Are there any games that you have enjoyed playing without the HUD or mini-map? If so, which ones and why?
I just posted this as a comment to someone who mentioned Horizon Zero Dawn, but figured there might be more discussion if I made a new post for it, so here goes:
Are there any games that you have enjoyed playing without the HUD or mini-map? If so, which ones and why?
One of my favorite gaming experiences was playing Zelda BOTW in its entirety without any HUD elements, just using the game's scenery and story to guide me. I loved it so much that I tried doing the same in other massive open-world games like Skyrim, Fallout 4, The Witcher 3, and Assassin's Creed Origins, but found that they relied too much on small details or markers in the minimap. So instead of feeling more immersed and in-tune with the game world, I just felt more frustrated at not knowing exactly where to go or which specific person or item to click on without the game explicitly telling me. I'm sure it can be done, but I found it nowhere near as pleasing as BOTW.
I just recently picked up Horizon Zero Dawn and wondered if it could be played in a similar manner, without the map or other HUD elements, or if I'll end up needing some of them to know where to go or who to talk to.
I'd love to hear any other recommendations or thoughts on this matter.
It's rather old-fashioned by now, but there was something very endearing about Far Cry 2's very physical map-and-GPS system. I would love for a game with modern graphics and gameplay amenities to recreate that feeling.
Hollow Knight sort of does this. There was always that tough choice of slotting the charm that showed you where on the map you were as well to go with it.
Metro Exodus is very light on HUD elements and all the navigation is diegetic! It was 2018 I think. And it got a raytracing update a couple years later. Highly recommend.
I completely forgot about Exodus, I even played it a few years ago! And you are absolutely right, it's a great game and definitely scratches the same itch as FC2.
You know what, I think I'll reinstall and replay it (at least if my exams leave me any spare time until Christmas...), thanks for mentioning it!
I almost didn't say anything because it came up elsewhere in the thread multiple times but now I'm glad I did! Enjoy (again)!
I've never played Far Cry 2, so I had to find an image to see this system. Very cool indeed.
Here's a link for anyone else who'd like to see.
Great suggestion! You're right, that integrated map felt a lot more 'real' than many mini-maps that just exist on the screen 24/7. FC2 is one of my favorite games ever, so much attention to detail in that game.
It was such a fun game. But, as you said, technologically it feels worse than it was on release. I wish they'd remaster it.
Red Dead Redemption 2 has the option to toggle between a minimap and compass and I have occasionally turned it off completely to stray around in the world if I wasn't focusing on anything in particular. During missions the compass was often enough, but the minimap did save me some frustration at times with navigation. I think they struck a nice balance in this regard.
It's funny you mention RDR2. I think I also tried going HUD-less in RDR2 back when it first came out, but like you said about the missions, I found that there were a lot of times where the game wanted you to be in a VERY precise location, and being just a bit off would instantly fail the mission and have to restart/reload. And of course you couldn't see the exact location it wanted you in without the mini-map.
Coincidentally, I also just picked that up for PC in the most recent sale. So I'll give it another chance.
Sounds like bad game design for the missions
It truly is, but the open world is designed brilliantly. I got through 50% of the game without any HUD & only checking the map while in camp. It was a great experience overall, except for the missions where I frequently had to turn on the minimap.
It’s what ended up discouraging me from playing through to the end back when I first tried it. The whole feel and appeal of the game was to explore the wilderness, do what you want, go hunting, be a cowboy, go wherever, gta in the Wild West… and that’s true for everything except the missions.
In the missions it’s the exact opposite. Do exactly what the game tells you and be at the exact right locations the entire time. Stray ten feet from the mission zone? Fail. Try to sneak in through a different route? Fail. Didn’t follow this guy closely enough? Fail.
It was just such a sharp juxtaposition with the rest of the game. The entire game works really hard to immerse you into this beautifully crafted and detailed late-1800s setting, and then the missions bring you right back into the modern day by reminding you that it’s all just a video game and you’re not actually in control of anything.
