69 votes

Joe Biden elected president

84 comments

  1. [2]
    CALICO
    Link
    frodo_its_done.gif ...but not really. The next 74 days are likely to be a shit-show. Buckle up, y'all. And outside of incarceration, he's unlikely to be disappearing from the public eye until his...

    frodo_its_done.gif


    ...but not really. The next 74 days are likely to be a shit-show. Buckle up, y'all. And outside of incarceration, he's unlikely to be disappearing from the public eye until his last day on this Earth.

    And yet, I couldn't help but to let go of more tension than I knew I was holding.

    43 votes
    1. knocklessmonster
      Link Parent
      I woke up and saw the news and feel so much better that not only is there something decisive, the Supreme Court is unwilling to try to do anything they shouldn't with the results, even Kavanaugh...

      I woke up and saw the news and feel so much better that not only is there something decisive, the Supreme Court is unwilling to try to do anything they shouldn't with the results, even Kavanaugh and Barrett, who many worried would pull some BS, are being responsible.

      I'm still slightly on edge with the two Georgia senate run-offs, but now we can at least buckle in, grab some popcorn, and know that even if the President unravels over the next two months, it'll just be two more months instead of two terms.

      14 votes
  2. [7]
    stu2b50
    Link
    I was watching Fox waiting for their predictions (and maybe some salt), but looks like they're throwing Trump under a bus already. They were bizarrely glowing of Biden suddenly, talking about how...

    I was watching Fox waiting for their predictions (and maybe some salt), but looks like they're throwing Trump under a bus already. They were bizarrely glowing of Biden suddenly, talking about how "warm" his campaign and praising him for campaigning safely in the pandemic unlike Trump, who hosted in person rallies.

    No, seriously, Fox News said that. To be fair, they then aired Trump's entire stupid notice about how they're going to fight legal fights, but it looks the GOP establishment is tossing him after he's not useful anymore.

    27 votes
    1. [4]
      mono
      Link Parent
      Honestly, I think a lot of the GOP machine is very glad Trump will no longer be the de facto head-of-party. The election may have actually been somewhat of a best case scenario for them. They...

      Honestly, I think a lot of the GOP machine is very glad Trump will no longer be the de facto head-of-party. The election may have actually been somewhat of a best case scenario for them. They defended most of the important Senate seats they were massively outspent on. They have a solid hold of SCOTUS, and probably don't have to worry too much about Dems changing that. They gained seats in the House, which wasn't expected at all. They did very well in state legislature races and are gonna have a lot of control over redistricting after the census. And Biden probably isn't even going to be all that bad for them, and the upside of getting rid of the absolutely massive liability that is Donald Trump may outweigh losing the White House.

      It's going to be interesting to see, though, how Trump's base reacts to realizing the GOP doesn't actually believe he's the American messiah.

      31 votes
      1. [3]
        vord
        Link Parent
        Trump served his purpose well: his bumbling, idiotic presidency let the R party get their agenda pushed through seamlessly while giving them plausible deniability that it 'It was just that Trump...

        Trump served his purpose well: his bumbling, idiotic presidency let the R party get their agenda pushed through seamlessly while giving them plausible deniability that it 'It was just that Trump fellow'

        Also notice how a ramping up COVID is going to be handled off to Biden and co, and they will promptly be blamed for how bad it is while ignoring that Trump and co set it up.

        Tick-tock goes the doomsday clock.

        18 votes
    2. joplin
      Link Parent
      Yeah, once they got Barrett-Cohen on the bench, they didn't need him anymore, so why bother? He's as much a thorn in their side as he is in everyone else's.

      Yeah, once they got Barrett-Cohen on the bench, they didn't need him anymore, so why bother? He's as much a thorn in their side as he is in everyone else's.

      10 votes
    3. ras
      Link Parent
      There seems to be a really divide on Fox. I've flipped over to their coverage a few times and some are moving on with the People's decision, while others are questioning the results. So far I...

      There seems to be a really divide on Fox. I've flipped over to their coverage a few times and some are moving on with the People's decision, while others are questioning the results. So far I haven't heard a single piece evidence that would lead to an overturn of the election, especially if Georgia and Arizona maintain their numbers.

      2 votes
  3. teaearlgraycold
    Link
    Now begins a new 2 month misinformation campaign from Trump to undermine our democracy even further.

    Now begins a new 2 month misinformation campaign from Trump to undermine our democracy even further.

    21 votes
  4. [9]
    kfwyre
    Link
    I'm drunk, I'm happy, and I'm more relaxed than I've been in a good long while. This event isn't a cure all, but it's a win, and one we as a country very much needed. Cheers to everyone here: my...

    I'm drunk, I'm happy, and I'm more relaxed than I've been in a good long while. This event isn't a cure all, but it's a win, and one we as a country very much needed.

    Cheers to everyone here: my fellow Americans who can now solidly envision a day where Trump is no longer the head and face of our country, and our global neighbors who care enough about us to stay informed about our events, check in on us, and provide guidance, reassurance, comfort, and insight.

