A few questions about replacing our clothes washing machine
Yesterday, while doing a regular load of laundry, the glass on the front of our washer completely shattered. My current theory is that it was a temperature thing. The washer is in our unheated basement, and I wash my clothes on hot (I know, but it helps with my allergies!), so I’m wondering if the repeated heating and cooling stressed the glass over time.
Anyway, the washer is about 7 years old, and almost certainly in need of replacement (small shards of glass got in the drum and internal mechanisms because it kept turning for a bit before we ran down to our basement and turned it off).
I have three main questions:
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We’re potentially looking at an all-in-one washer + dryer machine, but have read mixed reviews. Anyone have hands on experience with these and can speak to them? We do have a working dryer currently, but it is late in its life.
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To avoid the same problem we had with this one, we’re looking at top-loaders instead of front-loaders, but I’ve heard they have balancing issues. Anyone have experience with these?
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Regardless of configuration, does anyone have specific model recommendations/avoids?
I have used a top loader my entire life. Balancing issues might come up if you just dump your laundry in haphazardly, but it is generally not too big a deal to try to spread clothes out. Just don't put all of your towels or jeans on one side and it should be a non-issue.
As a more general statement about washers and dryers, they are kind of a solved problem as far as I am concerned. Don't get a smart one. These are machines that deal with warm water, you want as few computers involved as possible and you don't want to have to replace your unit because the fancy display doesn't work. Knobs and buttons are good. I always just go to the local scratch and dent to pick up washers and dryers when I move and they have always been fine.
What is the 'scratch and dent'?
Stores that buy the dented or scratched appliances that get returned from deliveries or second hand or whatever. The appliances still function fine but have blemishes on the outside. If you search "{Your City} Scratch and Dent" I would expect to find several results.
They generally don't have a huge selection, just whatever they happened to get hold of at a given time. For something like a washing machine that goes in a basement and is meant to do a job, I find that they are a good source.
I sold appliances for a few years maybe 7-8 years ago. That definitely sounds like a freak accident but I live in a warm climate so we didn't have to deal with large temperature fluctuations like that. Hope this helps:
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Like the other person said, these typically don't wash as well as washers nor dry as well as dryers. And they cost a premium too, so you're not really saving too much by getting just one unit vs separate units. Oh and the ones I remember took forever to dry. The real benefit of this type of machine is the space saving. Almost all the ones I sold were to people in small condos or apartments that barely had space to fit one machine, much less two. Also, a lot of times they are ventless, which some condos or apartment buildings require, but for a basement with plenty of space I would stick with the two separate machines. They'll be about the same price (if not cheaper) and do both jobs better. Plus you can wash more things while the first load is drying.answer
Washing machines are very heavy because they deal with the weight of the water. The spiel that I got from old-timers working in the appliance world was that front loaders were a bit more efficient and (supposedly) washed a little better, while top loaders had higher capacities so you can fit more clothes or bigger items. However, these differences have mostly been ironed out given how many of these things are produced each year, so both will wash pretty well and be pretty efficient, though top loaders can indeed hold a bit more just because of the design. But mostly it's a preference thing. Some people prefer top loaders because that's what they grew up with, others prefer front loaders because they see them as newer and fancier, shorter people have trouble reaching all the corners inside a top loader so prefer front loaders (this was actually a pretty common determining factor for people browsing in our store). So I say not to sweat it and just pick the style you personally prefer, or get a big top loader if you do massive loads of laundry.answer
Oh boy, get ready for a lot of comments. I bring this up every time an appliance question is posted but there is a crazy amount of variety in the answers you'll get. Some will say to avoid Samsung because they had one and it sucked. Yet my parents have had a Samsung for years and years and it's been fine. Some will say they had an LG and it broke and LG refused to fix it, so they're never buying LG again. I've owned an LG washer and dryer for like 6 years now and it's been great (LG was usually my recommended brand in terms of quality/price/features for most people when I used to sell appliances, hence why I bought one when I moved on from that job). The American brands (Amana, Whirpool, and Maytag) are all owned by the same parent company and should all be mostly fine, just catered to different price points (Amana being dirt cheap and basic, while Maytag being slightly more upscale, and Whirlpool a good middle ground between price and quality). Then there are others like GE which are mostly fine as well, just don't sell as many units as the other brands so you're less likely to hear recommendations online (other than "oh my grandma's had a GE for 30 years those things are indestructible" yeah that's a whole other topic by itself but generally appliances nowadays will last 5-10 years depending on A LOT of factors, usually they don't violently shatter like yours did but I guess it fell in the same time frame.)So yeah, I have an LG front-loading pair for reference. My parents have a Samsung top-loading pair. We're both happy with them. Samsung did get a bit of a negative reputation in recent years for some phones catching fire and washers where the doors slammed open with force, so if freak accidents like that concern you (and I guess they would given your glass shattering out of no where) then maybe avoid their washers/dryers.
