre-heist/684677/?gift=kLlKg644lhDM0dtrZznOmDp6xqRt0kfxMSM1ioQoHDM
Got an audible chuckle out of me. The whole article is great, but that line in particular caught me off guard in just the right way.
The assumption seems to be that none but a highly experienced criminal architect could have come up with a plan to access an unmonitored second-floor balcony via a ladder.
Got an audible chuckle out of me. The whole article is great, but that line in particular caught me off guard in just the right way.
There have been reports about this to the ministry of culture each year for a while now. For those paying attention, it’s a known fact. See also...
There have been reports about this to the ministry of culture each year for a while now. For those paying attention, it’s a known fact. See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St%C3%A9phane_Breitwieser who stole 3bn euros worth of stuff and whose mother destroyed a lot of it. He says it’s easier to steal from a museum than from a supermarket.
Which raises the question, why even store one-of-a-kind, priceless historical artifacts on displays in publicly-accessible, insecure locations, rather than storing them in highly secure,...
Which raises the question, why even store one-of-a-kind, priceless historical artifacts on displays in publicly-accessible, insecure locations, rather than storing them in highly secure, environmentally controlled vaults & instead display dupes of those items in publicly-accessible, insecure locations. Especially with 2020s technology allowing you to scan and print items with all their nooks and gcrannies. I know some museums already doing this but more should at least consider it :P
I mean, another way to look at it is, why even store them if you're not going to display them? These are items of worth because of their contribution to France's national history and identity....
I mean, another way to look at it is, why even store them if you're not going to display them? These are items of worth because of their contribution to France's national history and identity. Otherwise, they're just some pretty rocks. Insignificant compared to, say, France's gold reserves, or France's foreign currency reserves.
By displaying them in a museum, they're useful, to impress, to educate, to instill French culture and history. Locked up in a vault, what is even the difference between them not existing?
So academic professionals & others can study those for centuries to come, under access control, and advance their sciences - just how we already do for other things, which are not displayed in...
why even store them if you're not going to display them?
So academic professionals & others can study those for centuries to come, under access control, and advance their sciences - just how we already do for other things, which are not displayed in museums. And so other museums can create accurate models of said items and display them.
Otherwise, they're just some pretty rocks.
Disagree.
These are items of worth because of their contribution to France's national history and identity. [...] Locked up in a vault, what is even the difference between them not existing?
Then [they should] guard them appropriately so it's not easier to steal France's national treasure than from a supermarket...?
What are they supposed to study? I think we know how diamonds, silver, and gold works pretty well at this point, scientifically. Most of the crown jewels stolen were contemporaneous with Napoleon...
What are they supposed to study? I think we know how diamonds, silver, and gold works pretty well at this point, scientifically. Most of the crown jewels stolen were contemporaneous with Napoleon III, so it's not exactly ancient history.
Not to mention that they can be pretty easily documented to such a degree that any historians have more than enough data permanently available to them in digital form.
Then [they should] guard them appropriately so it's not easier to steal France's national treasure than from a supermarket...?
Did anyone argue that they shouldn't have defended them more? I'm confused where this line even comes up. My argument is mainly that there is little inherent value in stuffing the crown jewels in a vault where no one ever sees them. No one said they should be undefended.
I mean, for reference, at one point one of the French Republics sold all the jewels the government owned to raise funds and because they detested the idea of having monarchial items like "crown jewels". They were reacquired for display in louvre.
The core of my original comment is that it's that it's comical to put your (and/or others') irreplaceable national treasures on display in areas so insecure & easier to rob than a supermarket....
The core of my original comment is that it's that it's comical to put your (and/or others') irreplaceable national treasures on display in areas so insecure & easier to rob than a supermarket. [They can] fix their security holes any way they want, for all I care, following a proper risk assessment. That aside, for me, I legitimately do not give the tiniest of fucks whether I'm seeing a nearly indistinguishable (without very close scrutiny) model of <whatever> in a museum, rather than the original item, because those aforementioned models contain any surface-level information that I, a visitor amateurishly interested in various humanitarian sciences, would be there to see in the first place. Surface-level information that, again, is not wholly contained in plain 2D projections of the original item.
I think they should guard them well. The cultural value of these things imo far exceeds the monetary value, and they are irreplaceable. But we should still allow the public to view them. I would...
I think they should guard them well. The cultural value of these things imo far exceeds the monetary value, and they are irreplaceable. But we should still allow the public to view them.
I would never go to a museum that only shows replicas. The way I see it then I might as well look up a picture online and save myself the trip.
I also question how much value there is in holding it for future study. At that point you're holding out for technological progress unveiling something new. This has happened a lot with paintings, sure. We are now able to analyse all the layers underneath the painting, including whole new drawings, or analyse the individual pigments. But at some point what else could you possibly want to know about a painting that you can never actually see? What is there still left to do here that they can't study on a replica themselves?
What point is there in preserving it if there's nothing to preserve it for.
That way you are taking it away from the public and keeping it for only a handful of elites to look at. The peasants get pictures.
It should be guarded and preserved very well. But in a place where the general public can come and view it. What is the point of art if not to look at it?
Because the patrons of museums, especially huge famous ones, are less likely to make the trek to visit rooms full of fakes? If people know they aren't seeing the thing anyway why would they bother...
Because the patrons of museums, especially huge famous ones, are less likely to make the trek to visit rooms full of fakes? If people know they aren't seeing the thing anyway why would they bother to go in person at all?