    Sending some American love everyone's way, wherever you are.

    19 votes
    1. [3]
      Adys
      Link Parent
      Never in my life have I drunk alcohol alone. Today's been the first exception to that rule. I'm fucking celebrating. Love to america, from across the Atlantic 💖

      Never in my life have I drunk alcohol alone.

      Today's been the first exception to that rule. I'm fucking celebrating.

      Love to america, from across the Atlantic 💖

      12 votes
      1. kfwyre
        Link Parent
        You're not alone! I'm right here with you, brother. Cheers!

        You're not alone! I'm right here with you, brother. Cheers!

        10 votes
      2. patience_limited
        Link Parent
        We are all here together, and I've got f'ing amazing sparkling rose' to toast with from the weekend winery job. And I did not say one snarky thing to the morons still sporting Trump masks (!)...

        We are all here together, and I've got f'ing amazing sparkling rose' to toast with from the weekend winery job.

        And I did not say one snarky thing to the morons still sporting Trump masks (!) today, so I guess I'm feeling pretty benevolent right now.

        Meanwhile, we're also watching the episode of Monty Python in German for the first time, which seems like a fitting tribute to this surreal year.

        6 votes
    2. [5]
      aphoenix
      Link Parent
      I'm glad you're drunk and happy and this is an acceptable result (should have been a blowout, but take what you can get, eh?). I'm glad that you and others don't have to come live in my basement,...

      I'm glad you're drunk and happy and this is an acceptable result (should have been a blowout, but take what you can get, eh?).

      I'm glad that you and others don't have to come live in my basement, because I just found a whooooooooole boatload of secret water damage, and y'all would be getting some kind of lung disease from the mould.

      5 votes
      1. Adys
        Link Parent
        Silver lining: free healthcare to treat the lung disease.

        Silver lining: free healthcare to treat the lung disease.

        5 votes
      2. [3]
        kfwyre
        Link Parent
        Ugh, so sorry to hear that! Water damage is the WORST.

        Ugh, so sorry to hear that! Water damage is the WORST.

        3 votes
        1. [2]
          aphoenix
          Link Parent
          In a lucky accident of birth, my dad is a carpenter / contractor. The mould remediation was relatively expensive, but fixing the walls won't be a problem. On balance, the week wasn't so bad,...

          In a lucky accident of birth, my dad is a carpenter / contractor. The mould remediation was relatively expensive, but fixing the walls won't be a problem. On balance, the week wasn't so bad, especially with this result of all my american friends.

          5 votes
          1. kfwyre
            Link Parent
            While you were busy cleaning your physical basement, we Americans were also busy cleaning your geographical one. We're setting up for some major and much needed renovations down here. :)

            While you were busy cleaning your physical basement, we Americans were also busy cleaning your geographical one. We're setting up for some major and much needed renovations down here. :)

            5 votes
  5. [3]
    streblo
    Link
    Trump's nothing press conference in an industrial park in front of a landscaping company and next to an adult bookstore is something that will be lampooned for ages....

    Trump's nothing press conference in an industrial park in front of a landscaping company and next to an adult bookstore is something that will be lampooned for ages.

    https://twitter.com/_RichardHall/status/1325119057201393667

    15 votes
    1. [2]
      Grimalkin
      Link Parent
      Wow, just wow. And it's definitely worth reading that whole thread. WTF was that?

      Wow, just wow. And it's definitely worth reading that whole thread. WTF was that?

      8 votes
      1. MimicSquid
        Link Parent
        If you can't get the front of the Four Seasons hotel, go for the next best Four Seasons available?

        If you can't get the front of the Four Seasons hotel, go for the next best Four Seasons available?

        4 votes
  6. [5]
    skybrian
    Link
    Rupert Murdoch-owned US outlets turn on Trump, urging him to act with ‘grace’ [...]

    Rupert Murdoch-owned US outlets turn on Trump, urging him to act with ‘grace’

    Multiple Rupert Murdoch-owned conservative media outlets in the United States have shifted their messaging in a seeming effort to warn readers and viewers that Donald Trump may well have lost the presidential election.

    The new messaging appears to be closely coordinated, and it includes an appeal to Trump to preserve his “legacy” by showing grace in defeat. The message is being carried on Fox News and in the Wall Street Journal and the New York Post – all outlets avidly consumed by Trump himself, especially Fox.

    [...]

    Top editors at the Post have “told some staff members this week to be tougher in their coverage” of Trump, the New York Times reported, citing two anonymous employees of the paper.

    The Times piece said: “On Thursday, in a sudden about-face, Rupert Murdoch’s scrappy tabloid published two articles with a wildly different tone. One accused the president of making an ‘unfounded claim that political foes were trying to steal the election’. The headline on the other described Donald Trump Jr as the ‘panic-stricken’ author of a ‘clueless tweet’.”

    9 votes
    1. streblo
      Link Parent
      That’s Murdoch trying to make sure Trump News Network doesn’t emerge as a competitor.