One feature I would recommend looking at and possibly paying more for is steam. Most base models don't have it but we love it. Steam in the washer helps really clean and sanitize, which is super handy for certain types of loads or if you have allergies, and steam in the dryer helps to prevent clothes from coming out wrinkled, we just pretty much take them straight out and hang them and never had any issues.
Edit: oh and one more thing, SHOP AROUND. Jesus this is the most important tip in appliance shopping nowadays and I'm amazed how many times I hear "oh I just went to the store and picked one out". That's fine if you're desperate or really don't have the time, but if you can spare an afternoon please consider checking out a few places and websites. We recently had to go through this whole process with our dishwasher and saved a couple hundred bucks by just going to like 4 or 5 different stores in our area (nothing crazy, just a best buy, lowes, home depot, and two specialty appliance stores, plus a couple online like costco). They're mostly going to have the same prices, but their sales might be slightly different (so like best buy had the same prices as the lowes or home depot, but they also gave you a gift card for 50 or 100 bucks depending on the price of the items) and they might also have different floor models or scratch-and-dent models (these used to be much better deals, but I've found that open-box prices have gotten much worse in the last few years, best buy especially).
As someone who needs a grabber and/or a step stool and sometimes still can't quite reach everything in the washer without putting the whole top off of my body in there.... This is a very good point. And heaven help me if I need to clean out change or something.
(Note, I did not purchase our current washer and dryer, they came with the house)
Yup, I'm not even that tall but I've never had to deal with these short-people problems until I met my wife. So it was surprising to me how many couples would come by the appliance store I worked at specifically to check if they could reach the bottom of the washer, lol.
On the other end of the spectrum though, some taller people complain about front loaders because you have to bend down too low to use them. That's a big part of why these brands also sell pedestals for the front-loading units, to bring them up to a reasonable height so you don't have to work out your back every time you unload the washer. They feel gimmicky (and they sort of are), and definitely pricey for essentially a fancy drawer, but they really do improve the ergonomics of using the machine. Though you can achieve a similar effect at a fraction of the cost with some construction lumber and a DIY spirit.
Side note: there are two entire shelves in my house that I don't ever remember exist because they are just under another shelf and I physically cannot see them unless I bend down. I'll be looking for something and my wife asks me if I've looked in the pantry, I say yes, then she goes and finds it ten seconds later and it mystifies me until I remember the shelf that's just below my eye-line. Every time.
My husband and I are giants! Our front-loader was up on a riser, and was still low for us, so I relish the idea of getting a top-loader.
Also, I hated cleaning the little trap on the front door, so not having to deal with that also sounds lovely.
Oh yeah that's another big sticking point for a lot of people that I would hear remarkably often. "I hear those front-loaders get moldy and smell". Yup that's the rubber gasket on the front that prevents all the water from falling out. Easy way to prevent that from happening is to leave the door open after each load. Never close it immediately after a load of laundry, always leave it open for a couple of hours and then maybe once a month (or really whenever you remember or when it starts smelling a bit) just run a bit of vinegar through the machine on the 'tub clean' setting or whatever it is and it'll get rid of any smells for another month or so.
