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    1. It's been just over a week since the experiment with hiding comment vote counts was started, so as promised I've turned it back off now, and votes are visible again. There was already a fair...

      It's been just over a week since the experiment with hiding comment vote counts was started, so as promised I've turned it back off now, and votes are visible again.

      There was already a fair amount of feedback posted in the original topics as well as random other threads over the week, but this can be the main place for "postmortem" feedback now.

      I won't bias the discussion in a particular direction by giving any of my own thoughts just yet, so let me know what you thought of it and whether you think we should consider making any similar changes more permanently.

      71 votes
    2. I want to try another experiment today, and unlike some other times when I've referred to something as an "experiment" and ended up just leaving it around forever, I'll set a specific time limit...

      I want to try another experiment today, and unlike some other times when I've referred to something as an "experiment" and ended up just leaving it around forever, I'll set a specific time limit on this one.

      For the next week, the number of votes on comments will be completely hidden. This applies to everyone and all comments, including your own. I'm not even cheating for myself with admin permissions, I can't see comment vote counts any more either (unless I look it up manually in the database, but I won't do that).

      There's no functional change: you can still vote and sorting will be affected exactly as before, but there's no way to see how many votes a particular comment has. Topic voting is staying unchanged, with the counts still visible.

      I know that some of you are going to hate this. I think that I'm probably going to hate this. But I want to try it, because I think visible vote counts have both positive and negative effects, and I want to try and sort through those a little. Tildes is still small enough right now that almost all threads can be fully read through easily, so the voting isn't really that significant, and this is a good time to try it.

      Here are the main things I'd like to think about, and want to hear from you about:

      • In what cases does not being able to see the votes make things more difficult for you? Are there particular threads that you feel like you need to see the vote counts? Why?
      • From a less functional perspective, when does not being able to see the counts feel better or worse?
      • Can you think of other ways that we could accomplish the positive aspects (ones that are lost by hiding the counts), without showing an actual vote count?

      Thanks, let me know what you think. Initial reactions/thoughts are good, but I'm also interested in your thoughts after a few days, once you've gotten a little more accustomed to it.

      (And as is pretty usual with "official" posts now, I'm using this as a good time to top everyone back up to 10 invites)

      129 votes
    3. Seriously, no downvotes was the best decision Tildes ever made. Just try to have the wrong opinion on reddit, the hive will hiss at you, downvote you, and bully you for having a mind of your own....

      Seriously, no downvotes was the best decision Tildes ever made. Just try to have the wrong opinion on reddit, the hive will hiss at you, downvote you, and bully you for having a mind of your own. Here, I feel like I could say practically anything within reason and get all sorts of interesting discussion and no hate. This site really is one of the best places for discussion on the internet, especially compared to reddit and similar half-forums which are basically just every community flinging poop at each other. I think the reddit model just forces people to not want to think different. "Oh, I better not say that, I could lose internet points!" and etc just makes people want to be close minded, and will make them dislike the opposition for downvoting them.

      36 votes
    4. So, votes are supposed to be used on quality content and comments that contribute to the conversation, right? I think the problem with this is, most of the content on Tildes is to that standard,...

      So, votes are supposed to be used on quality content and comments that contribute to the conversation, right? I think the problem with this is, most of the content on Tildes is to that standard, and if it isn't, we can just tag/report it. Voting feels redundant to me. What does everyone else think?

      13 votes
    5. Why? My mouse, as well as my vision, are focused on the left. The vote box feels like its light years away on a 16:9 screen. It's on the opposite side of the screen from everything else I might...

      Why? My mouse, as well as my vision, are focused on the left. The vote box feels like its light years away on a 16:9 screen. It's on the opposite side of the screen from everything else I might click in the GUI. Its a waste of time/movement.

      HTH!

      28 votes
    6. This is, of course, all anecdotal. Spiteful downvotes are a common occurrence on Reddit. Sometimes I'm arguing in a deeply nested thread with a single person, and every one of my responses...

      This is, of course, all anecdotal.

      Spiteful downvotes are a common occurrence on Reddit. Sometimes I'm arguing in a deeply nested thread with a single person, and every one of my responses receives an immediate combo of reply and downvote. It's clear that the person arguing with me is the one making the downvotes, which doesn't seem fair. That's not an indication of my contribution to the debate, they just wanna "win".

      In other occasions, when I go against the hive-mind, subjective interpretations of my phrasing renders a torrent of downvotes. I'm not talking about active belligerence on my part, but subtle differences that indicate minor defiance to the norm.