      That’s Murdoch trying to make sure Trump News Network doesn’t emerge as a competitor.

      13 votes
    2. Flashynuff
      Link Parent
      That's the danger of positioning yourself as a powerful strongman - as soon as you lose big, the people you allied yourself with turn on you because they are ALSO only interested in power

      That's the danger of positioning yourself as a powerful strongman - as soon as you lose big, the people you allied yourself with turn on you because they are ALSO only interested in power

      11 votes
    3. [2]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      This seems like... a good thing? At least for this one very important fact, some major conservative media is not on board with alternative facts. (Conservative social media, though, could be...

      This seems like... a good thing? At least for this one very important fact, some major conservative media is not on board with alternative facts.

      (Conservative social media, though, could be different.)

      7 votes
      1. JCPhoenix
        Link Parent
        Good thing, sure, but the reasons for it are screwed up. Which I suppose is still good. Idk. It's all self-preservation BS. It's not because Rupert Murdoch all of a sudden care's about the...

        Good thing, sure, but the reasons for it are screwed up. Which I suppose is still good.

        Idk. It's all self-preservation BS. It's not because Rupert Murdoch all of a sudden care's about the country. They're priming their viewers so they don't turn on Fox in a furious fit of confusion. The media is being "reasonable," while Trump is "now" the one who's out of line, when just a day or two ago, Fox and Trump were in lockstep. It's all just controlling the narrative and making sure Murdock is the one who's doing it. Which is just...ugh...

        I wish Rupert Murdoch would just go away. That's the nicest way I can say that.

        10 votes
  7. [4]
    Adys
    Link
    Biden will deliver his first speech as president-elect in a couple of minutes....
    9 votes
    1. Omnicrola
      Link Parent
      Watched this live with friends, it was the most joyful I've seen all of us in a long time. My wife cried (happy cried) through most of it. I couldn't stop smiling, I wanted to run through the...

      Watched this live with friends, it was the most joyful I've seen all of us in a long time. My wife cried (happy cried) through most of it. I couldn't stop smiling, I wanted to run through the streets screaming for joy. It's a weird combination of relief and joy that this actual fucking adult, this actual human being, with feelings and compassion, that can string minutes worth of coherent sentences together, will be the next president. And so sad and depressing that that is the measuring stick that we're now using.

      We no longer measure the candidates by the smallest of gaffes made in front of a camera, or by the quality of their proposals. Our basic measurement is that they're not actively trying to set the country on fire and claiming that the smoke is evidence that their enemies are out to get them.

      11 votes
  8. [46]
    vord
    Link
    Here is what the Dems need to do on the day of swearing in. Enlarge size of Supreme Court, name at least 3 more justices. Get it in the queue. House pumps out a massively progressive (bottom-up,...

    Here is what the Dems need to do on the day of swearing in.

    • Enlarge size of Supreme Court, name at least 3 more justices. Get it in the queue.
    • House pumps out a massively progressive (bottom-up, not top-down) COVID aid package legislation. So good the Senate can't hold it back. Senate Dems need to insist on SC nomination confirmations first to further hold feet to fire.
    • Biden needs to name and shame anybody standing in the way of those things.

    Later, once the benefits of said package become clear, push out GND, follow same tactic. Job gareuntee to get people back on their feet after current COVID wave passes.

    Dems need to act hard, and fast. They'll lose 2024 if they can't tangibly improve the lives of everyone to expose just how bad things really were under Trump.

    7 votes
    1. [11]
      Adys
      Link Parent
      If making your own supporters' lives shit doesn't lose their votes, what could possibly make you think that improving everyone's lives will have a tangible effect on 2024? There's a lot to unpack...

      If making your own supporters' lives shit doesn't lose their votes, what could possibly make you think that improving everyone's lives will have a tangible effect on 2024?

      There's a lot to unpack from the last 4 years. There are three things that are clearly broken in america, which contribute to this vicious cycle of awful:

      • Your election system. From the Electoral College, gerrymandering, and the population representation imbalances to the lack of ranked choice voting or even simple runoffs. And let's not forget the ridiculous campaign donation, advertising, etc; those things would shock people in other countries but america finds them … normal, somehow.
      • Global misinformation. A plague that started a while ago but got really bad since Trump. The US doesn't have the tools to fight people who, with few resources, can spin up any old shit and create an alternate reality where they control the facts.
      • Your education system. You keep producing people who lack basic skills to be productive, positive members of society and will fall prey to the above.

      It's not fixable in 4 years. You dodged Trump, the worst case scenario, but 2024 is going to suck. If it doesn't, I'll tip my hat to Biden harder than I ever have towards any head of state.

      12 votes
      1. [4]
        MimicSquid
        Link Parent
        If making things better won't be any better for the electoral chances in 2024 than leaving things the same... why not make things better for their own sake?

        If making things better won't be any better for the electoral chances in 2024 than leaving things the same... why not make things better for their own sake?