You haven't seen comedy until my legs are kicking in the air while I'm desperately trying to reach a penny at the bottom of the drum. At least according to my partner (who really needs a front loader himself) ಠ_ಠ
Like maybe it can just go through a few more washes.
We got pedestals with our LG front-loaders and having the storage drawer underneath is nice.
The problem with these combo machines is that they do neither particularly well. It's a specialty device, let it do specialty things. There are plenty of models that have a paired washer and a dryer set within the same product line that will work together far better than a single machine would do both.
Unless you're strapped for space, don't.
If you are strapped for space, by all means! They exist as an option for a reason and home appliances are Fit for Purpose first, you must get the appliance you need, not what someone else needs. If someone else needs an incredibly fast dryer they may get one that has a speed function, if you need one that fits your laundry room.. get one that fits your laundry room.
I tend to overfocus on specifics and "the best of the best". Something a lot of us nowadays tend to do at least a little when looking for new stuff (possibly a bit because we also get peddled so much crap and/or planned obsolescence rubbish), but what you must do when it comes to these devices is write down specifically what you want from it. And then get the devices that does that thing that you want from it. Barring outliers and lemons, most general brands are ok in their normal line-ups.
Edit: Some clarity.
Skip the all in one units.
Have you looked into heat pump driers yet? They're shockingly more efficient to run, in exchange for 20% longer drying run times. We're talking using a third of the electricity.
I second the heat pump route if you are going to replace both at some point.
Only challenge I found, if you live in the US and are used to a large dryer, I found only one brand last year that had a dryer big enough. Whirlpool sells a pretty large one and has been great for us. It's ventless, it's actually a 240v unit so it will just work in your existing location. Also side benefit is that it can get a little hotter than a standard heat pump dryer with the higher voltage.
LG put out a new heat pump dryer that's the same 7.8 cu. feet that my current resistive/ducted dryer is. Until that one hit the market, their largest was 4.x cu. feet. For our needs ... the 7.8 is plenty.
In addition to LG's, and Whirlpool's, Samsung now has a large 7+ cubic foot heat pump dryer. The condenser isn't removable for cleaning (unlike say a Bosch 24") but it has a secondary filter before it and at least the front edge is accessible for vacuuming if necessary.
Our Whirlpool unit has a secondary filter on the front that seems to work well. Only needs to be cleaned once in a while, and the unit lets you know when to remove the lint from it.
Have you looked at the Speed Queen top loaders? They are dead simple to use. They are basically consumer-commercial washing machines, but they have a huge capacity and really do a good job washing.
I had read the quality wasn't quite what it used to be since 2018.
They may not be built like they used to be, but they are still better than almost everything else on the market, as evidenced by their warranty that is 5 years longer than anybody else.
I'm going to counter almost everybody here. I recently described the virtues and flaws of my all-in-one heat pump washer/dryer.
Have you ever said to yourself "Crap, I forgot to swap the laundry?". If you say that at least once a week, forget every criticism you'll hear about them because it is life changing.
The model I have is 4.8 cuft, larger than most washers I've had. It cleans clothes as well or better than every other washer I've owned (Samsung/LG front loads, Whirlpool top loads) as well as dries just as well as every dryer I've ever had. It also isn't as hard on the clothes in the dry cycle. The pet hair removal cycle is also pretty great. Oh and I don't need dryer sheets anymore.
And it just drops in place of your existing washer. Get it. You don't need to install a new vent. Put a folding table where your dryer is and have no regrets. Provided you clean the lint filter diligently...which it reminds you to do.
My 7 yr old does their own laundry now. Put in, press play, return in 2-4 hours.
(sorry; I don’t appear to have directly addressed any of your questions, and have danced around the topic instead :/ I’ll still post this in case it’s of use)
I haven’t tried any all in one machines myself, but from doing research earlier, North American reviews of them were extremely strongly biased towards being negative. Main reasons I could tell for that were:
All that said, I haven’t tried one myself, I’ve just scoured the internet for reviews. This YouTube channel does excellent appliance reviews imo, and they have a very thorough tear down and discussion of a few heat pump machines that might be worth a watch. It could also be instructive to check reviews on machines from overseas, as folks there are more used to the operating constraints of these machines, so their pros/cons lists might be more insightful (as noted, most NA reviews focus on the above list).
