38 votes

Megathread for news/updates/discussion about Musk's takeover of Twitter

The chaos doesn't seem likely to end anytime soon, does it?

116 comments

  1. [8]
    Loire
    Link
    Are there any credible, concrete explanation of what might have happened to Musk in the last half decade? Something beyond "billionaires bad"? At some point he was a fairly normal billionaire, at...

    Are there any credible, concrete explanation of what might have happened to Musk in the last half decade? Something beyond "billionaires bad"?

    At some point he was a fairly normal billionaire, at the head of two, arguably, successful businesses, both paving the way in their respective fields. He was a dick bag with all his "You're only successful if you work 20 hours a day and never sleep" thing, but he wasn't the Musk we see today. Then somewhere along the line the trolling and the memes start. The overtly obvious stock and crypto manipulation starts. The man seems to be losing his mind in a public fashion. Tesla goes from an automative darling to pumping out trash. Impregnating multiple women, including employees.

    What the hell happened? Where did he go from regular billionaire to Donald Trump? Did the lack of sleep break him? It's not the money. The bulk of billionaires shut up and keep to themselves.

    At this point it's a wonder that SpaceX is still functional.

    22 votes
    1. [3]
      Sheep
      Link Parent
      It seemed to me like during the height of the Trump era he began leaning into the alt-right conspiracy side of the internet, in particular the very libretarian wing. He started parroting free...
      • Exemplary

      It seemed to me like during the height of the Trump era he began leaning into the alt-right conspiracy side of the internet, in particular the very libretarian wing. He started parroting free speech to the extreme, backing conspiracy theories, and just in general having a really messed up view of the world revolving around individualism.

      It wouldn't surprise me at all if it turned out that he stumbled upon the alt-right pipeline one day, because every single person who has gone down that rabbit hole has completely lost it, millionaire or not. It's what happened to Kanye in the past couple years too, for example.

      Obviously I am not stating this as fact, just that he follows a very similar pattern to every other nutjob in that realm. He just happened to have a lot of money beforehand.

      16 votes
      1. rosco
        Link Parent
        He comes from some explicitly racist lineage. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he believe these things all along and found an audience that embraced his beliefs. Trump's victory gave a lot...

        It wouldn't surprise me at all if it turned out that he stumbled upon the alt-right pipeline one day, because every single person who has gone down that rabbit hole has completely lost it, millionaire or not.

        He comes from some explicitly racist lineage. I wouldn't be surprised to find out that he believe these things all along and found an audience that embraced his beliefs. Trump's victory gave a lot of people a green light to take off their masks and it feels like Musk is part of that cohort.

        10 votes
      2. drannex
        Link Parent
        I'll offer a slight addition, I think the biggest switch was when he began having to pull funding and support from nation States and other corporations with a more authoritarian bend. The timing...

        I'll offer a slight addition,

        the alt-right conspiracy side of the internet funding.

        I think the biggest switch was when he began having to pull funding and support from nation States and other corporations with a more authoritarian bend. The timing is also evident when he began being less the day-to-day owner and manager of the companies, arguably he hasn't ran day to day ops at Tesla or SpaceX in years.

        4 votes
    2. [2]
      TemulentTeatotaler
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      From sueing to be called a co-founder, his questionable academic record, story of being self-made, or his first wife's account, a lot of the traits (imprecisely, "narcicissism") that can be seen...

      From sueing to be called a co-founder, his questionable academic record, story of being self-made, or his first wife's account, a lot of the traits (imprecisely, "narcicissism") that can be seen at work in this meltdown seem to have existed for decades.

      The Isaacson biography on Steve Jobs mentions how he'd refuse to shower for weeks, put his unshoed(?) feet up on the desk of a superior, developed a product to likely intentionally sabotage another, delayed shipping for weeks over minute changes in a bevel, publicly berate employees for being loser virgins who'd never take LSD, and a dozen other traits that traits that you'd think wouldn't make a good luminary.

      I don't mean to paint Jobs as not gifted or as a villain, but he was flawed in ways that would destroy opportunities for others, and there's a large pool of possibly more competent, smart, driven people out there that didn't have his success. One explanation is the luck of time, field, and connections: the times make the man.

      The business majors I knew that idolized him attributed it to his intangible "reality distortion field", and I think that's the more interesting angle. Tesla's valuation distorted reality. I don't have the right background to assess it, but a PE ratio of >1300 feels more based on a collective subconscious desire-made-manifest to have a Tony Stark who will make self-driving cars to save us from global warming than on anything rational.

      Tesla/SpaceX/Apple tapped into that latent potential. They connected some dream with a sufficiently nearby reality and as a result squeezed out engineering talent for some amazing stuff. Colonizing Mars or chic, artistic technology made by elite programmers.

      I think Musk rose to where he is by tapping into that potential and his successes led him think he had some control over it. Maybe even mistaking it as some property of himself, like his genius engineering/coding skills. You can see the same shift in the crowd he courts in Trump or Kanye. People that simplify reality to a meme (Mexico will pay for a wall) or believe if you HODL to your AMC or Dogecoin it'll go to the moon.

      Colonizing Mars isn't possible (soon), though, and you can't heal cancer with a fruitarian diet. The strategy of reaching for something that isn't grounded in reality fails if it isn't close enough to make that bridge, and the person reaching for something intangible looks crazy.

      14 votes
      1. skybrian
        Link Parent
        I think Steve Jobs was somewhat of a crazy villain, actually. But as in the old joke goes: It’s pretty normal for weird people to get funded if they seem effective in the right way. I don’t know...

        I think Steve Jobs was somewhat of a crazy villain, actually. But as in the old joke goes:

        “Doctor, my brother’s crazy, he thinks he’s a chicken!”

        “That’s terrible, why didn’t you bring him in sooner?”

        “We needed the eggs.”

        It’s pretty normal for weird people to get funded if they seem effective in the right way.

        I don’t know how we can tell if Musk is committed to Mars or just really committed to the bit.

        3 votes
    3. TheJorro
      Link Parent
      It could just be as simple as we all got to know him better. Internet fame and social media addiction probably were the catalysts but whether they made him worse or just expose himself more is...

      It could just be as simple as we all got to know him better. Internet fame and social media addiction probably were the catalysts but whether they made him worse or just expose himself more is probably something only people close to him the entire time could say.

      5 votes
    4. skybrian
      Link Parent
      I doubt Musk was ever "normal." Bullying, bet-the-company risk taking, lawbreaking, and not listening to experts who say it won't work has worked out well for him, or was at least recoverable....

      I doubt Musk was ever "normal." Bullying, bet-the-company risk taking, lawbreaking, and not listening to experts who say it won't work has worked out well for him, or was at least recoverable. Attention-getting antics won him many fans. Pushing people hard seemed to work at his previous companies. He's doing roughly similar things with worse results. It remains to be seen if these mistakes are recoverable.

      More generally, there's plenty of precedent for people being really successful, becoming overconfident, and then trying a similar playbook in a new situation and failing badly. It's the basic archvillian tragedy. Napoleon in Russia comes to mind.

      5 votes
  2. [6]
    skybrian
    Link
    Hundreds said to have opted to leave Twitter over Musk ultimatum (Washington Post)

    Hundreds said to have opted to leave Twitter over Musk ultimatum (Washington Post)

    The crisis came in response to an ultimatum new owner Elon Musk issued Wednesday demanding that employees sign a pledge to work harder by 5 p.m. Eastern time Thursday or accept three months’ severance pay.