        8 votes
        1. [3]
          Adys
          Link Parent
          I'm a proponent of making things better. If it wasn't obvious I was making a point not on the "making things better" part but on the "losing 2024" part. Maybe a better strategy if you want to make...

          I'm a proponent of making things better. If it wasn't obvious I was making a point not on the "making things better" part but on the "losing 2024" part.

          Maybe a better strategy if you want to make things better is to try to ensure that both parties are trying to achieve that, not just one of them. Right now, the division is so great that the very prospect of having a split senate and house forecasts 2-4 years of deadlock.

          6 votes
          1. [2]
            MimicSquid
            Link Parent
            I'm very open to ideas of how to make the Republican party more productive, but admit to being entirely stumped. What's your path to having both parties work towards something better?

            I'm very open to ideas of how to make the Republican party more productive, but admit to being entirely stumped. What's your path to having both parties work towards something better?

            6 votes
      2. thundergolfer
        Link Parent
        Gets way less attention that it deserves, probably because it's a 20 year project not a 4 year project. Education degradation is one of the main reasons I'm not optimistic about the USA's...

        Your education system.

        Gets way less attention that it deserves, probably because it's a 20 year project not a 4 year project.

        Education degradation is one of the main reasons I'm not optimistic about the USA's political future. Even if the Dems had secured a senate majority, they only had the resources to do one of Climate Crisis action or healthcare (or education). Now they won't have a senate majority and the education system was never really a priority.

        It is at least true that improvements in child poverty numbers and air quality both do a lot to improve educational performance, so education can be addressed indirectly. But no amount of Climate Change action is going to stop the amount of creationist nonsense that is taught in southern USA schools.

        7 votes
      3. [5]
        vord
        Link Parent
        Because of false attribution. I know plenty of folks thanking "Mr. President" for their unemployment and/or stimulus check. They don't see that Trump and his cronies caused the problem and tried...

        If making your own supporters' lives shit doesn't lose their votes, what could possibly make you think that improving everyone's lives will have a tangible effect on 2024?

        Because of false attribution. I know plenty of folks thanking "Mr. President" for their unemployment and/or stimulus check. They don't see that Trump and his cronies caused the problem and tried to stop relief.

        The cycle has been continuously tick/tock with Republicans leaving economy/nation in shambles, Democrats stabilizing a bit, and then Republicans claiming victory for the recovery the day they're elected and take credit for the rise and blame Dems for the fall.

        The only chance to break that swing is some big, genuine change fast, before 2022. Otherwise people will see business as usual and we continue the spiral to oblivion.

        Edit: And I agree it's a long shot. But that is the only way. They must show they are a genuine counterpoint to the horrors of Trump, and push out the rest of Republican control.

        6 votes
        1. [4]
          suspended
          Link Parent
          I'm 50 years old and live in the US. I've only witnessed our government in a downward spiral in my lifetime (with some nitpicking exceptions). My immediate family are planning our immigration to a...

          The only chance to break that swing is some big, genuine change fast, before 2022.

          I'm 50 years old and live in the US. I've only witnessed our government in a downward spiral in my lifetime (with some nitpicking exceptions).

          My immediate family are planning our immigration to a country where our children and grandchildren can have much more than what the US will offer.

          7 votes
          1. [3]
            vord
            Link Parent
            Yup. Around 38 myself, and once out of the blissful ignorance of childhood....yea looked pretty bleak both forward and back. We've got some plans. But I'm slightly more optimistic that once more...

            Yup. Around 38 myself, and once out of the blissful ignorance of childhood....yea looked pretty bleak both forward and back.

            We've got some plans. But I'm slightly more optimistic that once more Millennials start edging into the sphere of influence, things might finally turn. We're collectively impoverished, so perhaps our politicians will be more supportive of the masses and the future.

            5 votes
            1. [2]
              suspended
              Link Parent
              We live in a capitalistic society. Corporations run this country. This is a sobering fact that will take an overwhelming number of people, willing to reflect upon, before the trajectory of this...

              We live in a capitalistic society. Corporations run this country.

              This is a sobering fact that will take an overwhelming number of people, willing to reflect upon, before the trajectory of this country changes.

              My family will not wait any longer.

              Adios.

              3 votes
              1. vord
                Link Parent
                You are not wrong, and applaud your commitment. Here's hoping for a better world for us all.

                You are not wrong, and applaud your commitment.

                Here's hoping for a better world for us all.

                2 votes
    2. [15]
      streblo
      Link Parent
      Can’t do that without the senate.

      Can’t do that without the senate.

      9 votes
      1. [14]
        vord
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        House writes legislation. Right now Senate is tied, VP casts tiebreaker. The point is to exert pressure, and not compromise right out the gate. Edit: Hypothetical Biden presidential press release:...

        House writes legislation. Right now Senate is tied, VP casts tiebreaker.

        The point is to exert pressure, and not compromise right out the gate.

