98 votes

Windows 11 has made the “clean Windows install” an oxymoron

87 comments

  1. [50]
    Ashelyn
    Link
    Yeah, I'm gonna be that person in this thread: this is one of the main reasons I've swapped to Linux as my daily driver. Windows has been slowly getting worse over the years, and every time I use...

    Yeah, I'm gonna be that person in this thread: this is one of the main reasons I've swapped to Linux as my daily driver. Windows has been slowly getting worse over the years, and every time I use it I feel like the OS just doesn't respect my decisions or privacy. Baked in telemetry even if you scale it back with Windows-provided settings options, ad shove-ins, One Drive and other preinstalls, all the reminder popups; every time I had to delve deeper into the settings to find where to turn these off. Then a Windows Update turns half of it back on again and gives me another setup screen asking if I'm super sure I don't want an Advertising ID on my account, and putting the Edge icon back on my desktop just because they can.

    It's really grating and it gets really old.

    Linux hasn't been perfect smooth sailing, especially at the start when I was missing a bunch of libraries for the stuff I wanted to use, but it runs great on the whole and I feel like I actually have a semblance of control over what goes on with my computer. I can play 98% of the games I've wanted to thanks to Lutris and Steam/Proton (never got battlebit working due to the anticheat but it runs well enough on my Win10 laptop). There's stuff I need to change that's rather involved (still need to set up JACK) but I don't feel like the OS is literally just fighting me every step of the way.

    95 votes
    1. [19]
      first-must-burn
      Link Parent
      For a business use case, I had an Ubuntu daily driver for the past few months and thought it was pretty good. With gnome plugins, I was able to customize the layout to be windows-like and have the...

      For a business use case, I had an Ubuntu daily driver for the past few months and thought it was pretty good.

      With gnome plugins, I was able to customize the layout to be windows-like and have the same hotkeys (like win-shift-s assigned to a screenshot/clipping tool). This is not because there is any particular virtue to the windows layout, but because it matches my established muscle memory.

      The one place this fell down is MS office apps. If you do anything complex in Word or Excel (or if you need to interoperate with people who do), neither open office, google docs/sheets, or MS web apps are suitable replacements. I ended up running a windows 11 vm with office installed, but it was pretty slow.

      23 votes
      1. [3]
        Ashelyn
        Link Parent
        In a strange way I feel like office programs are the final frontier of Linux usability. They'll probably never be fully cross-compatible thanks to the constantly evolving proprietary file formats...

        In a strange way I feel like office programs are the final frontier of Linux usability. They'll probably never be fully cross-compatible thanks to the constantly evolving proprietary file formats in semi-closed ecosystems like Office 365.

        17 votes
        1. Akir
          Link Parent
          The irony is that Microsoft created their Office Open XML standard file format in the effort to quash the Open Document Format, steamrolled it through ISO and EMCA to make it an official standard,...

          The irony is that Microsoft created their Office Open XML standard file format in the effort to quash the Open Document Format, steamrolled it through ISO and EMCA to make it an official standard, and then did not actually bother to make Office actually support the standard they authored for seven years. And they still don't save in strict compliance mode by default because "compatibility".

          24 votes
        2. first-must-burn
          Link Parent
          I agree with you about the limitations of open source office tools. I feel likens true compatible alternative would really open things up for enterprise users. Some of the problem is format /...

          I agree with you about the limitations of open source office tools. I feel likens true compatible alternative would really open things up for enterprise users.

          Some of the problem is format / compatibility, even though they are in theory open formats. But I think there are factors at work as well.

          I feel like Google's (and now Microsoft's) free web offerings provide a pretty good cross-platform option for people who don't need compatibility
          This really undermines the open source efforts by greatly reducing the energy/interest available for improving open source alternatives.

          Another thing that probably doesn't help is the proliferation of alternative open source office suites. I feel like every time I look, there are more that I hadn't heard of the last time. I haven't looked into the details (maybe they are really all based on one core distro) , but I assume that having all those projects further diffuses the effort.

          4 votes
      2. [7]
        Promonk
        Link Parent
        Open Office has been hot garbage for ages now. All the cool kids moved to Libre Office. I can't say it isn't without its flaws, but it is certainly more feature-complete than Open Office or MS's...

        Open Office has been hot garbage for ages now. All the cool kids moved to Libre Office. I can't say it isn't without its flaws, but it is certainly more feature-complete than Open Office or MS's web apps.

        12 votes
        1. [7]
          Comment deleted by author
          Link Parent
          1. [3]
            DanBC
            Link Parent
            LibreOffice can't tell the difference between files until it has opened them, and so the "Recent Document" list in the spreadsheet is full of word processor documents. (And vice versa). This means...

            LibreOffice can't tell the difference between files until it has opened them, and so the "Recent Document" list in the spreadsheet is full of word processor documents. (And vice versa).

            This means that if you mostly use the spreadsheet for your day to day work, but have to attend a monthly meeting where all the papers are Writer or Presentation documents your useful list of recent docs gets hosed.

            There was a bug / feature request for several years to get this fixed, so that the module you're using will only show recent files that are relevant to that module, and that was mostly met with "it's not a bug and we don't care" (Much more politely than this, not at all in a toxic way. Just in a "we're not going to do it, but if someone else does we'll look at it"). Eventually someone submitted a fix so there will be an advance option (tools > options > Libre Office advanced > [open expert configuration] > search for "ShowCurrentModuleOnly" and set the flag) to change the behaviour.

            https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=56696

            I think the thing MS has done with Office is focus on that last 3% of crucial features that people need. So, LibreOffice is great for most people for most things, but if you're a lawyer LibreOffice gives you 97% of what you need, and that missing 3% is pretty important. And then you can swap lawyer for most professions (famously not genetic scientists) and you find that a lot of people are using MS because it has a small number of features that they need.

            7 votes
            1. [3]
              Comment deleted by author
              Link Parent
              1. [2]
                Weldawadyathink
                Link Parent
                FYI if you are ever have to deal with office 365 again, you can just use the desktop apps. The web apps are free for everyone. They are Microsoft's equivalent of google docs. The desktop apps can...

                FYI if you are ever have to deal with office 365 again, you can just use the desktop apps. The web apps are free for everyone. They are Microsoft's equivalent of google docs. The desktop apps can interface with the same files the website uses. They can even do concurrent editing that the web based apps do, as long as you use onedrive for storage.

                For the genetics part, I think they just renamed the gene sequences instead of dealing with excel's weirdness.

                1 vote
                1. Markrs240b
                  Link Parent
                  As the old saying goes, an optimist says the glass is 1/2 full, a pessimist says it's 1/2 empty, Excel says its 2-Jan.

                  As the old saying goes, an optimist says the glass is 1/2 full, a pessimist says it's 1/2 empty, Excel says its 2-Jan.