    In an early sign that the number of those declining to sign was greater than anticipated, Musk eased off a return-to-office mandate he had issued a week ago, telling employees Thursday they would be allowed to work remotely if their managers assert they are making “an excellent contribution.”

    But it was too late to keep Twitter from a precarious position, several workers said.

    “I know of six critical systems (like ‘serving tweets’ levels of critical) which no longer have any engineers,” a former employee said. "There is no longer even a skeleton crew manning the system. It will continue to coast until it runs into something, and then it will stop.”

    Workers offered varying estimates of how many people remained employed at Twitter, ranging from 2,000 to 2,500, down from the 3,500 or so believed to have remained after an initial round of layoffs this month.

    Among those who were said to have declined to sign the pledge was half the trust and safety policy team, including a majority of those who work on spotting misinformation, spam, fake accounts and impersonation, according to one employee familiar with the team.

    Meanwhile, several critical engineering teams were reported to have been hollowed out. The team that runs the service Gizmoduck, which powers and stores all information in user profiles across the site, was entirely gone, according to a recent department head who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to detail the departures.

    19 votes
    1. spit-evil-olive-tips
      Link Parent
      Men's World Cup starts on Sunday and runs for a month. (credit to Alejandra Caraballo which is where I first saw this connection made explicit) under normal circumstances, we would expect to see...

      “I know of six critical systems (like ‘serving tweets’ levels of critical) which no longer have any engineers,” a former employee said. "There is no longer even a skeleton crew manning the system. It will continue to coast until it runs into something, and then it will stop.”

      Men's World Cup starts on Sunday and runs for a month.

      (credit to Alejandra Caraballo which is where I first saw this connection made explicit)

      under normal circumstances, we would expect to see large surges in traffic during matches, coming from every corner of the globe.

      Qatar is 11 hours time difference from the US west coast, which means that many of the traffic surges will happen in the middle of the night, San Francisco time.

      15 votes
    2. [3]
      smoontjes
      Link Parent
      What the fuck

      sign a pledge to work harder

      What the fuck

      14 votes
      1. FishFingus
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        You know, like he does. We may be able to automate driving*, but not the genius of those shitposts. *Those people shouldn't have driven/cycled/walked/stood so close to innovation.

        You know, like he does. We may be able to automate driving*, but not the genius of those shitposts.

        *Those people shouldn't have driven/cycled/walked/stood so close to innovation.

        8 votes
      2. lou
        Link Parent
        I believe he wants people to leave so that everyone that remains will be faithful to him and he can start from scratch.

        I believe he wants people to leave so that everyone that remains will be faithful to him and he can start from scratch.

        5 votes
    3. Fiachra
      Link Parent
      Since 2020, nothing has been a surer way to trigger a mass walkout than to suddenly revoke WFH and threaten to fire everyone who doesn't comply. I also keep seeing all over twitter that Musk and...

      Since 2020, nothing has been a surer way to trigger a mass walkout than to suddenly revoke WFH and threaten to fire everyone who doesn't comply.

      I also keep seeing all over twitter that Musk and his fans seem to be taking a very hardline "my way or the highway" attitude to twitter staff that's common to see directed at minimum wage workers, but is very jarring to see directed at specialised engineering staff. These are staff who could not only find better options easily, but are likely to be approached by recruiters even if they aren't looking. It's equally wrong to disrespect workers of any kind, but on a strictly practical level it seems obvious that antagonising the engineering talent will backfire quickly.

      Final thought, if you gave me the choice between working undefined 'extended hours' indefinitely with no WFH under constant threat of being fired, or three months' pay in exchange for doing nothing just before the christmas season, I know what I would pick.

      11 votes
  3. [2]
    skybrian
    Link
    Elon Musk abruptly shut down Twitter offices as workers resign en masse (Business Insider) [...]

    Elon Musk abruptly shut down Twitter offices as workers resign en masse (Business Insider)

    Company officials told employees all buildings were temporarily closed, effective immediately, and that their badge access would be revoked for the time being, Platformer's Zoë Schiffer first reported. Insider confirmed that Twitter employees' badge access was suspended and that they were being told to leave the offices, which are expected to reopen on Monday.

    The reason behind the abrupt closure was that Twitter CEO Elon Musk and others were afraid employees would "sabotage the company" and because they are working out whose access needs to be revoked, Schiffer reported.

    [...]

    The latest closure came just over one week after Musk put an end to remote work at Twitter.

    12 votes
  4. [4]
    patience_limited
    (edited )
    Link
    I haven't commented because I'm frankly simmering with rage at the combined debacles in social media and finance. Musk, SBF, Meta, Google, SoftBank, et al. have collectively destroyed monetary...

    I haven't commented because I'm frankly simmering with rage at the combined debacles in social media and finance. Musk, SBF, Meta, Google, SoftBank, et al. have collectively destroyed monetary value greater than the cumulative 2020 wealthy nation spending for climate mitigation in less developed (and most climate-affected) nations.

    If money is a means of designating priority, we've all participated, in one way or another, in the fiction that it's more important to be heard than to fix things.

    With apologies for bomb-throwing - I read the Oxfam reporting and just had a moment.

    11 votes
    1. [3]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      I'm wondering why Google is in that list. Is it because their stock went down?

      I'm wondering why Google is in that list. Is it because their stock went down?

      1 vote
      1. [2]
        patience_limited
        Link Parent
        No, it's more about the general implosion of ad revenue and the fallout from destruction of the G+ platform. I shouldn't say that G+ was destroyed, it's just been packaged up in Workspaces as a...

        No, it's more about the general implosion of ad revenue and the fallout from destruction of the G+ platform. I shouldn't say that G+ was destroyed, it's just been packaged up in Workspaces as a monetizable product.

        In any event, a great deal of capital has been invested in various quixotic tech ventures (fintech, social media, entertainment), for little lasting value in return.

        2 votes
        1. skybrian
          Link Parent
          Well, it's true that lots of us techies got paid well to build things that didn't turn out to be successful. This isn't an accident; it's how venture capital works. The winners are supposed to...

          Well, it's true that lots of us techies got paid well to build things that didn't turn out to be successful. This isn't an accident; it's how venture capital works. The winners are supposed to make up for the losers. There are also other risky and enormously wasteful ventures like medical research, but they're somewhat lower profile.

          It does seem like any consumer product that Google invests in is cursed, but the failure rate outside Google is pretty high, too.

          There is enormous waste everywhere, which is frustratingly hard to fix. Unfortunately, just going after suspected waste without understanding things doesn't work, as we're seeing. It also makes lots of enemies.

          Not sure what you mean by "implosion of ad revenue." Do you mean for newspapers?

          4 votes
  5. [15]
    cloud_loud
    Link
    Trump has now been reinstated

    Trump has now been reinstated

    10 votes
    1. [10]
      JXM
      Link Parent
      This is bad. Real bad. Remember why he was kicked off? For trying to overthrow the US government. Let’s hope he just stays on Truth Social and doesn’t come back out of some petty spite.

      This is bad. Real bad. Remember why he was kicked off? For trying to overthrow the US government.

      Let’s hope he just stays on Truth Social and doesn’t come back out of some petty spite.

      12 votes
      1. teaearlgraycold
        Link Parent
        I think there won't be much of a Twitter to tweet from in a couple of weeks.