      Upvoting seems less toxic. Some subs can use it to brigade /r/all, but that's easily addressable by the admins (I'm not saying they do). While downvotes can easily go unnoticed, upvotes are public by nature, they attract lots of attention, so if something vicious is upvoted the backlash it receives is frequently enough to put the author in their right place.

      Tildes lack of downvotes is liberating. Not that I have the urge to post controversial stuff, but the lack of an easy "fuck you button" makes it possible for me to speak with nuance. I'm more preoccupied with what I wanna say than with the 300 implicit rules [1] I must follow to avoid being buried for offending the intricate biases of every sub.

      And before this gets political, please notice that I never post on those subs. I'm speaking of "silly" places like /r/aww, /r/DunderMifflin/, /r/howyoudoin and /r/programmerHumor/.

      So yeah: thank you, Tildes!

      [1] I have no trouble following explicit ones.

      65 votes
    7. We have the "Exemplary" label for comments, which identifies comments as particularly good, and even boosts their ranking within threads. Now that we've had this for a while, I keep finding myself...

      We have the "Exemplary" label for comments, which identifies comments as particularly good, and even boosts their ranking within threads.

      Now that we've had this for a while, I keep finding myself want to do the same for topics. I'll read an article and want to give it an extra boost because it's better than average.

      I'm ready for an equivalent to the "Exemplary" label for topics.

      30 votes
    8. I've seen some discussion of what voting should be used for here on tildes. Here are the things I try to follow when voting on comment: Does it have a reputable looking source ( I open the source...

      I've seen some discussion of what voting should be used for here on tildes.

      Here are the things I try to follow when voting on comment:

      • Does it have a reputable looking source ( I open the source and check it out)?
      • Does it have new information?
      • Is this a comment whose votes are acting as a form of population polling?
      • Does it contain a well thought out point/ multiple paragraphs?

      Here are the things I try to follow when voting on a post:

      • Is it important for other people to see?
      • Is it reputable?
      • Does it contribute to the greater tildes dialogue?

      I try to make sure it takes more than one of these for me to vote on a comment or page but that certainly isn't always the case. The one thing I try to stay away from is from voting just because I liked the title or because I agreed with an easy 1-3 sentence opinion unless I think that opinion is really important.

      14 votes
    9. A problem I've noticed on Reddit (and here sometimes) is that a thread will have a good subject and a good amount of replies, but less than half the upvotes/votes than there are replies, even...

      A problem I've noticed on Reddit (and here sometimes) is that a thread will have a good subject and a good amount of replies, but less than half the upvotes/votes than there are replies, even though people are clearly enjoying the discussion. So, I was wondering if we'd be able to implement a feature that automatically votes for a post if you comment on it. Or, instead of forcing it, have a checkbox near the post form specifying whether or not you'd like to vote the post up upon completion of the comment. That might give good discussion posts some visibility instead of just posts that are a shitshow in the comments section

      EDIT: I don't know what I'm talking about move along please

      3 votes
    10. This would help, but not completely fix, two issues that seem to be inherent in the Tildes design: \1 Voting is mostly treated as an "I agree" button. You'll see this in pretty much any thread...

      This would help, but not completely fix, two issues that seem to be inherent in the Tildes design:

      \1 Voting is mostly treated as an "I agree" button. You'll see this in pretty much any thread where there's back and forth discussion. When you reply to a comment you're implicitly saying "this comment is worth engaging with," in which case an upvote is warranted.

      Same thing for topics: leaving a top-level comment should force an upvote for the topic.

      \2 It encourages non-engagement with comments that maybe shouldn't be engaged with. For example, one hot topic of this week has been the calling out of low-effort posts and how the community ought to chill out a bit. By forcing an upvote, it discourages replying to said posts, which makes it more likely that such comments will be ignored and drift to the bottom of a topic.

      Edit: Whether this idea is implemented or not, as long as Voting = "I Agree" this site will become an even bigger echo chamber than Reddit because there are no downvotes to balance out the "I support the message of this topic/comment" crowd.

      19 votes
    11. I'd like to start a discussion on the topic of electronic voting and how it could be implemented in a secure way, while also discussing what advantages such a system could have over traditional...

      I'd like to start a discussion on the topic of electronic voting and how it could be implemented in a secure way, while also discussing what advantages such a system could have over traditional paper ballot (which, in my opinion, are still the gold standard).