                  3 votes
          2. [2]
            Curiouser
            Link Parent
            It tends to crash on me if i need to open more than three documents in rapid succession, that's my only issue (if anyone has a fix)

            It tends to crash on me if i need to open more than three documents in rapid succession, that's my only issue (if anyone has a fix)

            1. balooga
              Link Parent
              The word processor works well enough for my needs but I’ve had some serious (repeating) crashing issues with the spreadsheet program, rendering it unusable after I painstakingly put all my data...

              The word processor works well enough for my needs but I’ve had some serious (repeating) crashing issues with the spreadsheet program, rendering it unusable after I painstakingly put all my data and formulas into it. That was disappointing.

              3 votes
          3. sparksbet
            Link Parent
            LibreOffice would be totally sufficient if it weren't trying to replace Microsoft Office. Its UX would be totally fine given it's open source otherwise but it's impossible not to compare to how...

            LibreOffice would be totally sufficient if it weren't trying to replace Microsoft Office. Its UX would be totally fine given it's open source otherwise but it's impossible not to compare to how much easier the Microsoft equivalents are to use, not to mention that they often have more functionality. PowerPoint and Excel in particular are leagues above their LibreOffice equivalents.

      3. [5]
        owyn_merrilin
        Link Parent
        I'll probably have forgotten about this by the next time I need to screenshot something, but you just blew my mind. I do that often enough both for work and on my own time that it'll be a big time...

        (like win-shift-s assigned to a screenshot/clipping tool).

        I'll probably have forgotten about this by the next time I need to screenshot something, but you just blew my mind. I do that often enough both for work and on my own time that it'll be a big time saver in the long run if I can remember it.

        Edit: And I prefer Linux for work, but I'm at a windows shop right now, so it's kind of a moot point. For pleasure, I have hardware I use that isn't fully supported in Linux, along with software that relies too much on Windows backwards compatibility. Microsoft sucks, but the answer here is regulation. We're not going to get out of a systemic problem by individual action.

        5 votes
        1. [4]
          Stranger
          Link Parent
          Some other fun ones: Win+R opens a Run dialog box Win+E opens file explorer Win+V opens your clipboard history Win+G opens the game dashboard, which can be useful for built-in screen recording

          Some other fun ones:

          Win+R opens a Run dialog box

          Win+E opens file explorer

          Win+V opens your clipboard history

          Win+G opens the game dashboard, which can be useful for built-in screen recording

          9 votes
          1. ZeroOneenOoreZ
            Link Parent
            Win+L puts your computer into lock screen. Use this one whenever I leave my computer at work.

            Win+L puts your computer into lock screen. Use this one whenever I leave my computer at work.

            8 votes
          2. [2]
            AWildMimicAppears
            Link Parent
            Some more: Win+X opens the right-click Start button menu (great for sending the PC into standby using keyboard only) Win+. opens the emoji list Ctrl+Win+L/R-Arrow keys switches between virtual...

            Some more:

            Win+X opens the right-click Start button menu (great for sending the PC into standby using keyboard only)

            Win+. opens the emoji list

            Ctrl+Win+L/R-Arrow keys switches between virtual desktops (this i actually mapped onto my horizontal scroll wheel, i only wished Windows remembered what programs opened on which desktop between reboots -.-)

            Win+M minimizes all Windows

            Win+K opens the wireless Bluetooth connectivity menu

            5 votes
            1. tomf
              Link Parent
              Win+D is nicer than Win+M because you can toggle everything back I wish every OS had ctrl+shift+esc to bring up the respective task manager

              Win+D is nicer than Win+M because you can toggle everything back

              I wish every OS had ctrl+shift+esc to bring up the respective task manager

      4. [3]
        thalassolatry
        Link Parent
        He doesn't use alt+print screen lol

        like win-shift-s assigned to a screenshot/clipping tool

        He doesn't use alt+print screen lol

        1. [2]
          rish
          Link Parent
          Tbf Win+Shift+S can be done with done hand and faster. To use the Alt+PrintScrn shortcut you've to move your right hand from the mouse to keyboard. Also Print Screen keys is a afterthought in many...

          Tbf Win+Shift+S can be done with done hand and faster. To use the Alt+PrintScrn shortcut you've to move your right hand from the mouse to keyboard. Also Print Screen keys is a afterthought in many keyboards nowadays. It is Fn+Alt+PrntScrn in my laptop.

          2 votes
          1. Nihilego
            Link Parent
            They serve different purposes, if I wanna take a screenshot to keep for any point in the future, I use alt, doesn’t interfere with what I’m doing or delays it. Snipping tool is for sharing...

            They serve different purposes, if I wanna take a screenshot to keep for any point in the future, I use alt, doesn’t interfere with what I’m doing or delays it.
            Snipping tool is for sharing something quickly on Discord, because snipping tool takes time to open and snip, as opposed to quickly take a screenshot and move on.

            1 vote
    2. deathinactthree
      Link Parent
      I'm going to be the second of those people. :) There are actually a number of things I genuinely like about W11 over and above previous versions of Windows, but between undoing what limited...

      I'm going to be the second of those people. :) There are actually a number of things I genuinely like about W11 over and above previous versions of Windows, but between undoing what limited customizations/debloating I can do with every update like you said, and a surprising amount of stuff that just doesn't work (or has major issues) on what's pretty standard hardware, I recently as of two months ago switched to Linux as my daily driver. Which I've never done. I've been a casual Linux hobbyist for a decade but never took the plunge until now, and it's entirely due to the issues this thread is about.

      As @first-must-burn said, this wouldn't work if I needed to do anything in Office365 that can't be handled in the web versions (although worth noting that OnlyOffice is built with Office XML and can get you pretty far). Fortunately earlier this year I moved most of the client data work I used to need O365 native for to Google Suite and can use the PWAs for Outlook and Teams which work just fine. I admit I'm lucky here--even a year ago Office compatibility would've been too much of a blocker.

      I'm using Zorin OS with GNOME Shell which has been shockingly smooth so far. No major issues at all and the minor issues have all been easy fixes. All my hardware works, almost all of my games work, and it's been perceptibly faster than W11 on the same hardware. I'm pretty happy.

      8 votes
    3. sparksbet
      Link Parent
      Windows 11 paired with the Steam Deck announcement were when I finally decided to switch. I'd been toying with the idea for a while (I'm a developer so working on Windows was sub-par for some...

      Windows 11 paired with the Steam Deck announcement were when I finally decided to switch. I'd been toying with the idea for a while (I'm a developer so working on Windows was sub-par for some tasks anyway), but I took the Steam Deck as a sign that it was ready for gaming and I haven't looked back. Luckily my gaming preferences largely avoid the weak spots remaining in Linux gaming, so it ended up being really painless.