        I think there won't be much of a Twitter to tweet from in a couple of weeks.

        2 votes
      2. [8]
        Amarok
        Link Parent
        He has no self control. Sooner or later something some other Republican says on Twitter will trigger him and he'll go off on a tear. Every time Trump opens his mouth on twitter he'll be doing the...

        He has no self control. Sooner or later something some other Republican says on Twitter will trigger him and he'll go off on a tear.

        Every time Trump opens his mouth on twitter he'll be doing the Democrats a favor. He's a dead brand that has been losing steam for three elections and nothing he says or does will get him any closer to the white house. All he can do is knock the rest of the Republicans down with him. I'm looking forward to his next batch of meltdowns.

        1 vote
        1. [7]
          JXM
          Link Parent
          That’s exactly what we all said in 2015.

          That’s exactly what we all said in 2015.

          6 votes
          1. [6]
            Amarok
            Link Parent
            The Trump Republicans had their asses kicked in three separate election cycles since then, losing worse every time. I hope they are stupid enough to try it again.

            The Trump Republicans had their asses kicked in three separate election cycles since then, losing worse every time. I hope they are stupid enough to try it again.

            4 votes
            1. [5]
              skybrian
              Link Parent
              For the most recent election, that seems a bit exaggerated? Republicans did worse than expectations, but they regained control of the House, which is gaining some ground.

              For the most recent election, that seems a bit exaggerated? Republicans did worse than expectations, but they regained control of the House, which is gaining some ground.

              3 votes
              1. [2]
                stu2b50
                Link Parent
                For context, though, this was the best performance of an incumbent party at the midterms in the postwar era. The best performance was during a time of 10% inflation with a president whose approval...

                For context, though, this was the best performance of an incumbent party at the midterms in the postwar era. The best performance was during a time of 10% inflation with a president whose approval rating is in the 40%s. For incumbent presidents with an approval rating below 50%, the average seats lost in the house is 45.

                Republicans had a 2 point turnout edge against Democrats.

                They did gain ground, but had to be dragged kicking and screaming by the natural dynamics of US midterm elections. In places like New York (with moderate Republican candidates, no threat of abortion restriction, and no election certification shenanigans), there was a mini red-wave, with moderate republicans winning numerous house seats, which goes to show how the opposition party should perform with their natural tailwinds.

                11 votes
                1. teaearlgraycold
                  Link Parent
                  And the dems may yet gain a seat in the senate. What an embarrassment that would be.

                  And the dems may yet gain a seat in the senate. What an embarrassment that would be.

                  4 votes
              2. [2]
                Amarok
                Link Parent
                No, I don't think so. We were all set for a legendary 'red wave' that would retake the house and the senate. The polls were so universally wrong on this one that they lost scientific credibility....

                No, I don't think so. We were all set for a legendary 'red wave' that would retake the house and the senate. The polls were so universally wrong on this one that they lost scientific credibility. The GOP spent several fortunes and barely got the house, which should have been effortless for them. They always do well in the mid-terms - but not this time. Even Fox News has realized Trump is a losing brand, go check out their coverage of his announcement.

                Republicans want Trump gone. They know if he is the face of their party it's game over for another decade. They only just now figured this out for sure thanks to the mid-term numbers. They got what they wanted out of him, and since he can no longer deliver for them it's time to drop him like a used condom. His ego may even form a DJT party all by itself and split 10-15% off their base, which is a great incentive for them to lock him up. Watching him rip the GOP apart yet again is going to be entertaining.

                Having him back on Twitter will be great. Every time he opens his mouth more districts turn blue.

                5 votes
                1. skybrian
                  Link Parent
                  From what I've read the polls were pretty accurate this year. It wasn't the polls that predicted the 'red wave', it was the pundits. Often, though, in close races the polls will predict a toss-up,...

                  From what I've read the polls were pretty accurate this year. It wasn't the polls that predicted the 'red wave', it was the pundits.

                  Often, though, in close races the polls will predict a toss-up, in which case the polls aren't that useful for predicting the outcome, however useful they might be strategically to election campaigns.

                  We are off-topic, by the way.

                  5 votes
    2. [3]
      moocow1452
      Link Parent
      Does he come back? He has his own social network now, and there may be some exclusivity reason that he would stick to his own little fiefdom, plus the inherit control of owning your own platform....

      Does he come back? He has his own social network now, and there may be some exclusivity reason that he would stick to his own little fiefdom, plus the inherit control of owning your own platform.

      Now if Twitter opens up the ability to protocol with other networks and one of the first compatible ones is Truth Social... Or Trump just runs over to the place with the loudest audience.

      3 votes
      1. [2]
        whbboyd
        Link Parent
        This is not happening. Even if there were the will for it, they no longer have the engineering talent (to say nothing of institutional knowledge about how their own systems work). Federation is...

        Now if Twitter opens up the ability to protocol with other networks

        This is not happening. Even if there were the will for it, they no longer have the engineering talent (to say nothing of institutional knowledge about how their own systems work). Federation is actually extraordinarily difficult to do even poorly, and at Twitter's scale it would be an unprecedented exercise.

        6 votes
  6. [10]
    cloud_loud
    Link
    If Twitter does go down, I can’t even comprehend the consequences it would have on the broader culture and politics. Even though not very many people used twitter it had an outsized impact to the...

    If Twitter does go down, I can’t even comprehend the consequences it would have on the broader culture and politics. Even though not very many people used twitter it had an outsized impact to the rest of the world. Probably due to many celebrities and politicians using the platform.

    But I just don’t see how it can survive for very long under the current circumstances.

    9 votes
    1. [6]
      elcuello
      Link Parent
      Not to be rude but I think you might need to go outside for a bit. This seems like a huge overreaction. The internet adapts VERY quickly and it's not like this is coming without any warning. Plus...

      I can’t even comprehend the consequences it would have on the broader culture and politics.

      Not to be rude but I think you might need to go outside for a bit. This seems like a huge overreaction. The internet adapts VERY quickly and it's not like this is coming without any warning. Plus there are an abundance of services ready to take over anything Twitter could do.

      13 votes
      1. nacho
        Link Parent
        A number of public services and likewise use Twitter for announcements. For many countries, changing platforms for those will take time. Both practically, to regain their audiences and simply...

        A number of public services and likewise use Twitter for announcements.

        For many countries, changing platforms for those will take time. Both practically, to regain their audiences and simply because of logistics of making a switch.

        For example, a number of police departments, traffic services, public services, airports etc. will have to find new places to make public announcements for events: like delays and other things they now push out Tweets for to reach their clientele instantly.

        It's much the same for press releases and breaking news: If it's not on Twitter, it hasn't happened yet.

        Secondary reporting or getting news around also relies extremely heavily on Twitter for meta-propagation. Facebook or others will not take that niche. The internet adapts very slowly for these network-level effects. Twitter's been this monopoly since it got big.

        9 votes
      2. [4]
        Thrabalen
        Link Parent
        The only one even close to large enough is Facebook, and I don't think that fleeing a platform devalued by the narcissistic whims of its egotist billionaire owner to go to Facebook of all places...

        The only one even close to large enough is Facebook, and I don't think that fleeing a platform devalued by the narcissistic whims of its egotist billionaire owner to go to Facebook of all places is the best answer.