You might enjoy this video: https://youtu.be/MvJPKOLDSos?si=6r1oSjqIEVqG4VOC
Ha! I remember seeing that video when it first came out and yeah I agreed with it 100%. Like Jake, I was very hyped for the game since RDR was one of my favorite games ever (and there were tons of videos/stories coming out about how crazy detailed and polished the game was getting). Then RDR2 came out and it just didn't resonate with me. I couldn't figure out exactly why, I just wasn't having fun in the missions. The rest of it was great, but the story just felt like a chore, despite the characters being interesting and the game mechanics and gameplay being fun. Then that video came out and I realized that he was right. The problem was the completely rigid nature of the missions and how I was constantly failing them for trying things my own way, which went in stark opposition to everything that I enjoyed about the game, i.e. the freedom to do whatever you wanted.
The Metro series, which is fairly immersive even with a HUD, is even better without it. In fact, playing on the Ranger difficulty which is meant to maximize the immersion disables it entirely so the devs clearly knew what they were doing. There's still plenty of ways to get all the useful information at a glance though - you have a clipboard-thing that records your objectives, a wristwatch that doubles as a visibility indicator and a timer for your gas mask filter, a lighter made from a bullet casing, a handheld charger with a gauge on it, gauges on weapons that require battery or air pressure, magazines you can see the rounds in so you can keep track of your ammo count, etc.
There isn't a map in them except for the last game, which has more open maps, but the first two games don't even need that since levels are fairly linear so you don't have to pause to figure out where to go next.
Wow, great suggestion! I didn't know that about these games but that sounds super interesting to me. I think the appeal of going minimap-less in BOTW was that the game was intentionally designed for you to not need it, whereas a lot of other games are designed with their maps or compasses in mind, so playing without them feels like a huge crutch to progression. So sounds like the Metro games are more like BOTW where the devs intended for you to be able to navigate the world without it.
Bonus is that I'm pretty sure I own a few of them from various EPIC giveaways over the years. So thanks, will definitely check them out!
You would LOVE Metro: Exodus (the last in the series). I played it without playing any of the other ones just fine. I think technically Artyom is the main character in all of them, but I skipped the first two without issue (but I've heard they are great games as well).
Get them in a sale and play them. I have Exodus too, but unlike you, I played forst twobgames and not Exodus (yet). Forst two games are linear, but you can take either Rambo or stealth style in many locations, so it is kinda variable. Thy are very heavy on atmosphere and great games! You should really play them if you liked the last one.
Oh... And they come from Metro 2033, 2034 and 2035 books by Dmitri Glukhovski (I may have i/y wrong), I highly recommend reading the books too!
My first choice would be Elden Ring if you haven't played it yet. Don't want to spoil anything, but there's some expert design with how they deliver information through the map screen, compass and zero mini-map or markers over 100+ hours.
Another highly recommended, immersive game would be Outer Wilds (not Outer Worlds) and for your own enjoyment I will not say anything further.
Otherwise, I've always gotten far more immersed in games with smaller maps or even hub maps. Spaces like in the Yakuza series, Bully and Dogtown from Phantom Liberty. Even if the mini-map can't be turned off, after enough time you just start to read the geography and get lost in the vibe of the world. It's also really helpful when traveling is fun like the recent Spiderman, the Arkham series or Just Cause. When the topography and navigation isn't really an issue, its a lot easier to loose yourself in the journey.
Other very immersive experiences that are slightly harder to recommend: Nier Automata, MGS5, Death Stranding, Sable and Snow Runner. They're the sort of experiences that require you to invest in their fictions and you'll either get it or you wont. Like Snow Runner is one of my most played games and on paper its simply "Go from A to B off road". I'll spend a good amount of time just plotting routes, remembering past experiences, fighting for every meter of progress and dreading even the slightest mistake. It's the type of fun you can't really explain.
Great recommendations, thanks! I've tried a few of those and agree with everything you've said.
I think for me personally, I've just always been a big fan of massive open-world games since my younger days of playing Pokemon and Final Fantasy. Then Oblivion and Fallouts 3 and New Vegas. I never really thought much of the HUD or minimap.