      8 votes
    4. [13]
      l_one
      Link Parent
      You're no longer so much the odd-person out anymore. Linux is becoming more of a mainstream choice these days, with more and more stable-out-of-the-box distro options available. I'm on Mint and...

      Yeah, I'm gonna be that person in this thread

      You're no longer so much the odd-person out anymore. Linux is becoming more of a mainstream choice these days, with more and more stable-out-of-the-box distro options available.

      I'm on Mint and have been for... I don't know, 6 or 7 years now? I have occasional issues, but 95+% of what I need works without issues or need for me to fix stuff. Like you, I can play the games I want using Lutris or, increasingly, I run into games coded to have a native Linux installer package. Factorio comes to mind.

      I do keep a Windows 11 install on an optional boot partition on my laptop, but that's only for jobs where a contractee for a job I'm doing needs remote access using native Windows stuff. On that note, I was flat out enraged at the crap I had to deal with getting that (mostly) clean Windows 11 install put in. Very glad I left that behind me for my daily driver OS.

      8 votes
      1. [6]
        Ashelyn
        Link Parent
        By "that person" I meant more in the vein of being the one to pop in and immediately proselytize Linux when anyone voices a complaint about Windows. I'm really glad to see that people are coming...

        By "that person" I meant more in the vein of being the one to pop in and immediately proselytize Linux when anyone voices a complaint about Windows. I'm really glad to see that people are coming around, but for a good while there was (and still is to an extent) the meme of obnoxious Linux proponents. The online landscape of this issue has changed remarkably compared to even a couple years ago.

        7 votes
        1. [4]
          DavesWorld
          Link Parent
          The Linux proselytizers definitely haven't made it easy (or welcoming) over the years. My issue with Linux is I really have no interest in needing to sit down and study (like, for a test or as a...

          The Linux proselytizers definitely haven't made it easy (or welcoming) over the years.

          My issue with Linux is I really have no interest in needing to sit down and study (like, for a test or as a whole course) to become "Linux proficient" just to install it so I can go back to using my computer.

          Look, I'm not a technophobe. Way, way back in the day I used to sit down with DOS books to figure out oddball boot commands I needed to pull drivers or change memory settings. I never used UNIX, which would have been my gateway to Linux. I was always a PC-compatible home guy who did stuff in offices some.

          These days, I know how to Google problems, read through the results, and I usually find what I'm looking for and can fix the Windows issues I've had over the years. I like to describe myself as a "computer guy" who non-computer people think knows computers, but actual computer people smile patiently at before they either ignore me or pat me dismissively on the head.

          Because my interest in my computer is in using it. I prefer to work with it, not work on it. The last PC box I built I considered Linux pretty seriously. And (since I had access to a bunch of second-hand Dell boxes I wasn't doing much of anything with) decided to see if I could get Linux up on one of those after I put Win10 on "my" computer so I would have one I could use.

          I quickly figured out I was going to have to revert back to my DOS days and become a full on Linux guy to be able to get it from a paperweight to a functioning desktop that had net access and could launch some basic apps. And I hadn't even gotten to the part where I'd figure out how to get the apps, or where. I'd already hit a brick wall (meaning, I was going to have to learn how to learn how to then find and apply it) trying to figure out how to install a damn networking driver.

          Apple is awful, always has been. Boutique closed garden, no thanks. Linux has spent decades being the Geek's Geek solution; the OS serious computer people used because it was that finicky. They wanted finicky. I just want it to work.

          Windows used to be the inoffensive option. The "fuck it, forget about it" option that just works. It's clearly turning into the Evil Empire with the telemetry and everything, which I hate almost as much as I hate Apple and their positioning. So probably, however much I am not looking forward to losing a month of my life to it, I will have to sit down and become a Linux guy at some point. Even though I would really rather just keep working on other things.

          Windows sucks major ass with where they're taking it. But when you install it, the damn thing just installs, it comes up to a usable desktop, and you're off and running. I don't mind learning new keyboard shortcuts, but I do mind having to wade through a whole course of "here's how you find sites that host the drivers that will let your new Linux installation 'see' your video card" along with repeating that for the printer, the router, the mouse, the USB drivers, the external onsite backup drive, my Jellyfin server, and so on.

          And worse, I have to (DOS days again) revert to command syntax to get Linux to do these things. It's not just that I have to figure out these new process, I also have to figure out the syntax too since Linux is a Geek's playground and RealMenOfComputers(tm) don't use the mouse. I used to have DOS command prompt syntax stuff memorized. That was 30 years ago. Then Windows came along and for the most part all I need to remember is clickable categories (which they've shuffled around some over the years).

          I totally get that Linux people roll on the floor laughing at people like me. I get that. But is it so wrong to just want to be able to download some all-in-one package (the way Windows pretty much is) that I let install, and when it's done it's just given me a damn desktop that found the video and audio cards, has full networking, and all that? I mean, sure I'm just a pat-on-the-head irritant to RealMenOfComputers(tm) but is it really so wrong for me to not want to need to study just to install and finally boot my computer so I can sit there like a lump and use it?

          Basically, I know I'll be off Windows soon unless someone at Microsoft reverses course. Which I don't at all expect. They're headed full steam into the telemetry data tracking era, which I hate. But I am totally, absolutely not looking forward to having to bash my head against Linux for what's probably going to be weeks of me not having a computer I can use whenever I finally gather enough nerve and patience to try to climb the mountain.

          3 votes
          1. Amarok
            Link Parent
            That was my experience with kubuntu and exactly why I picked it in this old recommendations thread. Having used it for almost a year now with fewer issues (that were easily solved) than I can...

            But is it so wrong to just want to be able to download some all-in-one package (the way Windows pretty much is) that I let install, and when it's done it's just given me a damn desktop that found the video and audio cards, has full networking, and all that?

            That was my experience with kubuntu and exactly why I picked it in this old recommendations thread. Having used it for almost a year now with fewer issues (that were easily solved) than I can count on one hand, no way I am ever using Windows again. Using modern versions of Windows is incredibly more of an annoying pain in the ass every single day.

            If you miss Windows 7, that's your distro. Everything is right where you expect it to be, just better.

            3 votes
          2. [2]
            dreamless_patio
            Link Parent
            No, and as of 3-4 years ago (probably around kernel v5) I haven't really come across a popular distro that struggles with this anymore. Hell, I have less issues with rolling release distros these...

            But is it so wrong to just want to be able to download some all-in-one package (the way Windows pretty much is) that I let install, and when it's done it's just given me a damn desktop that found the video and audio cards, has full networking, and all that?

            No, and as of 3-4 years ago (probably around kernel v5) I haven't really come across a popular distro that struggles with this anymore. Hell, I have less issues with rolling release distros these days than I ever did with LTS releases of Ubuntu or whatever. My advice is to forget everything you just wrote about and install Linux Mint, because I guarantee you it will work out of the box with very little headache or "studying." And if for some reason you end up balls deep in a terminal and your computer starts smoking, I'll buy you a beer (or six) for the trouble.