Maybe a local education focused museum could get away with it, but it would kind of kill the draw of destination museums. The places schools field trip to would be fine, but I doubt the same would be true of ones people fly to.
There's also a separate thing that I can't say I have real personal opinions on, but I think some very art-interested people would say something like, "Art should be experienced, not locked up in darkness."
We do populate paleontology exhibits with fakes, but I suppose people go there to see the shape and size of ancient things. And fossils themselves are as much a replica as the cast of a fossil is.
We do populate paleontology exhibits with fakes, but I suppose people go there to see the shape and size of ancient things. And fossils themselves are as much a replica as the cast of a fossil is.
A few years back I went to the Royal Tyrrell Museum, which is the most popular dinosaur museum in western Canada. They have a really cool approach of having a mixture of real fossils and casts...
A few years back I went to the Royal Tyrrell Museum, which is the most popular dinosaur museum in western Canada. They have a really cool approach of having a mixture of real fossils and casts displayed. They also mention for each exhibit if it is a cast or original. At the very start there is a large t-rex displayed, where the skull on the body is a cast, and the real skull is on the ground since they couldn't mount the original at the top of the neck due to weight. While the casts were still really cool and informative, there was something special when seeing the originals
True, although I think those tend to fall more into the category of local education museums than destination museums. I think that when going to the large ones, like Smithsonian history ones for...
True, although I think those tend to fall more into the category of local education museums than destination museums. I think that when going to the large ones, like Smithsonian history ones for example, the expection is that the exhibit is as real as it can be.
Well, the huge famous ones are also often the ones who intentionally aggregated artefacts from all around the world, sometimes unethically. It's a problem they brought upon themselves. And then,...
Well, the huge famous ones are also often the ones who intentionally aggregated artefacts from all around the world, sometimes unethically. It's a problem they brought upon themselves. And then, if someone (or the environment itself, e.g. oxidation, mold...) destroys those artefacts or if they get stolen/lost, you've lost a piece of history. Even more so if you didn't build an accurate dupe for it a priori.
Plus, you can definitely still have reasons to go see things in person, even if they're dupes. It's one thing to see a 2D projection of the thing in a picture, and another to see a full 3D thing with all its details. Personally I've visited hundreds of museums in my life, including art museums, and I didn't mind. Not to mention that, in a sizable subset of those cases, the reason dupes were there in the first place was that the actual artefact is had been taken to one of those mega-museums, whether ethically or unethically.
I don't think it's really fair to bring up museums taking artifacts unethically from around the world as a point in your favor when the point of view you're arguing for -- an insistence on the...
I don't think it's really fair to bring up museums taking artifacts unethically from around the world as a point in your favor when the point of view you're arguing for -- an insistence on the need to "properly preserve" relevant artifacts and the idea that preventing such work from being displayed or held in anything less than the safest conditions -- is one of the most common arguments made in favor of taking, keeping, and refusing demands to return those unethical acquisitions.
It's their argument, indeed, but it's a pinocchio-faced argument, if anything. E.g. see the multiple damages the Greek section of the british museum has sustained over the last decade.
It's their argument, indeed, but it's a pinocchio-faced argument, if anything. E.g. see the multiple damages the Greek section of the british museum has sustained over the last decade.
And the damage to the artifacts themselves in the first place - the "collectors" were often just taking the things they liked best not the historically relevant things or keeping pieces together....
And the damage to the artifacts themselves in the first place - the "collectors" were often just taking the things they liked best not the historically relevant things or keeping pieces together.
(Someone compared the way certain people decorated with Egyptian relics with the modern Japan loving "weeaboo" and I can't unsee it.)
True, but that response still relies on the underlying logic that if the British Museum were the safest and most secure place for storing these artifacts, it would be ethically justified for them...
True, but that response still relies on the underlying logic that if the British Museum were the safest and most secure place for storing these artifacts, it would be ethically justified for them to keep them. I don't think that's the case.
Because that costs money and the French government has been trying to shrink every budget possible. Culture isn’t exactly super high on the list of things to spend on… so they just hope that...
Because that costs money and the French government has been trying to shrink every budget possible. Culture isn’t exactly super high on the list of things to spend on… so they just hope that whatever the result of these cuts is, it’ll happen to the next guy and not the one that made the cuts/extended the cuts. A story as old as time.
You really can get anywhere with a hard hat and a basket lift. This really does feel like somebody should be checking whether Danny Ocean got out of jail recently
You really can get anywhere with a hard hat and a clipboard basket lift.
This really does feel like somebody should be checking whether Danny Ocean got out of jail recently
So, thanks to this article, I just discovered that the Mona Lisa was stolen from the Louvre in 1911, and missing for 2+ years, and that--apparently--it was the media notoriety around this theft...
So, thanks to this article, I just discovered that the Mona Lisa was stolen from the Louvre in 1911, and missing for 2+ years, and that--apparently--it was the media notoriety around this theft that actually made the painting the iconic legend it is today.
Bonus: The Italian thief claimed to have stolen it for patriotic reasons, having believed that Napoleon stole it from Italy and that he (the thief) wanted to return it to its homeland ... apparently unaware that da Vinci personally gave the painting to France.
I know it’s a meme that the Mona Lisa is small, but I saw it in person, and it actually didn’t seem that small. The Louvre makes you stand pretty far from it for crowd control. They also put it in...