        Edit: Hypothetical Biden presidential press release:

        "This very minute, there is very important legislation headed to the Senate to help our great nation get through these tough times and get back on our feet. Mitch Mcconnell and other Republican senators are threatening to hold up or weaken this legislation for petty politics. You should call your representatives and tell them how you feel about that."

        6 votes
        1. [12]
          psi
          Link Parent
          There are four uncalled Senate races. Republicans will likely clinch AK and NC, while the two GA seats will head to a runoff. Democrats would need to win both of those runoffs races for the Senate...

          There are four uncalled Senate races. Republicans will likely clinch AK and NC, while the two GA seats will head to a runoff. Democrats would need to win both of those runoffs races for the Senate to remain tied come January.

          11 votes
          1. [11]
            vord
            Link Parent
            Dems don't need majority. They just need to shame enough R's to break party lines. Esp in ones like, oh, say, the ones that the R barely won.

            Dems don't need majority. They just need to shame enough R's to break party lines. Esp in ones like, oh, say, the ones that the R barely won.

            1 vote
            1. [3]
              stu2b50
              (edited )
              Link Parent
              No, they need a majority, because otherwise the Republicans can just fillibuster everything even with breakways. No way enough will break away to have a supermajority. The only way to do all that...

              No, they need a majority, because otherwise the Republicans can just fillibuster everything even with breakways. No way enough will break away to have a supermajority.

              The only way to do all that super fast passing is to have the majority, so you can remove the fillibuster, and then there's nothing stopping you from passing things. And no republican would breakaway for the nuclear option, tbh I'm not even sure democrats would all vote for it.

              8 votes
              1. [2]
                vord
                Link Parent
                Eh, I guess I hadn't thought about that. Thought filibuster was dead given the Democrats seemingly didn't even try to use it. That said, I guess my stance was this is what needs to happen not what...

                Eh, I guess I hadn't thought about that. Thought filibuster was dead given the Democrats seemingly didn't even try to use it.

                That said, I guess my stance was this is what needs to happen not what I think will actually happen.

                I foresee Repubs taking House again in 2022 and Pres again 2024 if it doesn't. So this is the time people.

                2 votes
                1. JCPhoenix
                  Link Parent
                  The Filibuster is dead for executive branch nominations, judicial appointments, and SCOTUS appointments. The first two groups were removed from filbuster by Democrats in 2013, with SCOTUS removed...

                  The Filibuster is dead for executive branch nominations, judicial appointments, and SCOTUS appointments. The first two groups were removed from filbuster by Democrats in 2013, with SCOTUS removed by Republicans in 2017.

                  But the filibuster does still exist. The reason you didn't see Dems use it much was because the Senate hasn't done much of anything lately.

                  6 votes
            2. [4]
              j3n
              Link Parent
              If no Republican was shamed enough to cross party lines in the last 4 years, what could possibly make them do so now?

              If no Republican was shamed enough to cross party lines in the last 4 years, what could possibly make them do so now?

              5 votes
              1. [3]
                vord
                Link Parent
                By having a president that calls them out on being an obstructionist asshole instead of giving out medals.

                By having a president that calls them out on being an obstructionist asshole instead of giving out medals.

                5 votes
                1. [2]
                  JCPhoenix
                  Link Parent
                  I don't think that's going to be Biden. He's much more diplomatic and collegial. Which makes sense since he's from the Senate. But that old school, traditional thing doesn't seem to work in our...

                  I don't think that's going to be Biden. He's much more diplomatic and collegial. Which makes sense since he's from the Senate. But that old school, traditional thing doesn't seem to work in our modern times, sadly.

                  Though Harris might. She strikes me as no-nonsense, calls it when she sees it. Perhaps it'll be a good cop, bad cop kinda thing.

                  6 votes
                  1. MimicSquid
                    Link Parent
                    I dunno. In his speech last night he said very specifically that choosing to work together is a choice, and so is choosing to stonewall. I think he'll be happy to use his bully pulpit to excoriate...

                    I dunno. In his speech last night he said very specifically that choosing to work together is a choice, and so is choosing to stonewall. I think he'll be happy to use his bully pulpit to excoriate the Senate if they try to just sit on their thumbs.

                    4 votes
            3. Litmus2336
              Link Parent
              My friends are joking that all covid aid will be doubled in Maine, and every bill passed = a new LL bean, in a bid to win over Collins.

              My friends are joking that all covid aid will be doubled in Maine, and every bill passed = a new LL bean, in a bid to win over Collins.

              3 votes
            4. [2]
              NaraVara
              Link Parent
              If they had shame they’d have changed parties already or resigned.

              If they had shame they’d have changed parties already or resigned.

              1. vord
                Link Parent
                As if Trump wasn't doing everything McConnell wanted. He was a useful idiot to the R party. Now, when 2/3 are in the D court, it's gonna be harder to hide in the crowd. Esp if Biden actually has...

                As if Trump wasn't doing everything McConnell wanted.

                He was a useful idiot to the R party. Now, when 2/3 are in the D court, it's gonna be harder to hide in the crowd. Esp if Biden actually has press conferences.