            1 vote
            1. Akir
              Link Parent
              Frankly the last time I had an issue with hardware on Linux was probably circa 2010, when I was trying to get a cheap Chinese graphics tablet working. I’m kind of amazed that people think that...

              Frankly the last time I had an issue with hardware on Linux was probably circa 2010, when I was trying to get a cheap Chinese graphics tablet working. I’m kind of amazed that people think that this is a major problem.

              To be fair there are still people who make proprietary hardware that don’t support Linux, but they are fairly rare these days. But if you aren’t buying “professional” you’re not likely to have to deal with them.

        2. l_one
          Link Parent
          I've got to agree there, and I'm very glad for it. In terms of keeping the interests of the user primary above other concerns (like making money by spying on their users - market research /...

          The online landscape of this issue has changed remarkably compared to even a couple years ago.

          I've got to agree there, and I'm very glad for it. In terms of keeping the interests of the user primary above other concerns (like making money by spying on their users - market research / telemetry / whatever they want to call it now), I don't think there's any arguable competition from the Windows or Mac camp.

          I've been very glad to see how low the barriers to entry are for running Linux these days.

          1 vote
      2. [2]
        RobotOverlord525
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        I think barriers to entry are lower now than they were in the past, but I would be surprised if the Linux market share has really ticked up appreciably in the last decade.

        Linux is becoming more of a mainstream choice these days, with more and more stable-out-of-the-box distro options available.

        I think barriers to entry are lower now than they were in the past, but I would be surprised if the Linux market share has really ticked up appreciably in the last decade.

        1 vote
        1. l_one
          Link Parent
          They definitely are. Users have options that just work out of the box, where 5ish years ago much more technical skill was often needed for config and troubleshooting issues. The market share...

          I think barriers to entry are lower now than they were in the past

          They definitely are. Users have options that just work out of the box, where 5ish years ago much more technical skill was often needed for config and troubleshooting issues.

          The market share thing: yeah, Linux use is still firmly in the minority for home desktop users, but at the same time it has been increasing over the years. According to an ArsTechnica article, it passed 3% of desktop market share this June.

      3. [3]
        Protected
        Link Parent
        Which window manager?

        I'm on Mint

        Which window manager?

        1. [2]
          l_one
          Link Parent
          Cinnamon. To be fair, it was the first one I tried, I loved it, and haven't tried the others.

          Cinnamon.

          To be fair, it was the first one I tried, I loved it, and haven't tried the others.

          2 votes
          1. Aleroniponi
            Link Parent
            Cinammon is excellent! If you find yourself looking for more customization options, KDE is a fantastic environment to try that has a solid default configuration.

            Cinammon is excellent! If you find yourself looking for more customization options, KDE is a fantastic environment to try that has a solid default configuration.

      4. [2]
        Comment deleted by author
        Link Parent
        1. Akir
          Link Parent
          It varies, but I don't think I've seen many games in anything like a package file for a while now. Most of them are just delivered via Steam, some choose to distribute them as flatpaks or...

          It varies, but I don't think I've seen many games in anything like a package file for a while now. Most of them are just delivered via Steam, some choose to distribute them as flatpaks or appimages, and some are just a zipped file of precompiled code.

          I've also noticed a not insignificant number of games that were, under the hood, basically just the same Windows game distributed with Wine or Mono. With Steam and Proton, a lot of games aren't even doing that; they're just run with the version of Proton Steam has downloaded; sometimes it'll ask Steam to use a specific version.

          1 vote
    5. [6]
      mild_takes
      Link Parent
      Battlebit works. Just select the "install anti cheat" option and then open like regular. I think I had to do that twice in a row. Works perfectly on steamdeck and my Linux PC.

      Battlebit works. Just select the "install anti cheat" option and then open like regular. I think I had to do that twice in a row. Works perfectly on steamdeck and my Linux PC.

      4 votes
      1. [5]
        Ashelyn
        Link Parent
        I tried troubleshooting it for several hours, maybe I'll give it another shot at some point but I reinstalled EAC probably 10 times trying a bunch of different configurations and orders of steps...

        I tried troubleshooting it for several hours, maybe I'll give it another shot at some point but I reinstalled EAC probably 10 times trying a bunch of different configurations and orders of steps before I just gave up.

        Might try to get it working again sometime but it gave me a lot of trouble on my computer

        1 vote
        1. [4]
          mild_takes
          Link Parent
          What distro are you using?

          What distro are you using?

          1. [3]
            Ashelyn
            Link Parent
            I'm currently running Void so it's probably some sort of library issue

            I'm currently running Void so it's probably some sort of library issue

            1. [2]
              wervenyt
              Link Parent
              What is your graphical stack? GNOME, Plasma, i3? Some games just don't work on X11, only on Wayland, or vice versa, for me on Void.

              What is your graphical stack? GNOME, Plasma, i3? Some games just don't work on X11, only on Wayland, or vice versa, for me on Void.

              1. Ashelyn
                Link Parent
                I'm running it on Plasma, I'm pretty sure with X11 as the backend but I'd have to double check that.

                I'm running it on Plasma, I'm pretty sure with X11 as the backend but I'd have to double check that.

    6. hammurobbie
      Link Parent
      This is why I switched. When my OS started to mimic malware, I knew it was time to find a different solution.

      This is why I switched. When my OS started to mimic malware, I knew it was time to find a different solution.

      3 votes
    7. [3]
      adutchman
      Link Parent
      If you want good audio, you might be better of using Pipewire

      If you want good audio, you might be better of using Pipewire

      3 votes
      1. [2]
        Ashelyn
        Link Parent
        I will have to look into that, thank you! I had intended on doing some research but just wanted something with realtime audio and more granular control than I can get from PulseAudio.

        I will have to look into that, thank you! I had intended on doing some research but just wanted something with realtime audio and more granular control than I can get from PulseAudio.

        3 votes
        1. babypuncher
          Link Parent
          I'll second PipeWire. It's the best of both JACK and PulseAudio, and has full backwards compatibility for both along with ALSA and G-Streamer. It's been the default audio server in Fedora for a...

          I'll second PipeWire. It's the best of both JACK and PulseAudio, and has full backwards compatibility for both along with ALSA and G-Streamer.

          It's been the default audio server in Fedora for a while now. Ever since moving to it, all my Linux audio problems have gone away.

          1 vote
    8. ButteredToast
      Link Parent
      I recently switched the main OS on a laptop from W11 to Linux which has worked ok so far, but I don’t think I’ll be able to do the same for my gaming tower for some time primarily thanks to a...