I know it’s a meme that the Mona Lisa is small, but I saw it in person, and it actually didn’t seem that small. The Louvre makes you stand pretty far from it for crowd control. They also put it in a large room with a bunch of huge pictures in it. Directly across was an entire floor to ceiling paining. It is absolutely the smallest picture in the room, but it didn’t seem particularly small. Wikipedia claims it’s just under 3ft by 2ft, which is honestly pretty reasonable for a paining hung in a normal house.
The German company that makes the little bucket truck they used in the heist has turned this into a marketing opportunity with an ad saying "WENN'S MAL WIEDER SCHNELL GEHEN MUSS" "When you need to...
The German company that makes the little bucket truck they used in the heist has turned this into a marketing opportunity with an ad saying "WENN'S MAL WIEDER SCHNELL GEHEN MUSS"
Alumil apparently also made one: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/alumil_alumil-buildingexcellenceeveryday-activity-7386750821671112704-Mq8u That's the YUROPean banter I live for!!1
Well that's a fun headline. And a fun news story, it really does seem straight out of a movie. I almost wonder if the thieves did it just to see if they could.
Well that's a fun headline. And a fun news story, it really does seem straight out of a movie. I almost wonder if the thieves did it just to see if they could.
Recovery may prove difficult. “It’s unlikely these jewels will ever be seen again,” said Tobias Kormind, managing director of 77 Diamonds. “Professional crews often break down and re-cut large, recognizable stones to evade detection, effectively erasing their provenance.”
What I don't understand is if the intention was to cut and sell untraceable diamonds, why steal crown jewels from the Louvre? You could have just robbed a jewelry store or something. I mean, I...
What I don't understand is if the intention was to cut and sell untraceable diamonds, why steal crown jewels from the Louvre? You could have just robbed a jewelry store or something. I mean, I think some oligarch somewhere would pay top dollars for the jewels now that they have a story attached to them. Seems like a waste to just cut them up and sell them as if they were any old stone.
Then again, maybe they did it because security at jewelry stores is much higher than at the Louvre!
Part of it might just be prestige. I expect they'll keep at least a few of the jewels for themselves as mementos. Also... There's a LOT of jewels in some of the crown jewels compared to regular...
Part of it might just be prestige. I expect they'll keep at least a few of the jewels for themselves as mementos.
Also... There's a LOT of jewels in some of the crown jewels compared to regular jewelry. Not sure how many diamonds are in the average jewelry store, but I expect most don't have a single piece with 1,300+ diamonds. From skimming the Louvre's pages for each item linked by this article, a couple of the pieces had a thousand-plus diamonds and double-digits for the other jewels. I don't know how many pieces of regular jewelry you'd need to steal to get the same number of jewels, but probably a lot more than eight.
There may be political motivatations to the theft though. I've seen plenty of people complain about the existence of crown jewels given they're literal symbols of extravagance and wealth. So stealing them is a decent payday and serves as a middle finger to the uber-wealthy.
my guess is that they take it all, cut down some stuff for immediate profit, then trade the rest almost like markers or sell them through a fence. And like you said, lots of rich pricks are...
my guess is that they take it all, cut down some stuff for immediate profit, then trade the rest almost like markers or sell them through a fence. And like you said, lots of rich pricks are willing to have stolen items in their private collections that most people would likely never see.
In the movies they'd offer a split of money and heroin (at wholesale) or something... probably happens in real life, too.
The benefit of robbing a place like the Louvre is that its way bigger and, in a way, less protected. They're relying on glass and stuff in addition to guards. Add in the mass of tourists and all and it creates a chaos that can work in your favor. With a store, it'll be a small space with one exit, easily tripped alarms, etc etc -- way riskier and you might not even come away with genuine pieces.
The other thing about the Louvre is that its constantly under construction in some form. These guys used that to work their way in with ease. Like others said, you can get anywhere in the world with a clipboard.
It'll be interesting to see if these guys get caught. Their approach really plays into that 'gentleman thief' trope.
That's why I wonder if it was done just for fun. However, they also don't need to sell them whole. The mention of them retrieving Eugenie's crown in a "broken" state reminded me of the second Pink...
That's why I wonder if it was done just for fun. However, they also don't need to sell them whole. The mention of them retrieving Eugenie's crown in a "broken" state reminded me of the second Pink Panther movie from 2009. Dumb as it was, it made a point that stuck with me about how the Pink Panther diamond could be broken into smaller diamonds and sold without being recognizable.
The article mentioned Eugenie's crown has (or maybe had) more than 1,300 small diamonds in it, and the others also have a lot of smaller jewels besides the most eye-catching pieces. While the crown jewels are more valuable whole, the individual jewels still have a lot of value overall. I expect it would be fairly easy to sell those to various stores without arousing suspicion.
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private...
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private collection.
There was Breitwieser so certainly not impossible it was for non-profit motives, but given the number of people and equipment involved that seems unlikely. Pretty much all the high-profile art...
There was Breitwieser so certainly not impossible it was for non-profit motives, but given the number of people and equipment involved that seems unlikely.
Pretty much all the high-profile art thefts seem movie-like if you dig into them--though some are comedies.
Two suspects arrested in connection with the theft of France’s crown jewels from the Louvre museum have admitted involvement in the heist and have been remanded in custody, the Paris prosecutor’s office said on Wednesday.
The Paris prosecutor also said the stolen jewels are not in the authorities’ possession.