      To start the conversation, I could propose my (hypothetical) solution. Voting seems like a no-brainer application for Blockchain technology, and its transparency and immutability offer some immediate benefits. My idea is a system where voters still register and walk into booths as they do today, but once they submit their vote electronically, a keypair is created on the spot for them, with the option to print out their public key. This offers a couple of key benefits:

      • Accountability: You can always input your public key and see your vote. This can ensure no tampering is done, and you can ensure the integrity of your vote during the entire election.

      • Visibility: With a system like this, the blockchain could be made public. As each keypair is generated at the time of voting, they are, for all intents and purposes, completely anonymous. This will allow any third party to monitor votes coming in real time, removing the dependency on a centralized body to count the votes, allowing anyone to see exactly how the votes are shaping up.

      I'd love to hear any criticisms or pitfalls of this, any other advantages you might be able to think of, or any other implementations you guys think might be better. Or hell, if there's no way electronic voting can prove to be better than paper ballots, I'd love to hear your arguments as to why.

      16 votes
    12. The USA in particular has one of the lowest voter turnouts and the lowest registration levels of most developed countries....

      The USA in particular has one of the lowest voter turnouts and the lowest registration levels of most developed countries.

      http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2018/05/21/u-s-voter-turnout-trails-most-developed-countries/

      In 2016 only 61% of eligible citizens voted and only 70% were registered.

      https://www.census.gov/data/tables/time-series/demo/voting-and-registration/p20-580.html

      And that was a good year.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Voter_turnout#Trends_of_decreasing_turnout_since_the_1980s

      10 votes
    13. Disagree button

      Having surfed reddit for several years, I've always had the impression that its voting system cannot handle controversial topics well. Although it's an official rule that comments shouldn't be...

      Having surfed reddit for several years, I've always had the impression that its voting system cannot handle controversial topics well. Although it's an official rule that comments shouldn't be downvoted in disagreement, downvotes are very often used that way. This sometimes leads to less "valuable" content being on top of threads, for example jokes.

      I think that it's beneficial for discussions to have good controversial opinions in higher positions as they are now on reddit. But I understand that people want to state their disagreement and don't always want to comment to do so. Also, I think many disliked that the public upvote/downvote counters were removed.

      Something that could help with all of that would be a disagree button for each comment together with a counter that shows how many people clicked that button. The button wouldn't have any effect on sort sequence.

      What do you all think of this?

      Edit: Added clarification that there wouldn't be an effect on sort sequence.

      11 votes
    14. I'm grateful for being invited and I'm happy to see the community enjoy a smooth ride so far. I really hope the platform does not follow in the footsteps of Reddit's karma mechanism. I find that...

      I'm grateful for being invited and I'm happy to see the community enjoy a smooth ride so far.

      I really hope the platform does not follow in the footsteps of Reddit's karma mechanism. I find that this cumulative store of points attached to each user to encourages them to seek more points, regardless if they steal content or repost their own old material for another karma-harvesting run. Instead, if users can be appreciated by the actual number of posts they've submitted much like the bulletin boards of old, it would be more fair in my opinion. It'd be a measure of the effort and contribution made by a user, not only what others think of them.

      For example, my profile would say "Eyehigh posted 20,000 posts" instead of "Eyehigh seemed to impress 20,000 people enough for them to leave an upvote, so here's the 20,000 upvotes."

      What do you think?

      12 votes
    15. As an Ontarian in the Oshawa riding, I’m undecided. I really don’t see that any of the big three (NDP, Liberal, PC) deserve my vote. I wonder what other Canadians in Ontario think of the upcoming...

      As an Ontarian in the Oshawa riding, I’m undecided. I really don’t see that any of the big three (NDP, Liberal, PC) deserve my vote. I wonder what other Canadians in Ontario think of the upcoming election.

      Edit - More

      9 votes
    16. I know similar topics have been discussed, but I'd like to talk about removing the vote count OR, having the count appear after you've voted. To be clear, I'd like to keep the voting mechanism...

      I know similar topics have been discussed, but I'd like to talk about removing the vote count OR, having the count appear after you've voted. To be clear, I'd like to keep the voting mechanism as-is, just reduce the visibility of the actual number of votes.

      It's not foolproof, but it might reduce the "bandwagon" voting we're trying to avoid. I realize that vote count could still be guessed based on sorting by "most votes," but I think this is a worthwhile discussion to have.

      *Edit 2: Removed the joke I made about spamming as I think it detracts from the conversation.

      20 votes