        4 votes
        1. [3]
          mat
          Link Parent
          I feel like one of the reasons Twitter is still going is that there is just nowhere for people to run to. Mastodon and cohost and similar places are not up to the job of being Twitter. Small...

          I feel like one of the reasons Twitter is still going is that there is just nowhere for people to run to. Mastodon and cohost and similar places are not up to the job of being Twitter. Small communities might do well there but there is no way to have, say, @britneyspears on there with her 55 million followers. You need datacentre-grade infrastructure to deliver that sort of hosting.

          Just this morning I was thinking if somewhere at Google someone is wondering how long it would take to dust off the Plus code and get that back up and running again. It was always a superior platform in terms of features and technology to both Twitter and FB, also consistently did better numbers than Twitter but then they did the Google thing and away it went.

          13 votes
          1. [2]
            skybrian
            Link Parent
            It wouldn't happen that way. Dusting off old code is unlikely to make sense because of churn in the underlying infrastructure. If they try it, I would guess something new connected to YouTube....

            It wouldn't happen that way. Dusting off old code is unlikely to make sense because of churn in the underlying infrastructure.

            If they try it, I would guess something new connected to YouTube. Google is letting everyone with a YouTube channel pick a handle. I don't know what they plan to use it for, but adding a way to post text messages as well as videos probably wouldn't be too hard.

            5 votes
            1. mat
              Link Parent
              If Google wanted to build a Twitter competitor, refactoring old bits of Plus (and current bits of Workspaces) would almost certainly be cheaper and faster than building from scratch. The...

              If Google wanted to build a Twitter competitor, refactoring old bits of Plus (and current bits of Workspaces) would almost certainly be cheaper and faster than building from scratch. The underlying infrastructure would probably be easier to manage now than then if they've been smart about modularising things like auth and profiles and so on.

              However, Plus died when Vic Gundotra left, and it's almost certainly not coming back. They do appear to be trying to pivot/expand YT as a TikTok competitor which is probably a smart move given the persistent rumours about TikTok getting banned in the US and general loss of social traffic to there. Whether the new Youtube bits can take over from Twitter as well is a whole different question.

              I don't think anyone could have foreseen the gargantuan mess Musk is making of Twitter so nobody has anything in the works to take over from it. Which is a shame because I sort of feel like a decent number of people are wanting to leave but don't know where to go.

              5 votes
    2. [3]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      I've consistently underestimated the damage they could do, and maybe I'm doing it again, but: If they started getting frequent "fail whales" like the old days, it wouldn't be the end of the world....

      I've consistently underestimated the damage they could do, and maybe I'm doing it again, but:

      If they started getting frequent "fail whales" like the old days, it wouldn't be the end of the world. It would mostly mean that us addicts would have to take a break for a while.

      It might take them some time to figure out how to do a cold start, though.

      In the meantime, they'd be getting no revenue (no ad impressions) and losing customers as people find other ways to spend their time.

      (Bankruptcy probably wouldn't be the end, either. It would mean the bondholders own the business instead of Musk, and then it's more valuable to them to keep an ongoing business running.)

      9 votes
      1. [2]
        cfabbro
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        To be fair to you, I don't think even the biggest Musk critics (myself included) expected him to fail this spectacularly, this quickly, especially given how much of his own money and Tesla stocks...

        To be fair to you, I don't think even the biggest Musk critics (myself included) expected him to fail this spectacularly, this quickly, especially given how much of his own money and Tesla stocks are on the line.

        I never in my wildest dreams imagined the transition would go this incredibly bad. I assumed it would just be a gradual decline as Musk slowly began shaping Twitter into what he wanted it to be (freeze peach focused), not this instantly going from disastrous decision to disastrous decision completely destroying the very foundation of the business as soon as he stepped through the doors. Every single move he has made so far honestly feels like something only someone who was intentionally sabotaging the business would do. Because surely even Musk can't be this completely and utterly incompetent as a manager, right?

        It's truly bizarre, but he is sounding more and more paranoid and unhinged with each tweet, action, and internal communication of his that gets leaked, so I don't think any of this is actually intentional. It genuinely feels like he drank his own Kool-Aid, and his insanely bloated ego has finally driven him over the deep end.

        19 votes
        1. bhrgunatha
          Link Parent
          How it must now feel to have been one of those board members. Relieved of the headache of a never profitable burden, slowly grinding along keeping the lurching monster alive during its slow...

          How it must now feel to have been one of those board members.

          Relieved of the headache of a never profitable burden, slowly grinding along keeping the lurching monster alive during its slow demise, only to be given whatever the bird equivalent of a golden handshake is - a golden peck?

          5 votes
  7. [5]
    DanBC
    Link
    A mega thread in roughly chronological order with Musk saying what he plans do do around Blue, and people telling him it'll be a bad idea, and him ignoring all the very many warnings, and then all...

    A mega thread in roughly chronological order with Musk saying what he plans do do around Blue, and people telling him it'll be a bad idea, and him ignoring all the very many warnings, and then all the stuff he was warned about happening.

    https://twitter.com/christapeterso/status/1592317592966168576?s=20&t=hSQRCxfU5ZiDYaS7Eoj1vQ

    (Because it's come up before, I am not linking to a single tweet. I am linking to the first post in a long thread of connected tweets).

    7 votes
    1. [3]
      smoontjes
      Link Parent
      What is blue?

      What is blue?

      3 votes
      1. [2]
        DanBC
        Link Parent
        Twitter Blue was the service that Musk wanted to bring in where anyone could pay to get a Twitter verification blue check mark.

        Twitter Blue was the service that Musk wanted to bring in where anyone could pay to get a Twitter verification blue check mark.

        3 votes
        1. Adys
          Link Parent
          And instead, Twitter blew.

          And instead, Twitter blew.

          8 votes
  8. skybrian
    Link
    Twitter data leak exposes over 5.4 million accounts (Engadget)

    Twitter data leak exposes over 5.4 million accounts (Engadget)

    Earlier this year, Twitter confirmed that the private user data for 5.4 million users was stolen due to an API vulnerability, but the company said it had "no evidence" that it was exploited. Now, all of those accounts have been exposed on a hacker form, BleepingComputer has reported. On top of that, an additional 1.4 million Twitter profiles for suspended users was reportedly shared privately, and an even larger data dump with the data of "tens of millions" of other users may have come from the same vulnerability.

    The owner of hacking forum called Breached told BleepingComputer that it was responsible for exploiting the weakness (originally obtained from another hacker called "Devil") and dumping the user records. It said that it also obtained 1.4 million Twitter profiles for suspended accounts, obtained via another API, but only shared those privately among a few individuals.

    7 votes
  9. [3]
    cfabbro
    Link
    NSFW - https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1594500655724609536 Elon Musk has lost his fucking mind.

    NSFW - https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1594500655724609536

    Elon Musk has lost his fucking mind.

    6 votes
    1. [2]
      cfabbro
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Holy shit, this post from Donald Trump about Musk on Truth Social from earlier this year is vicious. (Screenshot for those who want to avoid visiting Truth Social) I wonder if Musk ever saw that....

      Holy shit, this post from Donald Trump about Musk on Truth Social from earlier this year is vicious.
      (Screenshot for those who want to avoid visiting Truth Social)

      I wonder if Musk ever saw that. I doubt it, because if he had I don't think he would still be courting Trump so hard to get back on Twitter.