But then I played BOTW around 2019 and I had read somewhere that it was designed in a way where you didn't really need any HUD/minimap, everything you needed could be found in the in-game world. So I turned it all off and holy crap what an experience. I think the main thing that helped it is that the design of the game gave you the freedom to do whatever you wanted. There are missions, sure, but you can completely avoid basically everything except the tutorial and then 'defeat Ganon'. That meant that the minimap was not necessary since there were no wrong answers about which way to go. The main quest of the game was basically to do sidequests until you are strong enough to take on the boss.
The verticality of the game definitely helped a lot, as did the in-game traversal being fun like you mentioned. The binoculars that allowed you to mark distant locations on your map were also great, since I could just climb to the top of some hill/mountain and find somewhere that looked interesting, then head in that direction.
So for the past few years I've been trying to recreate that feeling of immersion and freedom in all these open-world games I play and love, but the more I try, the more I realize that these games are fully designed with their HUDs and minimaps in mind. Which makes total sense, of course, I'm just hoping to find something that lets me go from point A to point B because I my brain thought it looked interesting, rather than because that's what the line/marker/arrow on my minimap or compass told me to do.
CONTROL.
It is a beautiful, like stunningly striking, game and the story is super trippy. There are these moments in an endless, otherworldly, gigantic structure and a Tesseract like hotel, that blow my mind. Once you know the game, the hud offers you very little. You can just turn it off and enjoy the ride.
I did give it a shot when it was free on EPIC a while back. But I remember being a bit confused by it and ended up putting it down and forgetting about it. Maybe it’s time to give it another go. Thanks for the recommendation!
It's a confusing ass game, if you're trying to put the pieces together. But if you just kind of get in and ride along with the visuals, it kind of starts making sense if you are into reading into the story. I'm not much of a in game Lore reader, but I ended up reading every bit I found.
The original assassin's creed is almost what it was supposed to be without the hud and the minimap. Suddenly systems that make no sense, like eagle vision, are useful. Learning the layouts of the cities actually matters, as does listening to instructions on how to navigate them. The "overly reused quests" are really more akin to korok's from Zelda, in that there's supposed to be enough of them that you can find one when wandering the city and using eagle vision, not just pick the ones you want from the minimap.
It still doesn't fix the combat (which was supposed to be a LOT more lethal to your character) but it's interesting to see what the game almost was.
I found the combat in AC1 to be more interesting when you ditch the sword and dagger and go full hidden-blade only. It can counter any enemy, but you can't defend with it and the counter window is very tight, much more than the other weapons.
Still no excuse for the other weapons to be as boring as they are, albeit it's better in the first game than the ones that followed (giant flashing counter indicators, who asked for that?).
Hmm i might try that. It's a game i don't often replay because you couldn't skip the cut scenes, but I figured my fiance would like the story of the first few and was considering doing another playthrough.
I do empathize with the issue of "do you want to make art or make money". I love fighting games, most come no where near as many sales as a flagship game like AC, and that's usually because they're very easy to play.
I do hate how at around 3 they started gutting the combat system though. At least there was a lot of wacky/over the top stuff you could do in 2 and it's sequels, but by the time I tried again in black flag I was aghast at just how "not there" the combat was.
Have you played the original Dead Space? I imagine they did it in the remake too, but the game is HUD-less by design, and it makes the game even more scary because of that, IMO
Great suggestion! Yes I have played it and that’s exactly the type of design I like. With the HUD elements built in to the game world itself. Didn’t know there was a remake, I’ll check it out!
The remake is great, definitely worth playing. They made enough good changes to the game & story that it's worth it even if you have already played the original.