To tag onto this kind of proxy comment for u/kfwyre, on the topic of combo machines available in the US, I've been considering switching to one, and from my research this GE model appears to be the leader in terms of quality, features, and capacity: GE Profile 4.8 cuft UltraFast combo. I've been interested in the combos from a convinience point of view where I don't have to remember to pull the wash out and get it into the dryer. What's really interesting is people talk about this experience of pulling their clothes out and initially thinking they're damp, and then a minute later they feel completely dry. I'm sure it has something to do with the temperature as you alluded to.
One big benefit with a ventless heat pump dryer is that they will be substantially more energy efficient. The ventless heat pump design recaptures and recycles waste heat that in a normal dryer is wasted outside. So between that and them using a heat pump instead of an electric coil, you get a device that is well over 100% efficient. By that I mean for every 1kWh of electricity the dryer consumes, it puts over 1kWh of heat into drying your clothes. This is possible because it's moving heat from inside your house into the dryer rather than turning electricity into heat. It's essentially doing the opposite of what your refrigerator does!
There's a secondary benefit I don't see a lot of people talk about with a ventless design. A regular dryer sucks air from your house, heats it up, blows it over you clothes, and then exhausts the moist air outside. This is negatively pressurizing your housing meaning that outside air is getting sucked in through any tiny holes or gaps in your houses exterior. So if it's hotter or colder outside than inside, you're increasing the amount of heating or cooling your home HVAC system needs to do. So the ventless design itself is more efficient, but it's also not putting a big extra load onto your HVAC system from having to condition infiltrated air.
One small extra thought on people complaining about the units not making their clothes fully dry or the device taking too long, it's hard not to read them as "the device is different and therefore a don't like it," or like there's buyers remorse because they didn't read up on a device before buying it. I think criticism about a device taking longer to dry is completely valid and something folks should be aware of, but too many of the negative comments I've seen are hard to take very seriously.
These types of machines are really appealing to me. I'm getting ready for work right now, and I've just grabbed the last undershirt in the stack. It would be awesome to be able to just throw the laundry in the machine now and have it be done when I get home. Instead I just emptied my hamper into my laundry basket and set it by the door, leaving another chore to do when I get home.
It would be a waste to replace my working appliances though, so I doubt I'll be buying a combo unit any time soon.
Fwiw, at least as of my last googling here in Germany, all-in-one washer-driers with heat pumps aren't really on the market yet here, despite heat pump dryers themselves being more common here than in the US afaik (according to one article I read, it's because of trouble fitting the heat pump within the space constraints of the single unit). Of course the brand selection is obviously different -- the GE model everyone's raving about isn't an option here!
This is one of my main holdbacks from switching to one, because the drying cycle on the best available washer-driers here is still incredibly inefficient when compared to our current (pretty cheap) heat pump dryer (which does take longer than vented would but when you're switching from not having any dryer, that part doesn't matter) and our apartment doesn't have anywhere to hook up a vented dryer anyway.
Update
First off, a HUGE thank you to everyone who responded. All of the information y’all have shared is so helpful, and I think it’s a really great example of why I love this place. One topic on Tildes got me more valuable insight than the MANY searches I did of the broader internet, which just turned up a lot of questionable garbage information.
We have a family member who’s very handy, so he came over yesterday and actually disassembled the washer. Glass didn’t get into things like we thought and was pretty much contained in the drum and the filter from when we drained it. Also, nothing was damaged (we were worried about glass getting inside of lines and cutting them, for example).
We’re going to be able to order a new door and replace that at a much cheaper cost than replacing the whole machine, since everything else remains safe and functional. The person who disassembled it is also flushing everything and ensuring that, if any small bits made it in, they don’t stay in. My main concern in using the washer again would be having small shards of glass end up in my clothing — yikes! We’re very lucky to know someone who has expertise in this area.