      I recently switched the main OS on a laptop from W11 to Linux which has worked ok so far, but I don’t think I’ll be able to do the same for my gaming tower for some time primarily thanks to a couple of titles that have anticheat that’ll risk getting you banned if you use anything but Windows running on bare metal even though WINE/Proton run them fine. Unfortunately the studio has no interest in remedying the situation.

      2 votes
    9. [2]
      eggpl4nt
      Link Parent
      My new laptop is Windows 11, my last laptop was Windows 8.1. I'm so sick of the constant Windows 11 updates that I can't control that make my gaming laptop whirr like it's rendering each frame of...

      My new laptop is Windows 11, my last laptop was Windows 8.1. I'm so sick of the constant Windows 11 updates that I can't control that make my gaming laptop whirr like it's rendering each frame of Avatar 2 at 4k HD. I've seriously been considering dumping Windows for Linux. I realized I barely game anymore, so I don't think I'll care if I lose the ability to game. I mainly read, write, and browse the Internet.

      How was the switch to Linux? What distribution did you go with?

      1 vote
      1. Ashelyn
        Link Parent
        The switch was pretty good! I had prior Linux experience, having used different distros on and off through high school. I actually installed Linux Fedora on my first built computer because I...

        The switch was pretty good! I had prior Linux experience, having used different distros on and off through high school. I actually installed Linux Fedora on my first built computer because I couldn't afford Windows! The experience left a lot to be desired back then but at least It could play Minecraft. I also didn't know what I was doing so much, that partition ended up getting nuked because I tried to resize an encrypted LVM and didn't do it correctly, then tried to fix it from the command line and made it worse x.x

        On my current build, I ended up going with Void Linux because I enjoy the process of setting up the OS and programs and wanted to try it out. The Void handbook is pretty good. It had a few spots that could have been explained better but it does an overall superb job of providing explanations and step by step walkthroughs. It's been very stable and reliable—the main issues I've run into are outcomes of my deliberate choice to select a "DIY" distro.

        2 votes
    10. AWildMimicAppears
      Link Parent
      I fully agree with you. My PC is primarily for gaming, and with the work Steam has put into Proton, there is simply no reason for me to upgrade from Windows 10 to 11 when its end-of-life date has...

      I fully agree with you. My PC is primarily for gaming, and with the work Steam has put into Proton, there is simply no reason for me to upgrade from Windows 10 to 11 when its end-of-life date has come and forces me to deal with stuff like forced TPM and Crapware, when there is a great working alternative in whatever flavor of Linux i wanna run. I've worked with Debian before (even if just dabbling with a underpowered system running a NAS and Owncloud for experimentation, and some Moonlight streaming), and things seem to have become a lot simpler for a gamer than when i last checked. Since i mainly play single player or local coop, the Anticheat issues do not apply to me, so the last thing keeping me on Windows is inertia.

      1 vote
    11. thereticent
      Link Parent
      I switched to Zorin OS (a very Windows-convert-friendly Linux distro) a couple of months ago, on both a 10-year-old ThinkPad I use for web browsing and on a new Dell Vostro my kid uses for gaming....

      I switched to Zorin OS (a very Windows-convert-friendly Linux distro) a couple of months ago, on both a 10-year-old ThinkPad I use for web browsing and on a new Dell Vostro my kid uses for gaming. With Steam and Proton, gaming was very simple to get working. The browsing laptop was even easier. Using them has been a delight. I just want to switch my work to the same but the best I can do is use Office 365 when I can at home.

  2. [13]
    Comment deleted by author
    Link
    1. Ashelyn
      Link Parent
      I purchased a MacBook at one point for a variety of reasons including potential music production and "on the couch" use, and I have to say that OS is stellar! The main issue I have with Apple is...

      I purchased a MacBook at one point for a variety of reasons including potential music production and "on the couch" use, and I have to say that OS is stellar! The main issue I have with Apple is with their extremely aggressive anti-repair practices on their hardware, but the desktop OS is very pleasant to use. It's odd, because they do similar things to Microsoft (iCloud v OneDrive, by default assuming you're going to want all of their apps) but the whole execution is so much better and less intrusive on MacOS. In my opinion, the whole UX design of an Apple product is pretty much unmatched by any comparable device.

      5 votes
    2. [4]
      donn
      Link Parent
      I truly prefer macOS, but I straight up cannot afford a Mac as a daily driver/primary work machine because of the RAM upgrade prices. I don't subscribe to the mentality of expensive therefore bad...

      I truly prefer macOS, but I straight up cannot afford a Mac as a daily driver/primary work machine because of the RAM upgrade prices. I don't subscribe to the mentality of expensive therefore bad so many on the internet have, but an increase of $400 for 32 gigabytes of ram is a bit too much to stomach for me personally.

      4 votes
      1. [3]
        babypuncher
        Link Parent
        What is it you are doing with your machine? Given the way macOS and other modern operating systems manage memory, you might not need as much RAM as you think. A lot of people use their machine and...

        What is it you are doing with your machine? Given the way macOS and other modern operating systems manage memory, you might not need as much RAM as you think.

        A lot of people use their machine and see high RAM usage and think they are running out of memory, but they aren't. Windows and macOS aggressively cache in RAM data that was accessed from the disk, and they do not dispose it until they need the space. I think for most everyday use cases (web browsing, office suites, even photo editing), 16GB is more than plenty.

        1 vote
        1. [2]
          donn
          Link Parent
          I do dev work: lots of virtualization, parallel compiles, et cetera. Right now I'm typing this on a decapitated (long story) Intel MacBook Pro with 16 gigs of RAM and I do make a point of turning...

          I do dev work: lots of virtualization, parallel compiles, et cetera. Right now I'm typing this on a decapitated (long story) Intel MacBook Pro with 16 gigs of RAM and I do make a point of turning Docker off when I'm not using it, avoiding Electron apps, etc. It makes it usably fast when I'm testing anything Mac-specific, but still not for the heavy lifting if that makes sense.

          My boss uses an M2 MacBook Pro with 16 gigabytes of RAM, but he reports the situation is not much better for RAM usage with Apple Silicon for the kinds of things we do.

          2 votes
          1. babypuncher
            Link Parent
            Yeah for your use case you definitely want 32GB. My workload is similar and that is what I went for, and it has been pretty comfortable. I just thought it was worth bringing up because I know...

            Yeah for your use case you definitely want 32GB. My workload is similar and that is what I went for, and it has been pretty comfortable.

            I just thought it was worth bringing up because I know people who mostly work in office suites and occasionally Photoshop who spring for way more RAM than they need.

            1 vote
    3. [7]
      ButteredToast
      (edited )
      Link Parent
      I suspect that much of the distaste for macOS specifically (as opposed to Apple in general or the hardware it runs on) boils down to it not being Windows. Of course that’s to be expected, people...