Not sure if this is exactly what you're looking for, but I play a lot of Walking Simulators/Narrative Exploration games, many of which are mapless and HUDless by design, for total immersion. Same goes with many Horror Exploration games too. And quickly looking at my Steam Library, here are some games I can remember fitting the bill, and that I enjoyed so you might too:
Walking Simulators/Narrative Exploration
The Stanley Parable
The Beginner's Guide (same creator as above)
Dear Esther
The Vanishing of Ethan Carter
What Remains of Edith Finch
A Story About My Uncle
Mirror's Edge
Horror Exploration
Among the Sleep
Little Nightmares
Little Nightmares II
LIMBO
INSIDE
Penumbra Overture+Black Plague+Requiem
Amnesia: The Dark Descent
Alan Wake (has HUD, but turn it off, it's better that way anyways)
Dead Space
Dead Space 2
Please consider playing Outer Wilds, it's one of the ultimate walking sims/narrative exploration games. Seeing your list that'd be a perfect fit.
Outer Wilds, not Outer Worlds.
Outer Wilds has been on my wishlist for a long long time, and I've been recommended it many times before as well. Firewatch is another. And I honestly don't know why I haven't played them yet, TBH. I really should try to get around to that. So thanks for the reminder. :P
played Mirrors Edge a while ago. This game still looks just soooooo good! And the gameplay still fells very unique.
It's one of the examples why style is more important than fidelity. Good art styles hold up for decades.
Mirror's Edge Catalyst could also work for playing without the HUD, given that it's an open world.
The Beginners Guide is sooooo good, super underrated compared to The Stanley Parable! I played it years ago and it really changed my view on examining art and sometimes just taking things for what they are. It's so incredible and I really should be recommending it more to people.
You should check out The Long Dark.
Unfortunately I kinda ruined The Long Dark for myself by watching a shit ton of speed runs and challenge runs for it. It's a good recommendation for others who enjoy immersive exploration/survival games, and haven't already spoiled it for themselves though. :P
How??
I've sunk about 1500+ hours into it - why not give it a try?
Because, at this point, I already know most of the game's tricks, and so I don't think I would feel the same tension, fear, panic, and suspense that you're intended to. I could still play it, and would probably enjoy it to some degree, since I would probably still struggle a bit at first too. But I don't think the wolves would get my heart pumping like they would someone who knows nothing about the game, and doesn't know how to deal with them. The caves wouldn't really intimidate me either. Neither would the blizzards make me panic all that much. Because I've already seen quite a few people beat the game with relative ease on the hardest difficulties and with the hardest challenge modes enabled. And since I already know what to do in the game, and where to look for all the things I would need to survive, from having watched all those videos, I don't think the game would hit quite the same as someone who is going into it blind.
Playing the game for me would be more like speed running (which despite enjoying watching others do, I don't actually enjoy doing myself), rather than playing an immersive exploration games (which I do enjoy).
I'm the one whose comment you reacted to.
I played Cyberpunk without the map. The reason was, as you said, immersion. With minimap I was just driving from point to point, just following dotted line not even knowing where in the city I was. I hated the experience as I didn't know anything about the city, I was just blindly driving from A to B all the time. I turned the map off mid-game and my perception of the coty shifted a lot. I started to recognize bridges, crossroads, landmarks. I didn't get to know the city as I did for example in GTA 3/VC/SA games, but I would if I played without the map from the start. I wasn't brave enough to turn off objective indicator though - I think you wouldn't be able to find places on your own if you really wouldn't give it a lot of time if you tirned off indicator.
I wanted to mention Metro games, but it was already mentioned. Missing HUD is kinda part of difficulty there, as you don't even know how much ammo you have in the magazine or overall. The game becomes much harder. I guess you asled.more about RPGs though.
Thanks for sparking this whole question! I’ll definitely check out the metro games (especially since I’m pretty sure I have most of them from the EPIC giveaways). I do personally prefer open world rpgs, but my question was pretty broad and I’m glad there’s a good mix of games being recommended in the comments. Even if some of the games aren’t my exact cup of tea, hopefully someone else reading this thread gets some good recommendations for themselves.
I have so many games to play that I won't probably buy new ones based on this thread. But it is great to see such discussion! I love how everyone knows different game and describe their own experience!