Anyway, I like this solution for money reasons and because it saves the waste of replacing an entire machine. I also hate appliance shopping. I’m now hopeful that this machine can hold on long enough to let the technology for all-in-one’s get a little bit better, because I do love the convenience aspect that several of y’all spoke to in this topic (specifically @vord and @chromakode). That very well might be our next purchase, especially because we eventually intend to move our laundry up from our basement (where there’s plenty of room) to our main floor (where space is at a premium).
I spoke to a very smart science-minded person about it, and she said the temperature was very unlikely to be the cause, which also corresponds with @Halfloaf’s expertise. She said it was more likely that the door ended up slightly shifting over time and that small change in alignment ended up putting enough stress on the glass to break it.
I’m not sure we’ll ever get a real answer on why it happened, but it’s fun to theorize.
Anyway, thank you again to everyone who responded and gave your perspective. Seriously; if you took time out of your day to help me out, then know that I’m incredibly appreciative. I also hope the wisdom in this topic helps out more than just me. Anyone who’s in the market for a washer could benefit from reading this.
I like your friend’s thoughts! If the glass is contacting the frame directly, the vibrations from an imbalance can be reallllllllly intense!
Fun fact, the acceleration experienced by clothing during the highest speed of a spin (on many machines) is 800 G’s!
I've never used a washer/drier combo that hasn't been fairly rubbish at both things. Caveat to that is that I haven't used many washer/driers.
When I was buying a washer a while ago I asked a friend who works at a major electronics retailer. According to them, Samsung make the best washing machines by some distance. They're direct drive brushless motors so they're as close to solid state as a moving object gets. Mine was a fairly low-end model and has sailed through the last decade which includes a lot (a LOT) of reusable nappy washing.
I've never seen a top loading washing machine in person, let alone used one, so I can't comment on that.
I would get a smart washing machine if I was buying now, but I have a lot of home automation to tie it into and a preference to use power at certain, and variable, times of day or night (which I prefer to automate).
I recently (8 months already, wow) bought a combo unit, and I'm very happy with it. It's a Bauknecht WATK Sense 86S 41 N. I wash around once a week, mostly using the eco mode which takes ages (9h20 for a full load)... But I get dry, clean laundry out of it. It has no extra exits for the lint, it gets washed away and there's a bunch that gets stuck to the rubber ring at the door, which is a 2-minute wipe job.
This doesn’t necessarily apply to you, at least not this time, but for anyone who can use it: timing matters for appliance purchases. Different stores have different sales on different stuff at different times, it can pay to wait and watch.
That said , most appliances I have bought (and I have bought many, I manage rentals) I get by going to the back of the store and getting an “opem box” or refurb. I get a 5% discount by ising the Lowes credit card too.
I bought a speed queen tc5 a few years ago and I recommend it.
It costs as much as the fancy nice ones but instead of smart features it's just a basic no frills boring top loading washer that's built to last. It has a 5 year warranty. I have no issues so far. It just washes my clothes well with no issues
So, I'm more of an electronics guy, but I'm an advocate of Right to Repair in general and as a natural parallel to that, I dislike stuff designed to break (planned obsolescence) and appreciate things built to last.
First: Ben's Appliances and Junk YouTube channel is a trove of useful information on this subject - he's an appliance repair tech and makes videos on repair as well as advice about what is worth buying and what isn't.
Next: complexity and features are, generally speaking, bad as they add more points of failure. Simple will tend towards being more robust. Physical rotating timing knobs are more robust than digital panels since the electronics will often be 'value engineered' to use the cheapest, crappiest components available so long as they last juuuuuuust past the warranty period.
If you can find them: a used pair of Speed Queen washer and dryer is the gold standard of robust, designed to last decades and not break.