      I suspect that much of the distaste for macOS specifically (as opposed to Apple in general or the hardware it runs on) boils down to it not being Windows.

      Of course that’s to be expected, people become accustomed to the tools they use and generally avoid having to learn anything different unless they have to, but I think it’s important to try to separate negative feelings stemming from “this isn’t what I’m used to” and “this is objectively bad”, because the two are frequently conflated.

      2 votes
      1. [6]
        Dr_Amazing
        Link Parent
        It's definitely part of it. I occasionally had to use a Mac at work and it almost felt deliberate how everything was like 90% the same as windows, with just enough changed to be a giant pain in...

        It's definitely part of it. I occasionally had to use a Mac at work and it almost felt deliberate how everything was like 90% the same as windows, with just enough changed to be a giant pain in the ass to figure out.

        1. [5]
          ButteredToast
          Link Parent
          It might not make you feel better to know, but most of the differences aren’t deliberately trying to be “not-Windows”. Many many macOS UI conventions and design patterns date back to either the...

          It might not make you feel better to know, but most of the differences aren’t deliberately trying to be “not-Windows”. Many many macOS UI conventions and design patterns date back to either the system that ran on the 1985 original Mac or to NeXTSTEP from the late 80s, both of which predate the modern Windows desktop (Windows 95) significantly.

          If Apple made everything just like Windows, much of their userbase (especially longer term ones) would be very upset and likely even jump ship.

          2 votes
          1. [4]
            Nihilego
            Link Parent
            Is there a video or an article/post that goes along the history of Mac(as an OS)? History of Linux is out there and I’m familiar with some of it(and if I need to know something I can look it up)....

            Is there a video or an article/post that goes along the history of Mac(as an OS)?
            History of Linux is out there and I’m familiar with some of it(and if I need to know something I can look it up).
            Meanwhile for Mac I either didn’t look hard enough, or don’t know where to look at.
            I know NeXTSTEP and Darwin were both in the roots of MacOS(Darwin appearing in the kernel’s name as well in uname -r), but no idea how or why they got together, what XNU is. And I’m curious about what “compositor” it uses (if any), but not like there’s much about that around the net.

            1. [3]
              ButteredToast
              (edited )
              Link Parent
              Unfortunately I don’t have a singular article or video on hand to link, but the highly abbreviated version is basically: Apple creates the Lisa along with its bespoke graphical OS in the early 80s...

              Unfortunately I don’t have a singular article or video on hand to link, but the highly abbreviated version is basically:

              • Apple creates the Lisa along with its bespoke graphical OS in the early 80s
              • The Lisa more or less flops because it’s too expensive due to its components
              • Apple creates the original Macintosh, which uses the bones of the Lisa but is much more affordable thanks to lower specs
              • The Macintosh is not as much as success as hoped, but gains popularity with subsequent models
              • Jobs gets ousted from Apple due to creative differences, founds new computer company NeXT
              • NeXT creates NeXTSTEP, a graphical UNIX-based OS, for its high end research and academia oriented computers
              • Through the late 80s to mid 90s, Apple flounders with lack of direction and struggles to come up with a replacement for their OS, which was rapidly looking aged compared to competitors’ offerings
              • In the same time period, Microsoft was eating everybody’s lunch including NeXT’s, which led to NeXT quitting making hardware and entering a partnership with Sun to sell their OS and platform
              • Apple buys NeXT, which is more like a reverse-merger with NeXT leadership taking over Apple
              • Steve cuts numerous boondoggle projects, refocuses the company, and sets in motion a project to turn NeXTSTEP into a modern Mac OS
              • The NeXTSTEP-based Mac OS X is released in 2001 and development on the Classic Mac OS is discontinued shortly thereafter

              After that, we enter the modern era where OS X has served as the base OS for everything they’ve made since except for pre-iOS iPods (iOS, tvOS, watchOS, and soon visionOS).

              As for what XNU is, it’s a mix of the Mach microkernel, BSD 4.3, and NeXT/Apple-written code. The compositor Apple uses is called Quartz for which there’s a decent Wikipedia article.

              1 vote
              1. [2]
                Akir
                Link Parent
                The Macintosh was very successful. Perhaps not as much with the first model, but it grew more and more steam as it developed with each subsequent model. Apple hedged it’s bets with another system,...

                The Macintosh is more of a success, but not as big as hoped

                The Macintosh was very successful. Perhaps not as much with the first model, but it grew more and more steam as it developed with each subsequent model. Apple hedged it’s bets with another system, the Apple IIGS, but Macintosh was so much more successful that the IIGS is barely remembered by history.

                1. ButteredToast
                  Link Parent
                  Fair, that point was referencing the original model only but I’ve made an edit to reflect popularity gained after it.

                  Fair, that point was referencing the original model only but I’ve made an edit to reflect popularity gained after it.

                  1 vote
  3. admicos
    Link
    Apparently you can work around (some of) this by selecting the regions "English (World)" or "English (Europe)" during install: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/windows-ooberegion-bloatware.html Or just...

    Apparently you can work around (some of) this by selecting the regions "English (World)" or "English (Europe)" during install: https://www.ctrl.blog/entry/windows-ooberegion-bloatware.html

    Or just pirate Windows 10 Enterprise LTSC, but some people don't like piracy so /shrug

    21 votes
  4. [6]
    tomf
    Link
    A few months ago I got a new system that is a combo gaming / media center. Prior to this I was all about LTSC and all that, but I figured I'd at least give W11 a shot. I went with Enterprise,...

    A few months ago I got a new system that is a combo gaming / media center. Prior to this I was all about LTSC and all that, but I figured I'd at least give W11 a shot. I went with Enterprise, local logins, some minor clean up, and StartAllBack instead of OpenShell (by default you can't have a smaller taskbar at the top of the screen.)

    With Enterprise as a base, W11 isn't so bad. I use a nKVM or a USB switch for the keyboard and trackpad. There were some quirks with that. With the nKVM (Barrier), backtick and tildes just doesn't work. Also, Microsoft co-opted HYPER for all of its Office shortcut keys.

    Easy fixes for some, but these minor annoyances add up. It amazes me that Microsoft is willing to add so much bullshit to their OS when the other two main options are relatively clean. Asking users to use iCloud is hardly on the level of Microsoft's nagging.

    19 votes
    1. [5]
      Toric
      Link Parent
      To somone whose been using linux for a decade now, that sound like more work than any user friendly distro out there. Heck, this might just be me being used to one way and not the other, but it...

      To somone whose been using linux for a decade now, that sound like more work than any user friendly distro out there.

      Heck, this might just be me being used to one way and not the other, but it sounds like almost as mutch work as my standard archlinux install...