Ghost of Tsushima. You can set the HUD elements to only appear while in combat and the rest of the time you get to enjoy the gorgeous world immersed. The guiding wind mechanic also means you’re never really lost if you don’t want to be but it feels a lot more organic than just moving to a marker.
That sounds like the exact type of game design that I’m looking for, thanks!
Back in the days of BF2/2042, MW1&2 I used to play hardcore servers that had much of the HUD including mini-map and non-ads crosshairs disabled. The BF servers also required following the chain of command, enforced ADS shooting (hip fire only allowed in close quarters). I've been chasing that dragon in arcade war shooters ever since.
As much as I hate camping snipers I used to have a whole lot more satisfaction tracking them down and putting knife/defib into their back. Or being that camping sniper and effectively controlling an area and making people scared to proceed while providing valuable overwatch communicating enemy movements with my squad leader and the they with the commander. Kill cam has effectively ruined both experiences.
It hasn't been mentioned yet but ghost of tsushima uses in game elements to guide you to where you need to go, making the HUD very optional. It's also just a beautiful game.
Thanks I’ll definitely check it out! Sounds exactly like what I was hoping for.
Yes! One of my favourite games and a great one to play hudless. They found great immersive ways to lead you around.
Everquest. I have been playing since the original launch in 1999. Exploring Norrath without a map (by design at the time of launch) was incredibly immersive and rewarding. Especially considering that, at the time, the internet was still in its infancy and there were not many sites out there for sharing knowledge with other players, resulting in a lot of "tribal knowledge" spreading organically by word of mouth. The vanilla game has added a map as of about 20 years ago. But even now, private servers exist that replicate the original UI and try to uphold its original design ideas by removing the map and other modern "conveniences."
There’s Firewatch, in which your character has a paper map you can look at, similar to what you’d do when hiking. You can deactivate the GPS pointer on that map, which is nice.
Throwing my hat in the ring for Nier: Automata.
I absolutely love the upgrade system in this game. Since you play as an android, upgrades take up storage space, which there is a max amount of. The entire HUD is composed of upgrade chips that you can remove to add more combat or utility focused chips whenever you want. It also encourages the player to experiment with what you really need and not need. It feels like uninstalling programs to debloat a PC and getting just right for you.
That sounds super cool and definitely worth checking out. Sounds like a interesting middle-ground between having a full HUD and having no HUD whatsoever, where the HUD itself is a gameplay element rather than just additional information for the player. Deliberate and thoughtful rather than just there for the sake of being there.
That's exactly the type of response that I was hoping for with this thread. A game that I have heard of before (good things too), but never got around to trying. But now you've just described something about it that makes me really interesting in picking it up and trying it out for myself. So thanks for the suggestion!
I hope you give it a shot! It is an amazing game. The praise it receives is well earned.
I would say that for HZD it really depends on the area. Some areas (mostly earlier in the game) are tightly built, functionally linear in some ways, and reasonably well signposted. The later in the game you go the more wide open and sprawling the areas and cities are; I can't imagine trying to find a specific someone in the final city without a HUD.
That makes sense. BOTW mostly just had small villages and towns, so it was never too difficult to find anyone.
I generally try to in a lot of games, but it's not always feasible. The latest Hitman games are pretty allowing for this, with the exception of some specific modes or opportunities. I always enjoyed diving into a level for the first time and sleuthing my way around the place without a minimap or the see-thru-walls-and-highlight-targets ability. The NPCs and level design do a decent job at conveying where you can and cannot be with your current disguise.
I may be remembering wrong, but I don't recall anything more than radar on GoldenEye N64
There was the bullet counter.
I have Deep Rock Galactic to fairly minimal, showing everything only as needed, or many things not at all (like the ammo count, because it's also shown on the actual weapon which is much more immersive).
Reminds me of the design of dead space. With the ammo count on the weapons and the health bad built in to your space suit. Thanks for the suggestion!
Does sailing and flight simulators count? for the flight sim I'm using vor to vor navigation and the sailing I'm just at the moment randomly going where this wind takes me.
But I do use a real map for the FS, but that's outside of the sim and I do the tracking of position manually
What sailing simulator do you like?