Both suspects were presented before an investigative judge on Wednesday and placed under formal investigation for organized theft and criminal conspiracy, according to Paris Prosecutor Laure Beccuau.
The two men were arrested Saturday evening and held in custody, where they were questioned for 96 hours. Two additional suspects remain at large.
Brings to mind the consideration of whether we should pay attention to such things (or even publish news about them), as the fame (infamy) may fuel and encourage future similar crimes. Similarly,...
Brings to mind the consideration of whether we should pay attention to such things (or even publish news about them), as the fame (infamy) may fuel and encourage future similar crimes. Similarly, some argue that mass shooters, etc. should not be named or depicted (face) in news, for similar reasons (though coverage of the tragic events themselves would be acceptable).
I'm wondering how they expect to convert that famous jewelry into cash. Maybe they already had a private buyer lined up - that's the only thing I can think of.
I'm wondering how they expect to convert that famous jewelry into cash.
Maybe they already had a private buyer lined up - that's the only thing I can think of.
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private...
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private collection.
Yes, but 10% that's untrackable is far more valuable to the thieves than 100% that is entirely unique in the world and easily traceable back to this one theft.
Yes, but 10% that's untrackable is far more valuable to the thieves than 100% that is entirely unique in the world and easily traceable back to this one theft.
offtopic, but i wish we had a proper heist video game where we have to plan everything ourselves and it isn’t all set out… and if we do get away, there’s an investigation going on in the...
offtopic, but i wish we had a proper heist video game where we have to plan everything ourselves and it isn’t all set out… and if we do get away, there’s an investigation going on in the background while we are doing other in-game things.
on topic, i hope we eventually get to see a lot of cctv footage.
Perfect Heist 2 is kind of this, but it's much more comical and the planning is fairly minimal. But it's a relatively good, if goofy, facsimile of doing heists.
Perfect Heist 2 is kind of this, but it's much more comical and the planning is fairly minimal. But it's a relatively good, if goofy, facsimile of doing heists.
I should have left a link - I actually meant Perfect Heist 2 which I don't think is affiliated with Starbreeze. Though agreed, they are a dumpster fire right now.
I should have left a link - I actually meant Perfect Heist 2 which I don't think is affiliated with Starbreeze. Though agreed, they are a dumpster fire right now.
yesss! sort of a mix of GTA RP with the spreadsheets of EvE. There was a massive bank heist or something a few years ago in GTA RP --- something like five banks. That sort of thing would be fun.
yesss! sort of a mix of GTA RP with the spreadsheets of EvE. There was a massive bank heist or something a few years ago in GTA RP --- something like five banks. That sort of thing would be fun.
I think that's just called Eve. Corporate assassination, emptying of corp/alliance wallets & hangars, taking down outposts/citadels, spais doing spai things, has definitely happened in Eve already!
GTA RP with the spreadsheets of EvE
I think that's just called Eve. Corporate assassination, emptying of corp/alliance wallets & hangars, taking down outposts/citadels, spais doing spai things, has definitely happened in Eve already!
haha an old buddy tried to get me into Eve. I should try it again.... but everybody was super rich and I didnt know how to do anything but fly to one place and back. I saw that one crazy video...
haha an old buddy tried to get me into Eve. I should try it again.... but everybody was super rich and I didnt know how to do anything but fly to one place and back.
I saw that one crazy video from a few years back... that has to be the coolest thing thats ever happened.
It's for sure a bit tough to start. The trick if finding a good corp to join. I know some folks go straight into null sec blocs/alliances, which isn't a bad option either. You get lots of support,...
It's for sure a bit tough to start. The trick if finding a good corp to join. I know some folks go straight into null sec blocs/alliances, which isn't a bad option either. You get lots of support, lots of people to play with, lots of things to do -- mining, ratting (PVE), small- and large-scale PVP, scouting/explo, etc -- right off the bat.
But man Eve can be a serious time suck. I "won eve" (AKA quit for the Nth time) about a year half ago after playing mostly straight from 2018. I had last, "for real," played Eve in the late 2000s. And I went hard this last time. Went into the null blocs and got heavily involved in PVP warfare. So many nights of waking up at like 3am or 4am in the middle of the week -- keep in mind, I had to work in the morning -- just to get on some expeditionary fleet to go blow up enemy ships and stuff. I got involved in some of the largest battles ever. Like 8000+ players in a single system, in a fight that took 10+ hrs. I think the longest I did was 14hrs. That said, that's not super fun, but it is cool just to be a part of.
And yes, I had my spreadsheets, lol. Mine were never that complicated. But I came across some that hooked into the game's API to pull live data and what not. Crazy stuff.
that’s so awesome. i think the somethingawful has one… there are goons in everything. 14hrs is bananas. the coordination and orchestration of that is really impressive. i’m really good with...
that’s so awesome. i think the somethingawful has one… there are goons in everything. 14hrs is bananas. the coordination and orchestration of that is really impressive.
i’m really good with spreadsheets and stuff, so that does add an extra draw. ok, thanks!! i’ll definitely look into this.
As a former Pandemic Horde member for years...NOOO NOT GOONS! GRR GONS HAT GONS Nah but for real, it's hard to go wrong with any of the big open blocs. My understanding is that they have a lot of...