                6 votes
        2. streblo
          Link Parent
          Would just be filibustered indefinitely. It’s a pipe dream with the current seat counts.

          Would just be filibustered indefinitely.

          It’s a pipe dream with the current seat counts.

          1 vote
    3. [7]
      Kuromantis
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      (Answered below.) Just a question, why can't they just take out the dodgily appointed justices currently in the SCOTUS? Gorsuch and ACB clearly weren't appointed to those positions in good faith,...

      (Answered below.)

      Enlarge size of Supreme Court, name at least 3 more justices.

      Just a question, why can't they just take out the dodgily appointed justices currently in the SCOTUS? Gorsuch and ACB clearly weren't appointed to those positions in good faith, so what's the problem with just booting them out? That seems less risky than just adding new people in (BTW, who's gonna be doing the adding if that happens?), even if there almost certainly are quite a few left-of-center people qualified to serve on the SCOTUS and making the Supreme Court a harder to change institution by just making each judge less important is a good idea.

      2 votes
      1. spctrvl
        Link Parent
        Because that would require a two thirds rather than simple majority in the senate, which is for all practical purposes unobtainable.

        Because that would require a two thirds rather than simple majority in the senate, which is for all practical purposes unobtainable.

        10 votes
      2. [5]
        Adys
        Link Parent
        It's a can of worms. Expanding the court has less ramifications than impeaching a supreme justice. They're both cans of worms though. Personally I agree with you in ideology here though, ACB's and...

        It's a can of worms. Expanding the court has less ramifications than impeaching a supreme justice.

        They're both cans of worms though. Personally I agree with you in ideology here though, ACB's and Gorsuchs were both seated in bad faith. I do think ACB should be removed but she doesn't deserve impeachment, so it's a tricky call...

        Expanding the court circumvents this whole ordeal.

        I disagree with the idea that 3 justices should be added ASAP. This just plays in the same realm as what the GOP did by rushing Amy to the court. But I don't necessarily disagree with the idea of expanding the court in general.

        Merrick Garland should be renominated to SCOTUS, certainly. Amy's seat is absolutely illegitimate, and I think her nomination should be reversed due to the circumstances, but is that an impeachment? Maybe it has to be. Even RBG seemed to know that if her seat were to be filled, it'd be too late ...

        My guess is nothing will really happen on this front because it's too aggressive and for democrat politicians it's not important enough.

        2 votes
        1. [4]
          vord
          Link Parent
          The only reason I chose three: Court was already 5-4 on too many terrible positions. We're looking at more 6-3 decisions now. 3 barely gets us back to status quo. The precedent is there to expand,...

          The only reason I chose three:

          Court was already 5-4 on too many terrible positions. We're looking at more 6-3 decisions now.

          3 barely gets us back to status quo. The precedent is there to expand, it's been done before. Impeachment has not, and a bigger battle simply because it sort of undermines the 'appointment for life' bit.

          If I ruled the world, we'd add 1 and require concensus and not majority. But that's likely an even harder sell.

          6 votes
          1. [3]
            teaearlgraycold
            Link Parent
            I'm sure they would almost never be able to give another ruling if this was the case.

            require concensus and not majority

            I'm sure they would almost never be able to give another ruling if this was the case.

            2 votes
            1. [2]
              stu2b50
              Link Parent
              Yep. The Supreme Court giveth, the Supreme Court taketh. The Supreme Court is what ended segregation, paved the way for gay marriage, and allowed legal abortion in the US. It gave the Miranda...

              Yep. The Supreme Court giveth, the Supreme Court taketh. The Supreme Court is what ended segregation, paved the way for gay marriage, and allowed legal abortion in the US. It gave the Miranda rights, and public defense attorneys.

              I'm not sure that basically eliminating it as a branch of governance from every doing anything is in anyone's interest.

              5 votes
              1. vord
                Link Parent
                The problem is that these narrow split decisions basically keep the fire of those issues burning, and why 'stack the court' has been a Republican agenda since Roe v Wade. Each of what you listed...

                The problem is that these narrow split decisions basically keep the fire of those issues burning, and why 'stack the court' has been a Republican agenda since Roe v Wade. Each of what you listed is hardly a 'solved' matter.

                Concensus might be harder. By design. Supreme Jury has a better ring to it. Perhaps justices will get nominated on legitimate merit and not hitting the politician wishlist checkboxes.

                4 votes
    4. [12]
      xnaas
      Link Parent
      I'm going to have to absolutely disagree with this. The Democratic party is not experienced at playing asshole like the Republican party is. Nor is the Democratic party near as organized. Open...

      Enlarge size of Supreme Court, name at least 3 more justices. Get it in the queue.

      I'm going to have to absolutely disagree with this. The Democratic party is not experienced at playing asshole like the Republican party is. Nor is the Democratic party near as organized. Open that Pandora's Box and they will go far more extreme than any Democrat can imagine. Please, for the love of God, no.