      6 votes
      1. [4]
        tomf
        Link Parent
        its sort of a middle ground between something like ubuntu and i3 etc and arch. Just a bit to setup, but once you get going you notice more and more things that need minor adjustments. I only use...

        its sort of a middle ground between something like ubuntu and i3 etc and arch. Just a bit to setup, but once you get going you notice more and more things that need minor adjustments.

        I only use linux for server stuff, but I find that the setup with Windows takes more time over the course of a few weeks with little tweaks here and there, where the Linux stuff consumes an evening. Same time overall, but the linux stuff is done up front and way nicer.

        3 votes
        1. [3]
          ThrowdoBaggins
          Link Parent
          Okay, I think you’ve just sold me on Linux next time I want to change my system. I had assumed that Linux keeps being more and more user friendly, but haven’t touched it yet so I’m not sure how...

          Same time overall, but the linux stuff is done up front and way nicer.

          Okay, I think you’ve just sold me on Linux next time I want to change my system.

          I had assumed that Linux keeps being more and more user friendly, but haven’t touched it yet so I’m not sure how much re-learning I’ll have to do. I won’t be touching windows 11 (right now, I think I’m being saved from windows “automatically upgrading” me without asking, simply because my hardware doesn’t have that “security” stuff that win11 demands) and maybe the next version will return to sanity, but I have my doubts.

          But I’m absolutely the kind of person who’s willing to do an unreasonable amount of initial setup to make things more efficient down the line, so that one line you said there has got me seriously considering Linux as my next OS, whenever that happens.

          Do you know if there’s support for VR headsets in Linux? I haven’t got VR yet but it’s on the horizon for me, probably before the end of the year and definitely before I change OS

          4 votes
          1. tomf
            Link Parent
            why not run it in a VM or even a live version off a little m2 in an enclosure or something? Its fun to mess around with. It depends which distro you go with, but Debian based distros (ubuntu etc)...

            why not run it in a VM or even a live version off a little m2 in an enclosure or something? Its fun to mess around with.

            It depends which distro you go with, but Debian based distros (ubuntu etc) isn't too difficult if you're relatively technical. I have no idea about gaming things, though.

            but yeah, my advice, run it in a VM so you can play around with it without any real danger. When you're searching for help in forums and stuff, never copy and paste anything. You'll learn a lot faster.

            2 votes
          2. sparksbet
            Link Parent
            Gaming on Linux is really viable these days, but afaik one of the exceptions there is VR, where there really isn't great support yet. I'd definitely recommend dual-booting if you want VR support.

            Gaming on Linux is really viable these days, but afaik one of the exceptions there is VR, where there really isn't great support yet. I'd definitely recommend dual-booting if you want VR support.

  5. first-must-burn
    Link
    I would add that close tie-in between MS office apps and one drive. I hate that it tries to have me save my documents there by default and its 2-3 clicks to get a file/directory picker.

    I would add that close tie-in between MS office apps and one drive. I hate that it tries to have me save my documents there by default and its 2-3 clicks to get a file/directory picker.

    16 votes
  6. [5]
    BeardyHat
    Link
    I've been using Windows 11 for about a month or two now and weirdly, I find it less intrusive than Windows 10 was. With 10, I would install Classic Start, as I found the enormous tiles, riddled...

    I've been using Windows 11 for about a month or two now and weirdly, I find it less intrusive than Windows 10 was.

    With 10, I would install Classic Start, as I found the enormous tiles, riddled with advertising all over them to be pretty obnoxious. The Windows 11 Start menu takes up less space on my screen and doesn't have any obnoxiously huge tiles pinned to it.

    Frequently, I'll return to my Windows 10 computer (I still am using 10 on 4 other devices in my house) and I'll find it has rebooted and is asking me those SCOOBE questions again. I have to click through about 5 pages (No, I don't want to subscribe to OneDrive. No I don't want to pin 365 to my Taskbar, etc, etc), which so far, hasn't happened to me yet in 11.

    The few annoyances I've had so far with 11 are OneDrive pestering me to subscribe for more space (I used OneDrive at some point in my life) and I'm still getting used to the Context menu being a little different. But so far, the new usability stuff has outweighed the minor gripes. Maybe I'll feel more annoyed with it, as I do 10, in the future, but I'm considering upgrading all my PC's in the house to 11.

    All that said, I'm not married to the Microsoft ecosystem. If Windows annoys me enough, I'll switch to Linux; I've done it in the past, but didn't stick with it, as I had some issues with how the distro had decided they wanted me to use my Middle Click, a feature I use constantly.

    I guess I should add a caveat: My computers and network are both heavily adblocked. Between uBlock on Firefox and a piHole on my network as a whole, we see minimal ads in my household

    12 votes
    1. [3]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. BeardyHat
        Link Parent
        Perhaps, but I don't need a vast majority of the options in the context menu as it had existed anyway. Open With is still right there, Copy as Path is still right there and Properties is still...

        Perhaps, but I don't need a vast majority of the options in the context menu as it had existed anyway. Open With is still right there, Copy as Path is still right there and Properties is still right there; that's the majority of the stuff I need on the Context menu. Rarely do I need anything beyond that and a few of the things I used to need extra button presses for (such as Open Terminal Here) are now in the new context menu.

        Why restore the clunky, entirely too long Context Menu with 50% more options than I actually need? There's a reason I never bothered to enable "God Mode" in old versions of Windows: I just don't need that many options and having them just makes it take longer to find the one I need.

        2 votes
      2. RustyRedRobot
        Link Parent
        I found this to be a really helpful tutorial of sorts and the tools recommended make tuning windows 11 to how you like it much simpler. https://youtu.be/VU9L0udNV9M?si=YM8sbksKzllCcWI4

        I found this to be a really helpful tutorial of sorts and the tools recommended make tuning windows 11 to how you like it much simpler.

        https://youtu.be/VU9L0udNV9M?si=YM8sbksKzllCcWI4

    2. [2]
      Fooly_411
      Link Parent
      While I agree that the tiles on win10's start menus are obnoxious, literally every install I just delete them and drag the empty space over and it is a super clean start menu again. Doing that...

      While I agree that the tiles on win10's start menus are obnoxious, literally every install I just delete them and drag the empty space over and it is a super clean start menu again. Doing that alone makes it better than win11's start, imo.

      1 vote
      1. BeardyHat
        Link Parent
        And I used to just install Classic Start via Ninite on any new Windows 10 install. Sure I've had to remove a few icons from the 11 Start Menu, but that isn't any more difficult than removing the...

        And I used to just install Classic Start via Ninite on any new Windows 10 install. Sure I've had to remove a few icons from the 11 Start Menu, but that isn't any more difficult than removing the few tiles off Windows 10 manually.

        Most of the time, in any recent version of Windows, the only thing I'm really using the Start Menu for is to search for what I need. I haven't manually hunted through the Programs menu since Windows 95 because it's just that much easier to hit the Windows key, type what I need and then there it is.