As a former Pandemic Horde member for years...NOOO NOT GOONS! GRR GONS HAT GONS
Nah but for real, it's hard to go wrong with any of the big open blocs. My understanding is that they have a lot of really good programs for line members. Like Horde, I imagine they have lots of programs to help noobs. I think they do full ship replacement, or SRP, as opposed to just partial. Basically, if you lose your ship on a sanctioned fleet op, they'll give you the money back to buy a new one or buy something else. Their industrial and logistics (meaning cargo moving, and not Eve's "logistics" which means ships that can repair or heal) side was/is practically unparalleled. Plus, it seems they've gotten rid of some of the more toxic leaders over the last several years.
Eve is tons of fun. I quit because I was getting bored after playing for like 6-7yrs. But I'll be back at some point. Really, I'm just on hiatus. No one ever "wins Eve" permanently.
that’s amazing, actually. seems like PH is the way to go. It’s such a pretty game, too. it’s nice that the crew seems pretty relaxed wrt time commitment and all, too. whoever makes those videos is...
that’s amazing, actually. seems like PH is the way to go. It’s such a pretty game, too. it’s nice that the crew seems pretty relaxed wrt time commitment and all, too.
Maybe you get brought in for questioning and either it's setup so you have dialog options or maybe real time ecents for like 30 minutes straight to simulate them trying to wear you down.
there’s an investigation going on in the background
Maybe you get brought in for questioning and either it's setup so you have dialog options or maybe real time ecents for like 30 minutes straight to simulate them trying to wear you down.
Monkey Island but also Rififi and The Thomas Crown Affair! a game trying to break you would be hilarious. You see your partner eating McDonalds as he walks by the window...
Monkey Island but also Rififi and The Thomas Crown Affair!
a game trying to break you would be hilarious. You see your partner eating McDonalds as he walks by the window...
Thats so laughable. One look at that trailer and you can tell it has such a strong African vibe that it's probably made by African people. A quick search and ya... the studio, Nyamakop, (if the...
Thats so laughable. One look at that trailer and you can tell it has such a strong African vibe that it's probably made by African people. A quick search and ya... the studio, Nyamakop, (if the name isn't hint enough) is in South Africa.
I feel like something with levels designed similarly to those in Hitman games but with some way to make the gameplay more about planning than improvising would be really interesting... expensive...
I feel like something with levels designed similarly to those in Hitman games but with some way to make the gameplay more about planning than improvising would be really interesting... expensive and difficult to design, perhaps, but interesting.
To be honest this whole thing sounds kinda cool. I hope they get the stuff back but at the same time it’s entertaining that this really happened. A glass disc cutter? Speeding away on motorcycles through Paris? It’s right out of a movie.
I bet studios are already having meetings! If this is not a movie before 2030 I would be surprised!
...Okay but that would make for a hilarious sting operation. Movie executives asking the thieves to come forward so they can work out a deal for rights to the story.
Would it work? Probably not. But it'd be hilarious if it did.
There’s a fun Atlantic article about the heist: https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2025/10/praise-louvre-heist/684677/?gift=kLlKg644lhDM0dtrZznOmDp6xqRt0kfxMSM1ioQoHDM
Got an audible chuckle out of me. The whole article is great, but that line in particular caught me off guard in just the right way.
A truly historic I-told-you-so. Makes you wonder if the thieves had read about these same issues and identified them as a key weakness to exploit.
Thankfully, the museum managed to save several thousand dollars on staffing costs.
Now they can save even more: less items to guard means layoffs can commence.
This is a true everybody-wins situation.
Corporate downsizing!
Plot twist, it was the staff! I'll make this movie.
Honestly it probably was. Probably all sorts of disgruntled employees past and present with the insider knowledge to help plan this.
There have been reports about this to the ministry of culture each year for a while now. For those paying attention, it’s a known fact. See also https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/St%C3%A9phane_Breitwieser who stole 3bn euros worth of stuff and whose mother destroyed a lot of it. He says it’s easier to steal from a museum than from a supermarket.
Which raises the question, why even store one-of-a-kind, priceless historical artifacts on displays in publicly-accessible, insecure locations, rather than storing them in highly secure, environmentally controlled vaults & instead display dupes of those items in publicly-accessible, insecure locations. Especially with 2020s technology allowing you to scan and print items with all their nooks and
gcrannies. I know some museums already doing this but more should at least consider it :PI mean, another way to look at it is, why even store them if you're not going to display them? These are items of worth because of their contribution to France's national history and identity. Otherwise, they're just some pretty rocks. Insignificant compared to, say, France's gold reserves, or France's foreign currency reserves.
By displaying them in a museum, they're useful, to impress, to educate, to instill French culture and history. Locked up in a vault, what is even the difference between them not existing?
If a tree falls in a forest and all.
So academic professionals & others can study those for centuries to come, under access control, and advance their sciences - just how we already do for other things, which are not displayed in museums. And so other museums can create accurate models of said items and display them.
Disagree.
Then [they should] guard them appropriately so it's not easier to steal France's national treasure than from a supermarket...?
What are they supposed to study? I think we know how diamonds, silver, and gold works pretty well at this point, scientifically. Most of the crown jewels stolen were contemporaneous with Napoleon III, so it's not exactly ancient history.
Not to mention that they can be pretty easily documented to such a degree that any historians have more than enough data permanently available to them in digital form.
Did anyone argue that they shouldn't have defended them more? I'm confused where this line even comes up. My argument is mainly that there is little inherent value in stuffing the crown jewels in a vault where no one ever sees them. No one said they should be undefended.
I mean, for reference, at one point one of the French Republics sold all the jewels the government owned to raise funds and because they detested the idea of having monarchial items like "crown jewels". They were reacquired for display in louvre.