Started with this simple pancake sailor and since a while I have been giving esail a try.
I'm hoping (naively) that some of the latter can translate to real sailing as in 2024 I want to start with dinghy sailing (or a small catamaran would also be interesting).
Sekiro doesn’t have a mini-map and it’s pretty easy to navigate where to go. What I like is that as you get late into the game you start to see how different areas are connected. You can also get to a few high places and see where the other locations are if you know which direction to look.
It’s not true open world, more like a metroidvania with branching paths.
That sounds pretty cool, thanks! Will check it out.
Good luck, and don’t be afraid to look up how to cheese any given boss you get stuck on—which…yeah. :)
Personally, I prefer to play every game without a HUD as often as I can but there are exceptions. Metroid Prime for example has a great built in HUD that is part of Samus' suit visor. When it's something like that, I like to leave HUD elements up. If it's something like BotW, I'd prefer no HUD at all to immerse myself more. My favorite setting for the HUD and the one I wish every single game would adopt is Horizon: Zero Dawn. You can tap the middle button to quickly have some info show but leave the HUD off. I wish I could do that in every game. DQ 11 for example forces me to have the map up all of the time. Gran Turismo 7s HUD is useful but I wish it was more dynamic.
Agree on all counts.
Games that make deliberate choices with their HUD and other user interfaces are so refreshing to see than just the standard health bar, map/compass, and quest/mission icons strewn all over the place. Other responses in this thread have led me to a lot of games that I otherwise would not have considered.
I've not tried it yet but it's becoming increasingly popular to play Valheim on the hardest difficulty: perma-death, no portals, and disabled minimap. With the world being procedurally generated this forces you to always prepare carefully and craft your own trails and sign posts to not get lost in the woods.
It definitely requires being really familiar with the game mechanics but I can certainly see how it adds a new element of excitement if you do end up lost for awhile and finally find your way home again.
STALKER is probably my favorite for this. The game has an incredible sense of place, and turning the HUD off lets you feel more immersed in that. On its own the game has some visual feedback to clue you in to whether you're bleeding/irradiated, and with mods you can enhance that/take it a bit further. It adds to the intensity of it that you also need to keep track, how many bullets you've got left, whether a reload is necessary, etc. It doesn't really make the game harder in my opinion, because the game is already set up in a way that means you'll struggle even if you can see everything. Early game, it's easy to get popped by practically anyone, and in late-game you'll have enough leeway with your armor to notice when you're taking a lot of damage. Some aspects do get bothersome, like knowing when your equipment is broken - there just isn't any visual feedback for that other than the HUD icon, so you'll need to occasionally check inventory/review the condition of your stuff.
The one that comes to mind for me is Minecraft. I would always be able to find my way using various natural formations, or having to place torches or build landmarks in the game to not get lost.
Dead Space - it's not truly "HUD" free but the elements are very well integrated into the players environment and adds a lot of immersion. There is a map view but quite tucked away and you can easily do without it. There is also a "compass" feature which is helpful in a pinch.
The Last of Us 2 on the highest difficulty, with no HUD elements is such an intense and stressful experience. It works really well since it's a mostly linear experience. You have to keep track of your ammo mentally, and the lack of a crosshair forces you to play a lot more strategically. Also, the listen mode is missing, so you really need to pay attention to the environment and the enemy patrols.
A downside is that this kind of focus makes it more obvious how artificial the AI is in its behavior - they will always patrol where you are hiding, for example. But it's a piece of game design that I've seen in enough other games, so I kind of accept it.
Another good HUD-less experience that I can think about would be Alien Isolation. It's been a while since I last played it, but as far as I can remember, all the UI elements were diegetic in nature - the "minimap" is a device you have to use (added bonus: it has some downsides), and ammo is displayed on the weapons. Perhaps I'm remembering wrong, but it still made for a good minimalistic HUD experience at best.
Didn't know there was a term for this, but that's exactly what I was looking for!
And thanks for the suggestions, I'll check them out!