      5 votes
      1. moocow1452
        Link Parent
        One way Twitter could make money if they didn't want advertisers could be a Patreon esque model where you pay for access to star and influencer tweets. Would be a hell of a pivot from where...

        One way Twitter could make money if they didn't want advertisers could be a Patreon esque model where you pay for access to star and influencer tweets. Would be a hell of a pivot from where Twitter is now, but maybe that's the kind of Twitter Elon wants?

        1 vote
  10. [7]
    DanBC
    Link
    George Hotz finds out how hard development is: https://twitter.com/corg_e/status/1595287073547862018?s=20&t=y-6YHf7EKiwG78NK-tba2A
    6 votes
    1. [5]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      This kind of screenshot gotcha culture is a thing I won’t miss about Twitter. None of us need to know who this guy is or how he’s screwing up, assuming it even counts as a screwup.

      This kind of screenshot gotcha culture is a thing I won’t miss about Twitter. None of us need to know who this guy is or how he’s screwing up, assuming it even counts as a screwup.

      4 votes
      1. [2]
        Comment deleted by author
        Link Parent
        1. skybrian
          Link Parent
          Well, yeah, it probably is chaotic. On the other hand, I'm not sure we know what he's in charge of? At Google any intern could send a pull request; it doesn't mean it would be accepted by the...

          Well, yeah, it probably is chaotic. On the other hand, I'm not sure we know what he's in charge of? At Google any intern could send a pull request; it doesn't mean it would be accepted by the owners.

          With all the people who left, I doubt they have a clear idea about who approves code changes now, though.

          2 votes
      2. [2]
        DanBC
        Link Parent
        Knowing that it's George Hotz is kind of the point though. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hotz Musk is saying that coding Twitter is easy, and you don't need all those engineers, you just...

        Knowing that it's George Hotz is kind of the point though.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Hotz

        Musk is saying that coding Twitter is easy, and you don't need all those engineers, you just need a few 10x engineers. Hotz is supposedly one of those super engineers, and here he is, giving up.

        4 votes
        1. skybrian
          Link Parent
          Another thing about screenshot culture is that people make claims about screenshots that aren't actually backed up by the screenshots, which means you have to look at such claims skeptically - and...

          Another thing about screenshot culture is that people make claims about screenshots that aren't actually backed up by the screenshots, which means you have to look at such claims skeptically - and if you do that, you're wasting more time on it. This does seem like a peculiar recruitment gimmick but it's not all that clear what he's trying to do. People are sure to interpret it as badly as possible, though.

          1 vote
      3. streblo
        Link Parent
        Ran into a very similar take recently: https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/1595279130723078150

        Ran into a very similar take recently: https://twitter.com/tobiaschneider/status/1595279130723078150

        One thing that's fascinating about this website is how, despite us being locked in here together, there is still so much unhinged misrepresentation of what people say, think, or do. Like, it's right there! And still, everyone takes their cues from the cool kids rolling their eyes

        It's the damn quote tweets feature, naturally. You only ever see the dunks.

        1 vote
  11. [5]
    Adys
    Link
    I am going to miss Foone.

    I am going to miss Foone.

    5 votes
    1. [3]
      admicos
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      they also switched to masto: https://mastodon.social/@Foone

      they also switched to masto: https://mastodon.social/@Foone

      4 votes
      1. [2]
        JRandomHacker
        Link Parent
        Just so you know, Foone uses they/them pronouns

        Just so you know, Foone uses they/them pronouns

        4 votes
        1. admicos
          Link Parent
          i forgot :( english isn't my native language, and we don't have that many gendered pronouns here

          i forgot :(

          english isn't my native language, and we don't have that many gendered pronouns here

          11 votes
    2. FishFingus
      Link Parent
      Wow, now I think I will too. I never knew there were so many types of floppies, let alone sizes!

      Wow, now I think I will too. I never knew there were so many types of floppies, let alone sizes!

  12. [9]
    just_a_salmon
    Link
    I’m wondering what Musk’s investment partners think about all this, and how soon they’ll take action publicly.

    I’m wondering what Musk’s investment partners think about all this, and how soon they’ll take action publicly.

    5 votes
    1. [8]
      skybrian
      Link Parent
      I don’t think they can do much as minority shareholders in a private company. They don’t have the votes.

      I don’t think they can do much as minority shareholders in a private company. They don’t have the votes.

      6 votes
      1. [6]
        streblo
        Link Parent
        I'm kind of surprised no one has cut bait yet. Sell your investment for fifty cents on the dollar and get off the roller coaster.

        I'm kind of surprised no one has cut bait yet. Sell your investment for fifty cents on the dollar and get off the roller coaster.

        4 votes
        1. [2]
          skybrian
          Link Parent
          Who would buy? The banks are in a similar position. Musk borrowed a lot of money and normally they would sell the bonds, but can you imagine that sales pitch? Under the circumstances, there’s...

          Who would buy?

          The banks are in a similar position. Musk borrowed a lot of money and normally they would sell the bonds, but can you imagine that sales pitch? Under the circumstances, there’s nothing to do but wait and hope things improve.

          6 votes
          1. streblo
            Link Parent
            Yea it may be too late now. I think I remember reading they had been offered 60 cents on the dollar a week or two ago but that was 'too low' and they were seeking other offers. I bet they would...

            Yea it may be too late now. I think I remember reading they had been offered 60 cents on the dollar a week or two ago but that was 'too low' and they were seeking other offers. I bet they would take that in a heartbeat today.

            5 votes
        2. [3]
          MimicSquid
          Link Parent
          Who would buy a share of Twitter now? It would have to be the beefiest of discounts. I might pay a hundredth of a cent on the dollar, but even then I'm not confident that Twitter has 54 Million...

          Who would buy a share of Twitter now? It would have to be the beefiest of discounts. I might pay a hundredth of a cent on the dollar, but even then I'm not confident that Twitter has 54 Million worth of value anymore. The used office furniture market is beyond flooded.

          3 votes
          1. DanBC
            Link Parent
            The Elon fans would buy it if he pushed it to them.

            The Elon fans would buy it if he pushed it to them.

            1 vote
          2. Adys
            Link Parent
            It’s a bet. If Twitter does survive the next couple weeks there is a high chance it will survive much longer and become something … different. It certainly won’t be old Twitter anymore but who...

            It’s a bet. If Twitter does survive the next couple weeks there is a high chance it will survive much longer and become something … different. It certainly won’t be old Twitter anymore but who knows what that means. It could still find success a different way.

            1 vote
      2. cfabbro
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        I suspect the various Saudis and Qataris providing the funds for the buyout have a bit more sway than most minority stakeholders otherwise would. And if they start to worry that their investments...

        I suspect the various Saudis and Qataris providing the funds for the buyout have a bit more sway than most minority stakeholders otherwise would. And if they start to worry that their investments in Twitter are now at risk, and so tell Musk to step aside to let someone who actually knows what they're doing run the day to day operations, I am sure he would actually seriously consider doing as they ask. He may be a billionaire, but they have State apparatus and geopolitical influence behind them, and much much deeper pockets. They're also not the sort of people you would want to piss off by losing them billions of dollars, especially Prince Alwaleed.

        3 votes
  13. [5]
    FishFingus
    Link
    General amnesty announced for all suspended accounts. This'll mix nicely with their recent genocidal rhetoric. Advertisers must be tripping over their weenies to come rushing back to Twitter.