If you absolutely want to buy new: saying 'this brand bad / this brand good' just doesn't seem to work well. Get the model number of what you are considering, and extensively search for that model with search terms like "Model XYZ problems" "Model XYZ failure" "Model XYZ recall" "Model XYZ 'anyone else'" and so on. Be AGGRESSIVELY cynical. Outright IGNORE any information provided by anyone who would make money from you buying Model XYZ unless it is a legally binding warranty statement, and even then... The time spent here will (hopefully) be long forgotten and felt as unnecessary in the decades of problem-free use you get out of a good choice.
I'll second @vord's enthusiasm for the GE Ultrafast Combo. It's everything I've ever wanted in a washing machine. Washes, dries, dispenses detergent from a huge reservoir, no vent, energy efficient, gentle on clothes, and will agitate clothes left in the drum regularly so they don't wrinkle.
You just yeet a reasonably large pile of laundry in there and in 2.5 hours it's fresh and warm. It was especially amazing the week we had COVID -- chuck all the pajamas in and forget about it. Sometimes when my favorite day clothes are running low, I schedule a full cycle when I'm going to bed, so that when I wake up my clothes are ready.
It's also a big energy efficiency win, as all heat pump dryers are, because you're not pushing conditioned air out your dryer vent, and it uses less electricity. It's also gentler on clothes because it uses less heat to remove water from the air. A rare case for an appliance where you win on efficiency, ease of install, and usability!
One of the things you'll read about this and similar machines is problems with lint buildup. It's true, some lint needs to occasionally be manually cleaned from the drawer space so it doesn't build up on the condenser fins. We got one around the beginning of the year, so while I can't speak to its longevity, our condenser looks great and there's been no degradation in drying performance. I hope that based on the popularity of this design, the lint management will be improved in future iterations.
The other notable drawback to this unit is that it's an um, absolute unit. It's really heavy. Moving it up or down stairs is an ordeal.
Still, I love this machine. One of my favorite appliances ever. I never want to go back to having to interrupt my day to manually transfer clothes from one machine to another. We got one and kept our old dryer, figuring if the drying wasn't good enough we'd just have a fancy washing machine. The drying is absolutely good enough, and generates much less lint!
We only have space for one appliance so recently we replaced a washer with a washer/dryer combo. We like it during the winter. In the summer we will line dry the washing. Hard to offer recommendations when we don't know the territory
My parents have had an Electrolux stack for more than 5 years now. They needed a handful of repairs over the years, and the washing machine has always had a very small leak from the front door seal, but otherwise they have been pretty reliable. I can’t say they are fantastic, but they have been pretty good. Also, you can buy the same model with a door that opens either direction. That’s pretty nice if your laundry room is designed for stacked units (so they open the same direction) or you have a strong preference for which appliance is on which side (so the doors open away from each other).
In my experience, top loaders with an agitator are far less likely to become imbalanced than top loaders without an agitator.
However, the agitator does put more wear and tear on your clothes (albeit not nearly as much as, say, a dryer does). You may be able to limit damage by using laundry bags for your more delicate or precious clothes.
Hey! As someone that has worked in the Laundry space before, I’d first recommend you check out the warranty for your unit!
The front glass of your washing machine should be tested well beyond the maximum water temperature setting, and for thousands of cycles! If that shattered under normal use, it should absolutely be covered under warranty. Both 5-year and 10-year warranties are common, so I’d check and see what you have, or what the manufacturer offers.
Side story, I had an LG dryer’s front glass shatter on me while doing competitive testing. It was so unexpected, but yeah, glass was absolutely everywhere.
The warranty was only a year, and we didn’t take the extended warranty, so we are well outside of it. Great advice though, and thanks for sharing your experience.
I was amazed not just at how much glass there was, but how thick it was. It definitely looks strong when you’re seeing a full cross-section of it, but I guess all it takes is one little issue…
Not what you asked about, but I can personally recommend DeMite Laundry Additive to help with allergies when washing fabrics at cold temperatures. It really has helped me, and it lasts a long time. Lower temperatures will prolong the life of many of your fabrics, and can save you money on your bills.
This is very helpful, thank you!
When I was explaining the situation to the people I eat lunch with at work, and I said I wash my clothes on hot, there was a communal jaw drop and someone said “You WHAT?!” 😂