      2 votes
      1. [11]
        spctrvl
        Link Parent
        So what's the alternative? Keep rolling over for authoritarians and hope for the best? Handling the Republicans with kid gloves for the last forty years is what got us into this mess in the first...

        So what's the alternative? Keep rolling over for authoritarians and hope for the best? Handling the Republicans with kid gloves for the last forty years is what got us into this mess in the first place, it's got to stop if we're to have any chance at pulling this country out of its death spiral.

        12 votes
        1. [10]
          xnaas
          Link Parent
          There are plenty of other ways to push back against the douchebaggery without making it worse for yourself. Expanding the Supreme Court will only help the Republican party be even more evil in the...

          There are plenty of other ways to push back against the douchebaggery without making it worse for yourself. Expanding the Supreme Court will only help the Republican party be even more evil in the future. It's much worse than cutting off your nose to spite your face. It's like telling the police "hey don't be so brutal" and then they go "I'll show you brutal!"

          If a Senate majority can be secured (along with House majority, of course), there's plenty of things that can be pushed through that won't start a nightmare.

          • A real healthcare plan could be pushed through (can be good for ALL Americans)
          • Decriminalization or legalization of marijuana at a federal level (this hurts the Prison-industrial Complex)
          • Something closer to looking like properly taxing the incredibly wealthy
          • A meaningful redistribution of federal spending
          • Term limits (though this is a hard sell for either side, I'm sure)
          • An end to legal bribery aka lobbying (same as above: hard sell)
          • etc.

          Personally, I think stricter laws on Gerrymandering and elimination of the Electoral College would do wonders for getting the Republican party to shape up.

          Edit: I'd love to see ranked-choice voting in addition to the elimination of the EC. That would also help, significantly, imo. Also: public education has to be redesigned to not be intentionally shitty. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

          3 votes
          1. [3]
            Cycloneblaze
            Link Parent
            What can the Democrats do to change the electoral structure of federal elections that can't be challenged in the Supreme Court? Because anything that is so challenged will lose. Packing the court...

            Personally, I think stricter laws on Gerrymandering and elimination of the Electoral College would do wonders for getting the Republican party to shape up.

            What can the Democrats do to change the electoral structure of federal elections that can't be challenged in the Supreme Court? Because anything that is so challenged will lose. Packing the court would obviate that and might be necessary for any fundamental political changes that the Dems would like. I'm doubtful on anything that requires a constitutional amendment either considering how many state legislatures Republicans hold.

            5 votes
            1. [2]
              xnaas
              Link Parent
              Sorry, I should've added more clarification than just "personally." I meant that I would like those things, but understand it would require the opening of Pandora's Box with a Supreme Court...

              Sorry, I should've added more clarification than just "personally." I meant that I would like those things, but understand it would require the opening of Pandora's Box with a Supreme Court expansion.

              Which...I'm sure it's abundantly clear by now, but I think it's a horrible idea that will only lead to more GOP oppression/suppression and backfire totally and utterly against democrats. I'm not saying I know I'm right, but I've got a strong feeling on this one. Maybe it's because I'm used to GOP assholery here in Texas.

              1 vote
              1. Cycloneblaze
                Link Parent
                Oh, I have no faith whatsoever in the GOP to not do that. It would be nice to see the Democrats for once be the ones to play hardball, as it were, but it will definitely only encourage the GOP....

                Oh, I have no faith whatsoever in the GOP to not do that. It would be nice to see the Democrats for once be the ones to play hardball, as it were, but it will definitely only encourage the GOP. But I don't see what else the Democrats are supposed to do (not asking you for answers in that, by the way).

                Ideally, it would be paired with some real constitutional amendments that restrict the ability to do the same things in the future (maybe term limits for Justices or a fixed-size court), but as I said, I don't see amendments ever happening again in your hyper-partisan political landscape.

                3 votes
          2. [6]
            spctrvl
            Link Parent
            I mean, I agree that we need to do all of those things, for sure. But we're not talking about packing the supreme court for shits and giggles, we're talking about it because the supreme court is...

            I mean, I agree that we need to do all of those things, for sure. But we're not talking about packing the supreme court for shits and giggles, we're talking about it because the supreme court is now packed with right wing reactionaries appointed by an unelected president, that will legislate from the bench and strike down practically anything we want to accomplish. Even reform as tepid as Obamacare wouldn't have made it past today's supreme court, expecting that wishlist to do so is fantasy. I think packing the court is definitely a risky move, but it's hard to see real progressive change as possible without it.

            3 votes
            1. [4]
              Adys
              Link Parent
              This is a super negative view of the court. Kavanaugh and Barrett are not as .. worthy of the position let's say, as the other justices, but I would think they take their power seriously. It's...

              This is a super negative view of the court. Kavanaugh and Barrett are not as .. worthy of the position let's say, as the other justices, but I would think they take their power seriously.

              It's easy to forget that among the GOP nuttiness, there are people who are both conservative AND professional. I don't think the court is as politicized by the justices themselves.