    General amnesty announced for all suspended accounts. This'll mix nicely with their recent genocidal rhetoric. Advertisers must be tripping over their weenies to come rushing back to Twitter.

    5 votes
    1. [2]
      psi
      Link Parent
      In case you're wondering how this meshes with his previous promise of an independent council. Musk on October 28: Musk less than a month later: Apparently it's a council of one now.

      In case you're wondering how this meshes with his previous promise of an independent council.

      Musk on October 28:

      Twitter will be forming a content moderation council with widely diverse viewpoints.

      No major content decisions or account reinstatements will happen before that council convenes.

      Musk less than a month later:

      A large coalition of political/social activist groups agreed not to try to kill Twitter by starving us of advertising revenue if I agreed to this condition.

      They broke the deal.

      Apparently it's a council of one now.

      5 votes
      1. FishFingus
        Link Parent
        Oh, the "I am the senate" approach. I wish I could pretend to be surprised, but instead I'll just be a sarcastic bastard. 🙃

        Oh, the "I am the senate" approach. I wish I could pretend to be surprised, but instead I'll just be a sarcastic bastard. 🙃

        2 votes
    2. Adys
      Link Parent
      I may be off here but it’s sounding like Elon doesn’t care about advertisers. It makes sense that he wouldn’t. None of his businesses have been ad based and the ad model doesn’t necessarily look...

      I may be off here but it’s sounding like Elon doesn’t care about advertisers.

      It makes sense that he wouldn’t. None of his businesses have been ad based and the ad model doesn’t necessarily look profitable at Twitter for someone who just came in. Twitter hasn’t succeeded at following Facebooks footsteps there.

      If Twitter stops relying on ads… well, fucking great honestly. I’m a strong believer that the ads model is one of the great evils of the current internet.

      3 votes
  14. [3]
    psi
    (edited )
    Link
    New York Times: Elon Musk’s Twitter Teeters on the Edge After Another 1,200 Leave By my arithmetic, that means Twitter has reduced in size from ~7500 employees to ~2500 employees over the past few...

    By my arithmetic, that means Twitter has reduced in size from ~7500 employees to ~2500 employees over the past few weeks.

    4 votes
    1. [2]
      cfabbro
      Link Parent
      Your link is broken (you spelled twitter as twittea ;). FTFY: New York Times: Elon Musk’s Twitter Teeters on the Edge After Another 1,200 Leave

      Your link is broken (you spelled twitter as twittea ;). FTFY:
      New York Times: Elon Musk’s Twitter Teeters on the Edge After Another 1,200 Leave

      1 vote
      1. psi
        Link Parent
        Thanks (and fixed)! I don't even know how that happened, considering I copy/pasted the link. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

        Thanks (and fixed)! I don't even know how that happened, considering I copy/pasted the link. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

        3 votes
  15. [2]
    Autoxidation
    Link
    Right on cue, Musk posts a poll asking whether Trump should get unbanned or not.
    4 votes
    1. Diff
      Link Parent
      And when it moves from 80/20 to 50/50 as more than just his followers notice, he follows up with bot accusations precisely according to schedule.

      And when it moves from 80/20 to 50/50 as more than just his followers notice, he follows up with bot accusations precisely according to schedule.

      4 votes
  16. cloud_loud
    (edited )
    Link
    Alt-right YouTuber and relic of the 2010s Sargon of Akkkad has been reinstated.

    Alt-right YouTuber and relic of the 2010s Sargon of Akkkad has been reinstated.

    4 votes
  17. Kremor
    Link
    Check twitterisgoinggreat.com for your daily dose of Musk/Twitter drama.

    Check twitterisgoinggreat.com for your daily dose of Musk/Twitter drama.

    4 votes
  18. skybrian
    Link
    Twitter is now having trouble paying some employees on time (Ars Technica) [...]

    Twitter is now having trouble paying some employees on time (Ars Technica)

    Twitter is investigating why some staff in Europe have not received their November salaries in a timely manner amid sweeping cuts and layoffs across the company since Elon Musk’s takeover.

    Twitter staff in the UK received an email just before 1 pm London time on November 25 telling them their pay date would be November 28. Alongside the email, sent from the EMEA Payroll Team, staff received their usual monthly payslips. However, staff in the UK and Germany appear not to have been paid on time.

    [...]

    Four independent sources in the UK and Germany told Ars Technica that they had not received payment on the morning their salaries were due.

    4 votes
  19. [2]
    skybrian
    Link
    Musk Fires More Twitter Sales Workers After ‘Hardcore’ Purge (Bloomberg)

    Musk Fires More Twitter Sales Workers After ‘Hardcore’ Purge (Bloomberg)

    Sales employees signed on to his vision in greater numbers than workers on the technical side, which saw mass resignations, according to people familiar with the matter. Musk is using the cuts to balance out the remaining staff, said the people, who asked not to be identified discussing internal decisions.

    Some of those who were fired started to receive notice on Sunday, according to two people familiar with the matter, though it’s unclear how many will be impacted in the current round. Platformer earlier reported the news.

    3 votes
    1. cfabbro
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Speaking of Platformer; It kinda sucks seeing so many other news sites these days mentioning it as being the source of the news they're reporting on. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Casey...

      Speaking of Platformer; It kinda sucks seeing so many other news sites these days mentioning it as being the source of the news they're reporting on. Don't get me wrong, I'm a big fan of Casey Newton and have been for years, and I'm glad that he is finally off on his own now, doing his own thing. But I seriously hate that all of his content is behind such an expensive hard paywall now. Even though that content is often great stuff, and he is often still breaking huge stories due to all his tech industry connections, I unfortunately just can't justify the USD $100/yr for access. That's almost as much as I pay for Netflix!

      Ah well... at least he still shares some of his stories for free, includes some others in his weekly newsletter, occasionally co-publishes some of his biggest stories with The Verge, and I can also read about some of his reporting secondhand from places like Bloomberg. But I would honestly much rather read it all on Platformer to support him.... if only it was a bit more reasonably priced though. Sigh. :(

      2 votes
  20. [7]
    skybrian
    Link
    As Elon Musk Cuts Costs at Twitter, Some Bills Are Going Unpaid - NY Times (archive) [...] [...]

    As Elon Musk Cuts Costs at Twitter, Some Bills Are Going Unpaid - NY Times (archive)

    Before Elon Musk bought Twitter last month, the company’s executives had racked up hundreds of thousands of dollars in travel invoices that the social media service planned to pay.

    But once Mr. Musk took over the company, he refused to reimburse travel vendors for those bills, current and former Twitter employees said. Mr. Musk’s staff said the services were authorized by the company’s former management and not by him. His staff have since avoided the calls of the travel vendors, the people said.

    [...]

    Mr. Musk also issued an order to slow or in some cases halt transfers of funds to Twitter’s vendors and contract services, the people said. Any expenditures for services need to be approved by Mr. Birchall, three people said. Mr. Musk has since declined to pay for the travel services incurred by the former Twitter executives, the people said.

    He is also looking at the company’s leases for office space, three people said, bucking on making payments and hoping to renegotiate or opt out of some commitments entirely. Twitter leases office space across the world, but the layoffs have reduced the need for much of that real estate.

    Twitter’s partnerships team was also instructed to renegotiate its multiyear content deals with major sports entities, like one it struck with the N.F.L. in which the social media company pays the league to produce exclusive audio and video content for its platform, two people familiar with the plans said. Twitter has struck similar deals with other media companies, including Condé Nast, the N.B.A. and Fox Sports Network.