  7. Thomas-C
    Link
    SCOOBE is one of the little things that I feel illustrates the whole issue. Why do I, the user, need a "second chance" to go through a bunch of stylized windows for activating shit I can find at...

    SCOOBE is one of the little things that I feel illustrates the whole issue. Why do I, the user, need a "second chance" to go through a bunch of stylized windows for activating shit I can find at any moment within the OS? Because it's not my second chance, not really. It's Microsoft trying to give themselves another shot, and that bugs the shit out of me. This is my computer, damnit. If I want to use things, I'll use them. if I say "no" to something, it means "no". Quit trying to own the entirety of my time with the machine you weird ass company.

    I made the switch to Linux earlier in the year and since then converted all my machines. The only one I had to do some fiddling with was my gaming laptop - and all that was, was installing some drivers, and hitting the keys for my keyboard lights (they weren't gone, just off lol). I've since upgraded peripherals and didn't have to do much of anything to make them work. I also converted a macbook air, and two of my parents' machines, and those were fully operational right from the jump. If you're considering doing it, it's a fine time.

    10 votes
  8. [5]
    DanBC
    Link
    Windows 3.1 was introduced in 1992 and cost $149, which is about $320 today. I feel like plenty of people would pay that much for a clean OS. But MS have made it really hard to just buy the OS.

    Windows 3.1 was introduced in 1992 and cost $149, which is about $320 today.

    I feel like plenty of people would pay that much for a clean OS. But MS have made it really hard to just buy the OS.

    8 votes
    1. [3]
      Akir
      Link Parent
      To be fair, updating and maintaining all the code in Windows 11 is vastly more labor-intensive than Windows 3.1 ever was.

      To be fair, updating and maintaining all the code in Windows 11 is vastly more labor-intensive than Windows 3.1 ever was.

      7 votes
      1. [2]
        vektor
        Link Parent
        Even if spread out over the larger user base? Even if you were to cut out all the bloat? I can hardly imagine they're making as much money off me as it is as I would be willing to part with in...

        Even if spread out over the larger user base? Even if you were to cut out all the bloat?

        I can hardly imagine they're making as much money off me as it is as I would be willing to part with in exchange for a non-hostile slightly cleaner product.

        2 votes
        1. TumblingTurquoise
          Link Parent
          I think that at this point it's only a matter of keeping users habituated to the Microsoft environment instead of making money off of them. They make money with Enterprise & office products, which...

          I think that at this point it's only a matter of keeping users habituated to the Microsoft environment instead of making money off of them. They make money with Enterprise & office products, which have a similar design philosophy to Windows and are therefore easy to use by whoever is used to the OS.

    2. RobotOverlord525
      Link Parent
      Wouldn't that be the Enterprise edition? I don't think Microsoft even allows people to buy a single, perpetual license of that.

      Wouldn't that be the Enterprise edition? I don't think Microsoft even allows people to buy a single, perpetual license of that.

      1 vote
  9. [2]
    gingerbeardman
    Link
    My only experience with Win 11 is the ARM version in a VM and I'm suprised how quickly that boots. My M1 MBP also boots into Monterey in a few seconds. Hmm, maybe this is just the highlighting the...

    My only experience with Win 11 is the ARM version in a VM and I'm suprised how quickly that boots. My M1 MBP also boots into Monterey in a few seconds.

    Hmm, maybe this is just the highlighting the difference between Intel and ARM in my experience.

    2 votes
    1. [2]
      Comment deleted by author
      Link Parent
      1. babypuncher
        (edited )
        Link Parent
        I'm going to be a little pedantic and offer some clarification here. First, there are two features that often get confused. There is Fast Boot (a feature provided by your UEFI/BIOS) and Fast...

        I'm going to be a little pedantic and offer some clarification here.

        First, there are two features that often get confused. There is Fast Boot (a feature provided by your UEFI/BIOS) and Fast Startup (a feature provided by Windows).

        Fast Boot basically skips a few checks during BIOS initialization and shortens the window during which you can access the UEFI or built in boot menu. You shouldn't need to disable this when dual booting. All the time savings occur before the boot loader is executed.

        Fast Startup basically turns the shutdown button in Windows into a light version of hibernate. The state of the kernel and its modules are suspended to the disk, and restored to memory on next boot, shortening the boot process. When it does this, it does not cleanly close out the handles on internal NTFS or FAT drives, because that context should still be valid after the next boot. However, to any operating system trying to mount these volumes after Windows shuts down like this, they will appear "dirty". You should disable Fast Startup in Windows if you have internal NTFS drives that you intend to mount in both operating systems.

        All this said, I have both of these features disabled and my boot times are still < 20 seconds into either Windows or Fedora.

        1 vote
  10. [2]
    futuraprime
    Link
    I guess I don’t understand how this is different to the kind of bundling Microsoft was doing in the 90s with Internet Explorer that got them docked for an antitrust violation. Office, at least,...

    I guess I don’t understand how this is different to the kind of bundling Microsoft was doing in the 90s with Internet Explorer that got them docked for an antitrust violation. Office, at least, must still mostly be used on PCs (not mobiles), where Windows remains overwhelmingly dominant.

    2 votes
    1. boxer_dogs_dance
      Link Parent
      Antitrust enforcement has trended a lot more lax over the last few decades. Biden administration currently has a public comment period open for about another month regarding new stricter...

      Antitrust enforcement has trended a lot more lax over the last few decades. Biden administration currently has a public comment period open for about another month regarding new stricter guidelines. I would encourage US citizens to leave comments supporting enforcement against market concentration and monopoly power. https://www.justice.gov/opa/pr/justice-department-and-ftc-seek-comment-draft-merger-guidelines

      5 votes
  11. [2]
    Dr_Amazing
    Link
    I just want to know what windows Microsoft thinks I use windows search for. Apparently I'm a crazy person because I think it should find files on my computer. Microsoft seems to be under the...

    I just want to know what windows Microsoft thinks I use windows search for. Apparently I'm a crazy person because I think it should find files on my computer.

    Microsoft seems to be under the impression that these files could be anywhere. So it checks the internet first. Looks in their weird app store thing (I'm using a computer like. Why is there an app store anyway?) Then maybe checks a few folders on my computer and can't find the file even if I type the exact name.

    2 votes
    1. Nihilego
      Link Parent
      Something browsers do by extension too, I have disabled search suggestions because every browser with it on assumes I want to search Windows 11 from the web, not from my history or other tabs,...

      Something browsers do by extension too, I have disabled search suggestions because every browser with it on assumes I want to search Windows 11 from the web, not from my history or other tabs, made even worse when it searches for history and tabs first, then loads search suggestions and pushes them away, making you accidentally click or arrow the search suggestions instead of what you want.