              The thing is that because the position is so powerful AND is a lifetime appointment, having an edge there is massive (and I think RBG's death is the most significant one of 2020). But saying that nothing can be accomplished by the left right now is just wrong.

              2 votes
              1. [3]
                spctrvl
                Link Parent
                I mean, the supreme court has spent much of the last twenty years undermining democracy in a series of disastrous 5-4 decisions along strict partisan lines. I think they've well earned the...

                I mean, the supreme court has spent much of the last twenty years undermining democracy in a series of disastrous 5-4 decisions along strict partisan lines. I think they've well earned the negativity, no matter how 'professional' they are. Maybe it was hyperbolic of me to insinuate that nothing can be done without packing the court, but it's still going to be a major roadblock to a progressive agenda.

                4 votes
                1. [2]
                  Adys
                  Link Parent
                  The 5-4 partisan decisions get more press than the rest. I follow a few people involved in SCOTUS on Twitter, my impression is that despite its flaws, SCOTUS is the best-functioning branch of the...

                  The 5-4 partisan decisions get more press than the rest.

                  I follow a few people involved in SCOTUS on Twitter, my impression is that despite its flaws, SCOTUS is the best-functioning branch of the US government right now. Fucking with it for partisan purposes would probably just make things worse.

                  1 vote
                  1. MimicSquid
                    Link Parent
                    I think there's a difference to be made between functioning (continuing to rule on decisions) and functioning (ruling in a way that represents the country and its general beliefs and direction). I...

                    I think there's a difference to be made between functioning (continuing to rule on decisions) and functioning (ruling in a way that represents the country and its general beliefs and direction). I don't think anyone is arguing about #1, but #2 is deeply in question.

                    2 votes
            2. xnaas
              Link Parent
              "Risky" only barely touches my concerns with the move haha — but I think it's safe to say we're mostly on the same page here for certain changes, at least. I agree that significant (read:...

              I think packing the court is definitely a risky move, but it's hard to see real progressive change as possible without it.

              "Risky" only barely touches my concerns with the move haha — but I think it's safe to say we're mostly on the same page here for certain changes, at least. I agree that significant (read: constitutional) changes are probably not possible without it, but I think in the long-term it'll only serve to lead to more GOP assholery and backfire completely and utterly against the democratic party.

              Note: I'd love to be wrong, here.

              1 vote
  9. [3]
    emdash
    Link
    The headline of the masthead on the New York Times says it all. There's something so timeless about that sort of announcement.

    The headline of the masthead on the New York Times says it all. There's something so timeless about that sort of announcement.

    7 votes
    1. [2]
      Adys
      Link Parent
      What is the masthead in that screenshot? I understand the masthead to be something that isn't present in that shot so I'm confused.

      What is the masthead in that screenshot? I understand the masthead to be something that isn't present in that shot so I'm confused.

      2 votes
      1. Marijn
        Link Parent
        The term masthead refers to different things in different parts in the world: in the US it (from what i can tell) refers to what everyone else would call an impressum, colophon, or imprint; in the...

        The term masthead refers to different things in different parts in the world: in the US it (from what i can tell) refers to what everyone else would call an impressum, colophon, or imprint; in the rest of the world it refers to the heading of the front page, which i assume is the meaning @emdash intended.

        7 votes
  10. cfabbro
    (edited )
    Link
    Oof. This one got me right in the feels: CNN's Van Jones reacts to Joe Biden's election as the 46th president of the United States. Edit: Well shit... I have just been informed elsewhere by some...

    Oof. This one got me right in the feels:
    CNN's Van Jones reacts to Joe Biden's election as the 46th president of the United States.

    Edit: Well shit... I have just been informed elsewhere by some friends that Van Jones is unfortunately a bit of a hypocrite when it comes to Trump, which kinda undercuts the emotional impact on the above video a bit. :(

    CNN’s Van Jones Secretly Helped Craft the Weak Trump Police Reform He Praised on TV

    2 votes
  11. [3]
    Keegan
    Link
    @Deimos the scraped info is a little broken here for the author field.

    @Deimos the scraped info is a little broken here for the author field.

    9 votes
    1. [2]
      xnaas
      Link Parent
      idk...I think <a href="/profiles/meg-wagner">Meg Wagner</a>, <a href="/profiles/fernando-alfonso-iii">Fernando Alfonso III</a>, Melissa Macaya, <a href="/profiles/melissa-mahtani">Melissa...

      idk...I think <a href="/profiles/meg-wagner">Meg Wagner</a>, <a href="/profiles/fernando-alfonso-iii">Fernando Alfonso III</a>, Melissa Macaya, <a href="/profiles/melissa-mahtani">Melissa Mahtani</a>, <a href="/profiles/veronica-rocha">Veronica Rocha</a> and <a href="/profiles/amanda-wills">Amanda Wills</a>, CNN is my favorite author to date!

      13 votes
      1. Akir
        Link Parent
        Good ole' "Angle Bracket" Ay and his complicated family tree.

        Good ole' "Angle Bracket" Ay and his complicated family tree.

        7 votes