    [...]

    Mr. Davis, the president of the Boring Company, has also directed Twitter employees to renegotiate the deals that the company has with firms such as Amazon and Oracle, which provide computing and tech services, the people said. The employees were told to suggest to those companies that Mr. Musk’s firms would not work with them in the future if they refused to renegotiate, the people said.
    After Twitter’s contract with one software vendor expired under Mr. Musk’s ownership, that company voided a discount it had given to Twitter, one engineering manager said.

    3 votes
    1. [6]
      FrankGrimes
      Link Parent
      Pulling from the Trump playbook - cut business costs by just not paying the people you owe money to. It's a brialliant business move. I think Oracle and Amazon would both probably laugh at this....

      Pulling from the Trump playbook - cut business costs by just not paying the people you owe money to. It's a brialliant business move.

      The employees were told to suggest to those companies [Amazon and Oracle] that Mr. Musk’s firms would not work with them in the future if they refused to renegotiate

      I think Oracle and Amazon would both probably laugh at this. Twitter is likely using more resources from both of those companies than Tesla or SpaceX, and besides - where would Musk's companies get something like cloud computing? I doubt Microsoft is just salivating at the thought of jumping into business with Musk, and offering deep discounts to boot.

      6 votes
      1. [5]
        skybrian
        Link Parent
        Well, it's a competitive industry so some cost-cutting may be possible. Google and Microsoft might very well offer discounts. Also, some companies even run their own datacenters to save money....

        Well, it's a competitive industry so some cost-cutting may be possible. Google and Microsoft might very well offer discounts. Also, some companies even run their own datacenters to save money. This isn't a change to be made suddenly, though.

        During the transition, I don't think Twitter has the technical capacity to do either; they will have a hard enough time keeping the services running as they are. So it doesn't seem like a credible threat.

        3 votes
        1. [3]
          Adys
          Link Parent
          Google and most certainly MS are both going to be offering heavy discounts. Azure still a year ago was the most discount heavy in cloud sales. I know a small company that got 1MM in credits, and...

          Google and most certainly MS are both going to be offering heavy discounts.

          Azure still a year ago was the most discount heavy in cloud sales. I know a small company that got 1MM in credits, and that’s just an SME!

          2 votes
          1. [2]
            skybrian
            Link Parent
            Here's some chatter on Hacker News about capacity problems in Azure. Glad I don't have to be the one doing the negotiating.

            Here's some chatter on Hacker News about capacity problems in Azure. Glad I don't have to be the one doing the negotiating.

            1. Adys
              Link Parent
              Indeed. I would never go with Azure cloud. I’m already queasy enough with one of my startups on GCP.

              Indeed. I would never go with Azure cloud. I’m already queasy enough with one of my startups on GCP.

              1 vote
        2. FrankGrimes
          Link Parent
          Good point - will certainly be interesting to see where it goes.

          Good point - will certainly be interesting to see where it goes.

          1 vote
  21. [4]
    cfabbro
    Link
    In less than a month, Elon Musk has driven away half of Twitter’s top 100 advertisers (MediaMatters)

    In less than a month, Elon Musk has driven away half of Twitter’s top 100 advertisers (MediaMatters)

    In recent weeks, 50 of the top 100 advertisers have either announced or seemingly stopped advertising on Twitter. These advertisers have accounted for nearly $2 billion in spending on the platform since 2020, and over $750 million in advertising in 2022 alone.

    In addition to advertisers that have seemingly stopped all advertising on Twitter as of November 21, there are an additional seven advertisers which appear to be slowing the rate of their advertising on the platform to almost nothing. Since 2020, these seven advertisers have accounted for over $255 million in spending on Twitter, and nearly $118 million in advertising in 2022.

    3 votes
    1. Sheep
      Link Parent
      The question now is will there be enough MyPillow money to close the hole left behind. On a more serious note, I and many others have noticed our ads on twitter becoming not only less relevant but...

      The question now is will there be enough MyPillow money to close the hole left behind.

      On a more serious note, I and many others have noticed our ads on twitter becoming not only less relevant but completely nonsensical. Like ads for Chinese provinces and whatnot.

      5 votes
    2. [2]
      Diff
      Link Parent
      This is why I really fail to understand why Musk's continuing on down this path of unbanning and engaging with Nazis and pedophiles. $8 cannot ever make up for the millions that advertisers were...

      This is why I really fail to understand why Musk's continuing on down this path of unbanning and engaging with Nazis and pedophiles. $8 cannot ever make up for the millions that advertisers were dumping into the platform. Forget the long term, what does he think is going to happen next month? Is he going to become the platform's sole income source himself so he can keep stroking his ego with it?

      3 votes
      1. lou
        Link Parent
        Some believe that Musk was never a good businessman, but rather an opportunistic griefer.

        Some believe that Musk was never a good businessman, but rather an opportunistic griefer.

        5 votes
  22. [2]
    cfabbro
    Link
    Twitter is no longer enforcing its Covid misinformation policy (CNN)

    Twitter is no longer enforcing its Covid misinformation policy (CNN)

    Twitter said it will no longer enforce its longstanding Covid misinformation policy, yet another sign of how Elon Musk plans to transform the social media company he bought a month ago.

    In 2020, Twitter developed an extensive set of rules that sought to prohibit “harmful misinformation” about the virus and its vaccines.

    Between January 2020 and September 2022, Twitter suspended more than 11,000 accounts for breaking Covid misinformation rules and removed almost 100,000 pieces of content that violated those rules, according to statistics published by Twitter. The policy received acclaim from medical professionals: In an advisory to technology platforms, US Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy cited Twitter’s rules as an example of what companies should do to combat misinformation.

    Twitter did not appear to formally announce the rule change. Instead, some Twitter users Monday night spotted a note added to the page on Twitter’s website that outlines its Covid policy.

    “Effective November 23, 2022, Twitter is no longer enforcing the COVID-19 misleading information policy,” the note read.

    Musk has promised to restore many previously banned Twitter accounts as soon as this week. It is possible that among the restored accounts will be some of the 11,000 banned under Twitter’s former Covid misinformation rules.

    3 votes
    1. TemulentTeatotaler
      Link Parent
      Added context, a partial timeline of Musk on COVID:

      Added context, a partial timeline of Musk on COVID:

      March 6, 2020
      As worldwide Covid-19 cases topped 100,000 and deaths exceeded 3,000, Musk tweeted, “the coronavirus panic is dumb.”

      March 19, 2020
      The United States reported just under 2,000 new coronavirus cases in a single day, but Musk predicted the country was headed toward “zero new cases” by the end of April (by Musk’s deadline, daily case counts had topped 20,000). ...

      May 9, 2020
      After local rules in Alameda County, Calif., forced Tesla to shut down its assembly line, Musk vowed to sue the county (Tesla filed a federal lawsuit that day, but the company voluntarily dropped the suit less than two weeks later). ...

      Sept. 28, 2020
      Musk told the New York Times’ Kara Swisher he won’t take a Covid-19 vaccine once it’s available, arguing he and his kids are not at risk, and he asserted the virus (which has killed more than 2.6 million people worldwide) has a low mortality rate.

      March 12, 2021
      Musk appeared to question whether it’s safe to get the second shot of a coronavirus vaccine, citing “quite a few negative reactions.”