The core of my original comment is that it's that it's comical to put your (and/or others') irreplaceable national treasures on display in areas so insecure & easier to rob than a supermarket. [They can] fix their security holes any way they want, for all I care, following a proper risk assessment. That aside, for me, I legitimately do not give the tiniest of fucks whether I'm seeing a nearly indistinguishable (without very close scrutiny) model of <whatever> in a museum, rather than the original item, because those aforementioned models contain any surface-level information that I, a visitor amateurishly interested in various humanitarian sciences, would be there to see in the first place. Surface-level information that, again, is not wholly contained in plain 2D projections of the original item.
I think they should guard them well. The cultural value of these things imo far exceeds the monetary value, and they are irreplaceable. But we should still allow the public to view them.
I would never go to a museum that only shows replicas. The way I see it then I might as well look up a picture online and save myself the trip.
I also question how much value there is in holding it for future study. At that point you're holding out for technological progress unveiling something new. This has happened a lot with paintings, sure. We are now able to analyse all the layers underneath the painting, including whole new drawings, or analyse the individual pigments. But at some point what else could you possibly want to know about a painting that you can never actually see? What is there still left to do here that they can't study on a replica themselves?
What point is there in preserving it if there's nothing to preserve it for.
That way you are taking it away from the public and keeping it for only a handful of elites to look at. The peasants get pictures.
It should be guarded and preserved very well. But in a place where the general public can come and view it. What is the point of art if not to look at it?
Because the patrons of museums, especially huge famous ones, are less likely to make the trek to visit rooms full of fakes? If people know they aren't seeing the thing anyway why would they bother to go in person at all?
Maybe a local education focused museum could get away with it, but it would kind of kill the draw of destination museums. The places schools field trip to would be fine, but I doubt the same would be true of ones people fly to.
There's also a separate thing that I can't say I have real personal opinions on, but I think some very art-interested people would say something like, "Art should be experienced, not locked up in darkness."
We do populate paleontology exhibits with fakes, but I suppose people go there to see the shape and size of ancient things. And fossils themselves are as much a replica as the cast of a fossil is.
A few years back I went to the Royal Tyrrell Museum, which is the most popular dinosaur museum in western Canada. They have a really cool approach of having a mixture of real fossils and casts displayed. They also mention for each exhibit if it is a cast or original. At the very start there is a large t-rex displayed, where the skull on the body is a cast, and the real skull is on the ground since they couldn't mount the original at the top of the neck due to weight. While the casts were still really cool and informative, there was something special when seeing the originals
True, although I think those tend to fall more into the category of local education museums than destination museums. I think that when going to the large ones, like Smithsonian history ones for example, the expection is that the exhibit is as real as it can be.
Well, the huge famous ones are also often the ones who intentionally aggregated artefacts from all around the world, sometimes unethically. It's a problem they brought upon themselves. And then, if someone (or the environment itself, e.g. oxidation, mold...) destroys those artefacts or if they get stolen/lost, you've lost a piece of history. Even more so if you didn't build an accurate dupe for it a priori.
Plus, you can definitely still have reasons to go see things in person, even if they're dupes. It's one thing to see a 2D projection of the thing in a picture, and another to see a full 3D thing with all its details. Personally I've visited hundreds of museums in my life, including art museums, and I didn't mind. Not to mention that, in a sizable subset of those cases, the reason dupes were there in the first place was that the actual artefact is had been taken to one of those mega-museums, whether ethically or unethically.
I don't think it's really fair to bring up museums taking artifacts unethically from around the world as a point in your favor when the point of view you're arguing for -- an insistence on the need to "properly preserve" relevant artifacts and the idea that preventing such work from being displayed or held in anything less than the safest conditions -- is one of the most common arguments made in favor of taking, keeping, and refusing demands to return those unethical acquisitions.
It's their argument, indeed, but it's a pinocchio-faced argument, if anything. E.g. see the multiple damages the Greek section of the british museum has sustained over the last decade.
And the damage to the artifacts themselves in the first place - the "collectors" were often just taking the things they liked best not the historically relevant things or keeping pieces together.
(Someone compared the way certain people decorated with Egyptian relics with the modern Japan loving "weeaboo" and I can't unsee it.)
True, but that response still relies on the underlying logic that if the British Museum were the safest and most secure place for storing these artifacts, it would be ethically justified for them to keep them. I don't think that's the case.
Yes, absolutely agreed, you have a point
Because that costs money and the French government has been trying to shrink every budget possible. Culture isn’t exactly super high on the list of things to spend on… so they just hope that whatever the result of these cuts is, it’ll happen to the next guy and not the one that made the cuts/extended the cuts. A story as old as time.
True and sad. More or less every government I'm familiar with...
You really can get anywhere with a hard hat and a
clipboardbasket lift.This really does feel like somebody should be checking whether Danny Ocean got out of jail recently
So, thanks to this article, I just discovered that the Mona Lisa was stolen from the Louvre in 1911, and missing for 2+ years, and that--apparently--it was the media notoriety around this theft that actually made the painting the iconic legend it is today.
Bonus: The Italian thief claimed to have stolen it for patriotic reasons, having believed that Napoleon stole it from Italy and that he (the thief) wanted to return it to its homeland ... apparently unaware that da Vinci personally gave the painting to France.
Yeah, this heist is probably the only reason most of us have even heard of the Mona Lisa.