      2 votes
  23. [4]
    Kuromantis
    Link
    Remember when Twitter literally filed a Lawsuit to force Musk to buy Twitter when Musk was about to leave? I can only imagine how much the people who filed this lawsuit regret doing so.

    Remember when Twitter literally filed a Lawsuit to force Musk to buy Twitter when Musk was about to leave? I can only imagine how much the people who filed this lawsuit regret doing so.

    2 votes
    1. cfabbro
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      Why would they regret it? The stockholders all received $54.20 per share, significantly more than the $30-40 per share they would have otherwise gotten by selling on the open market. And even...

      Why would they regret it? The stockholders all received $54.20 per share, significantly more than the $30-40 per share they would have otherwise gotten by selling on the open market. And even beyond the shares, every former senior exec is set to receive massive golden parachutes. Musk is trying to prevent them from getting their payouts by claiming they were all fired "for cause" but he will very likely lose all those inevitable lawsuits.

      17 votes
    2. MimicSquid
      Link Parent
      The people who filed this lawsuit got enormous golden parachutes, and would have been sued in turn by Twitter's shareholders for not going after Musk to buy it. The amount he was offering was way...

      The people who filed this lawsuit got enormous golden parachutes, and would have been sued in turn by Twitter's shareholders for not going after Musk to buy it. The amount he was offering was way above anyone else's valuation, and the benefits to the prior shareholders from this buyout were immense.

      That said, Twitter did a couple of things of value, and I hope we'll find a new way for organizations to broadcast information to the public fairly soon.

      14 votes
    3. skybrian
      Link Parent
      The executives got paid well (in theory) for siding with the shareholders. This is what "golden parachutes" are for, to make sure that they don't stand in the way of a merger if it's a good price....

      The executives got paid well (in theory) for siding with the shareholders. This is what "golden parachutes" are for, to make sure that they don't stand in the way of a merger if it's a good price.

      (In practice, they're going to have to sue to get that money.)

      4 votes
  24. [7]
    PantsEnvy
    Link
    Elon Musk says he wants 'Twitter 2.0' to have video chat, voice calls, and encrypted DMs — and has enlisted the help of Signal's founder
    1 vote
    1. [6]
      PantsEnvy
      Link Parent
      If Musk tries to bundle this all under an application called Twitter, it's not going to go well. Even Musk wont convince everyone that Twitter is the place to go to broadcast inane hot takes...

      If Musk tries to bundle this all under an application called Twitter, it's not going to go well.

      Even Musk wont convince everyone that Twitter is the place to go to broadcast inane hot takes publicly to the world but also securely call or text your mom or maybe Elon's mum.

      It's a classic brand extension failure similar to Zippo Perfume or Harley Davidson cake decorating kit. Zippo Perfume? Really?

      It's a common mistake to make. Even Google made the tragic mistake of calling their social network Google+, Google Buzz & Google Friend Connect.

      When I think about privately texting or calling mum, I don't think facebook, I think WhatsApp. When i am sending a private email, I don't go to Google, I go to Gmail. When I want to see what my idiot cousin is up to, I go to Facebook, not Google+.

      The smart way to do this would be to buy someone like Signal, then keep the Signal as is, but authenticate Signal with twitter handles in addition to phone numbers. No confusion there. Twitter is for publicly embarrassing myself, and Signal is for privacy. Plus you get all the Signal tech and know how.

      The reason why I suspect Musk is likely to go the stupid path, is that businesses do this all the time. It's a classic business blunder because it seems so intuitively obviously right.

      4 votes
      1. [5]
        stu2b50
        Link Parent
        I don't think that necessarily maps to everything, though, especially in the other parts of the world. In India or Brazil, when people think of social media (sharing personal status, news,...

        When I think about privately texting or calling mum, I don't think facebook, I think WhatsApp. When i am sending a private email, I don't go to Google, I go to Gmail. When I want to see what my idiot cousin is up to, I go to Facebook, not Google+.

        I don't think that necessarily maps to everything, though, especially in the other parts of the world. In India or Brazil, when people think of social media (sharing personal status, news, etc.)... they think of WhatsApp. When they think of messaging their grandma... they think of WhatsApp. Same with China and WeChat.

        Similarly, I know a lot of people for whom Instagram is a one-shop area. It's social media and their main instant messaging service (especially now that you can DM messenger accounts on it).

        Discord is also becoming an omni-service. Social channels, DMs, everything.

        5 votes
        1. [4]
          PantsEnvy
          Link Parent
          Great points. I don't know much about Instagram, but I suspect it positions itself as a way to share your life through photos. When kids want to know what their friends are up to, I suspect they...

          Great points. I don't know much about Instagram, but I suspect it positions itself as a way to share your life through photos. When kids want to know what their friends are up to, I suspect they either think "Instagram" or "Snapchat." That is a natural brand extension. Adding the ability to text your friends or call your friends makes the instagram and the snapchat brand stronger.

          Same goes for WhatsApp. When my kid thinks of Grandma, he thinks WhatsApp. It's a natural brand extension to enable social media for WhatsApp. In fact, that is pretty much what we use WhatsApp groups for. A private social media channel.

          For me personally, when I think of my friends, the last thing I think of is Twitter.

          When I think of influencers, I think of Twitter, as well as Instagram and Youtube. But that doesn't mean Youtube should try to enable texting or phone calls.

          Will I ever accept Twitter as the natural way to communicate with both friends and influencers? In Musks world, these two things are largely the same thing. In my world, they are very distinct things.

          Also, in my mind, Twitter has negative brand value when it comes to phone calls and texts. When I think of phone calls and texting, I think of spam. When I think of spam, I think of bots. And when I think of bots, I think of Twitter. And the more I think about it, the more I am convinced this is another branding problem. Do I really want my publicly verified twitter handle to effectively be my phone number? Do I trust Musk to solve the inevitable spam problem?

          3 votes
          1. [2]
            stu2b50
            Link Parent
            I do think that might just be a personal thing, though. I've seen a lot of communities where Twitter DMs are a common way to communicate with people (in fact, in some, it's the only way to do so...

            For me personally, when I think of my friends, the last thing I think of is Twitter.

            I do think that might just be a personal thing, though. I've seen a lot of communities where Twitter DMs are a common way to communicate with people (in fact, in some, it's the only way to do so even if you're seeking a business relationship; email is for boomers, I suppose). Splatoon and smash bros are like this, for instance.

            I think this is just a difference between the Twitter users who use it as a glorified RSS feed (almost all consumption, no production) and the users that use it much more on a 50/50 consumption/production basis.

            1 vote
            1. Wolf
              Link Parent
              Crypto twitter is like too, and it's becoming a huge part of Twitter and gaining Musk's attention.

              've seen a lot of communities where Twitter DMs are a common way to communicate with people

              Crypto twitter is like too, and it's becoming a huge part of Twitter and gaining Musk's attention.

              1 vote
          2. Wolf
            Link Parent
            I feel like encrypted messaging is a great way to talk to friends you already have on Twitter. I have twitter friends that I dont know IRL and dont want to fold them into my personal messaging...

            For me personally, when I think of my friends, the last thing I think of is Twitter.

            I feel like encrypted messaging is a great way to talk to friends you already have on Twitter. I have twitter friends that I dont know IRL and dont want to fold them into my personal messaging apps. But I would love for Twitter to have a better DMing system and encrypted chat.

            1 vote