The fact that the Mona Lisa is so surprisingly small might actually be relevant to why it was stolen
I know it’s a meme that the Mona Lisa is small, but I saw it in person, and it actually didn’t seem that small. The Louvre makes you stand pretty far from it for crowd control. They also put it in a large room with a bunch of huge pictures in it. Directly across was an entire floor to ceiling paining. It is absolutely the smallest picture in the room, but it didn’t seem particularly small. Wikipedia claims it’s just under 3ft by 2ft, which is honestly pretty reasonable for a paining hung in a normal house.
I had been told that it was about the size of a sheet of A4 paper, 210 x 297 mm, but apparently I was just lied to on that.
The German company that makes the little bucket truck they used in the heist has turned this into a marketing opportunity with an ad saying "WENN'S MAL WIEDER SCHNELL GEHEN MUSS"
"When you need to move fast"
Bluesky link to advert (with translation and alt text)
Alumil apparently also made one: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/alumil_alumil-buildingexcellenceeveryday-activity-7386750821671112704-Mq8u
That's the YUROPean banter I live for!!1
We remain absolutely unserious. I love it
stealing crown jewels speedrun any%
I hear Danny Ocean was seen in Paris recently...Along with celebrity actress Julia Roberts.
Ah my joke was thwarted by reading the whole article and thus being late to the punchline
Well that's a fun headline. And a fun news story, it really does seem straight out of a movie. I almost wonder if the thieves did it just to see if they could.
I'm not sure what they can do with them. Seems like a difficult thing to fence.
What I don't understand is if the intention was to cut and sell untraceable diamonds, why steal crown jewels from the Louvre? You could have just robbed a jewelry store or something. I mean, I think some oligarch somewhere would pay top dollars for the jewels now that they have a story attached to them. Seems like a waste to just cut them up and sell them as if they were any old stone.
Then again, maybe they did it because security at jewelry stores is much higher than at the Louvre!
Part of it might just be prestige. I expect they'll keep at least a few of the jewels for themselves as mementos.
Also... There's a LOT of jewels in some of the crown jewels compared to regular jewelry. Not sure how many diamonds are in the average jewelry store, but I expect most don't have a single piece with 1,300+ diamonds. From skimming the Louvre's pages for each item linked by this article, a couple of the pieces had a thousand-plus diamonds and double-digits for the other jewels. I don't know how many pieces of regular jewelry you'd need to steal to get the same number of jewels, but probably a lot more than eight.
There may be political motivatations to the theft though. I've seen plenty of people complain about the existence of crown jewels given they're literal symbols of extravagance and wealth. So stealing them is a decent payday and serves as a middle finger to the uber-wealthy.
my guess is that they take it all, cut down some stuff for immediate profit, then trade the rest almost like markers or sell them through a fence. And like you said, lots of rich pricks are willing to have stolen items in their private collections that most people would likely never see.
In the movies they'd offer a split of money and heroin (at wholesale) or something... probably happens in real life, too.
The benefit of robbing a place like the Louvre is that its way bigger and, in a way, less protected. They're relying on glass and stuff in addition to guards. Add in the mass of tourists and all and it creates a chaos that can work in your favor. With a store, it'll be a small space with one exit, easily tripped alarms, etc etc -- way riskier and you might not even come away with genuine pieces.
The other thing about the Louvre is that its constantly under construction in some form. These guys used that to work their way in with ease. Like others said, you can get anywhere in the world with a clipboard.
It'll be interesting to see if these guys get caught. Their approach really plays into that 'gentleman thief' trope.
Another alternative would be to buy cheap diamonds on Alibaba
Were used to thinking of diamonds as valuable, but maybe not so much anymore?
That's why I wonder if it was done just for fun. However, they also don't need to sell them whole. The mention of them retrieving Eugenie's crown in a "broken" state reminded me of the second Pink Panther movie from 2009. Dumb as it was, it made a point that stuck with me about how the Pink Panther diamond could be broken into smaller diamonds and sold without being recognizable.
The article mentioned Eugenie's crown has (or maybe had) more than 1,300 small diamonds in it, and the others also have a lot of smaller jewels besides the most eye-catching pieces. While the crown jewels are more valuable whole, the individual jewels still have a lot of value overall. I expect it would be fairly easy to sell those to various stores without arousing suspicion.
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private collection.
There was Breitwieser so certainly not impossible it was for non-profit motives, but given the number of people and equipment involved that seems unlikely.
Pretty much all the high-profile art thefts seem movie-like if you dig into them--though some are comedies.
CNN: Two Louvre heist suspects have admitted involvement in jewels theft
Just goes to show that committing a heist and other crimes can be easy. It's getting away with it that's hard.
Brings to mind the consideration of whether we should pay attention to such things (or even publish news about them), as the fame (infamy) may fuel and encourage future similar crimes. Similarly, some argue that mass shooters, etc. should not be named or depicted (face) in news, for similar reasons (though coverage of the tragic events themselves would be acceptable).
I'm wondering how they expect to convert that famous jewelry into cash.
Maybe they already had a private buyer lined up - that's the only thing I can think of.
In another article I saw it was mentioned that sometimes wealthy collectors hire thieves to steal art, and thus there is no risk from trying to sell it since they are keeping it for their private collection.
Some French gang boss is hanging out in his media room with a Napoleonic crown and sceptre as we speak.
Recut the gems to remove provenance, melt the precious metals, suddenly you have a pile of valuables that don't track neatly to the stolen items.
Brutal. Also cuts the value by probably 90+%.
Yes, but 10% that's untrackable is far more valuable to the thieves than 100% that is entirely unique in the world and easily traceable back to this one theft.
It seems better to rob a normal jewelry store, which won’t get French intelligence on your ass for national pride.
offtopic, but i wish we had a proper heist video game where we have to plan everything ourselves and it isn’t all set out… and if we do get away, there’s an investigation going on in the background while we are doing other in-game things.
on topic, i hope we eventually get to see a lot of cctv footage.
It would be cool if you had players on both sides, planning the thefts and solving the crimes / find and capture the criminals.
Perfect Heist 2 is kind of this, but it's much more comical and the planning is fairly minimal. But it's a relatively good, if goofy, facsimile of doing heists.
haha that is not what I was expecting. Doesn't look too bad.
Always happy to see this game get mentioned. It's a lot of fun with a group of friends, especially when none of us are very good at it.
Bit of a tangent, but it really amuses me that you referenced Payday 2, not 3, further showing how much a disaster the newest entry has been.
I should have left a link - I actually meant Perfect Heist 2 which I don't think is affiliated with Starbreeze. Though agreed, they are a dumpster fire right now.
Oh dope, I hadn't seen this before. Thanks for sharing！
yesss! sort of a mix of GTA RP with the spreadsheets of EvE. There was a massive bank heist or something a few years ago in GTA RP --- something like five banks. That sort of thing would be fun.
I think that's just called Eve. Corporate assassination, emptying of corp/alliance wallets & hangars, taking down outposts/citadels, spais doing spai things, has definitely happened in Eve already!
haha an old buddy tried to get me into Eve. I should try it again.... but everybody was super rich and I didnt know how to do anything but fly to one place and back.
I saw that one crazy video from a few years back... that has to be the coolest thing thats ever happened.
It's for sure a bit tough to start. The trick if finding a good corp to join. I know some folks go straight into null sec blocs/alliances, which isn't a bad option either. You get lots of support, lots of people to play with, lots of things to do -- mining, ratting (PVE), small- and large-scale PVP, scouting/explo, etc -- right off the bat.
But man Eve can be a serious time suck. I "won eve" (AKA quit for the Nth time) about a year half ago after playing mostly straight from 2018. I had last, "for real," played Eve in the late 2000s. And I went hard this last time. Went into the null blocs and got heavily involved in PVP warfare. So many nights of waking up at like 3am or 4am in the middle of the week -- keep in mind, I had to work in the morning -- just to get on some expeditionary fleet to go blow up enemy ships and stuff. I got involved in some of the largest battles ever. Like 8000+ players in a single system, in a fight that took 10+ hrs. I think the longest I did was 14hrs. That said, that's not super fun, but it is cool just to be a part of.
And yes, I had my spreadsheets, lol. Mine were never that complicated. But I came across some that hooked into the game's API to pull live data and what not. Crazy stuff.
that’s so awesome. i think the somethingawful has one… there are goons in everything. 14hrs is bananas. the coordination and orchestration of that is really impressive.
i’m really good with spreadsheets and stuff, so that does add an extra draw. ok, thanks!! i’ll definitely look into this.
As a former Pandemic Horde member for years...NOOO NOT GOONS! GRR GONS HAT GONS
Nah but for real, it's hard to go wrong with any of the big open blocs. My understanding is that they have a lot of really good programs for line members. Like Horde, I imagine they have lots of programs to help noobs. I think they do full ship replacement, or SRP, as opposed to just partial. Basically, if you lose your ship on a sanctioned fleet op, they'll give you the money back to buy a new one or buy something else. Their industrial and logistics (meaning cargo moving, and not Eve's "logistics" which means ships that can repair or heal) side was/is practically unparalleled. Plus, it seems they've gotten rid of some of the more toxic leaders over the last several years.
Eve is tons of fun. I quit because I was getting bored after playing for like 6-7yrs. But I'll be back at some point. Really, I'm just on hiatus. No one ever "wins Eve" permanently.
that’s amazing, actually. seems like PH is the way to go. It’s such a pretty game, too. it’s nice that the crew seems pretty relaxed wrt time commitment and all, too.
whoever makes those videos is amazing.
Maybe you get brought in for questioning and either it's setup so you have dialog options or maybe real time ecents for like 30 minutes straight to simulate them trying to wear you down.
Monkey Island but also Rififi and The Thomas Crown Affair!
a game trying to break you would be hilarious. You see your partner eating McDonalds as he walks by the window...
Seems more action focused at a glance but I'm gonna try Relooted once it's out.
that looks pretty good. wild that people are complaining that the game is woke or that it’s racist to have black peoples stealing things… so stupid.
Thats so laughable. One look at that trailer and you can tell it has such a strong African vibe that it's probably made by African people. A quick search and ya... the studio, Nyamakop, (if the name isn't hint enough) is in South Africa.
Some people need to get a life.
too many weirdos trying to be outraged without doing any reading these days :)
It isn't a heist game at all, but I like that there are parts of Baldur's Gate 3 where you can sort of do this.
In the meantime until they actually release any, there’s always this:
https://youtu.be/vwoPSdtFqHg
it’ll have to do with that cherry picker video isn’t enough.
I feel like something with levels designed similarly to those in Hitman games but with some way to make the gameplay more about planning than improvising would be really interesting... expensive and difficult to design, perhaps, but interesting.