Just wanna talk about drinking less
I don't want to say I'm an alcoholic but I might be. Over the last several years, my drinking has increased from once or twice a week to daily, to the point where I'd start my day off in the weekend with a drink. I knew it wasn't good, but it was a habit I fell into.
Obviously I'm aware enough about it to do something. I've quit smoking cigarettes, so I at least understand the quitting process, but I also don't want to (and don't think I could) give up drinking forever like I did with quitting cigarettes.
My wife is also a drinker, but is much more moderated about it. Thing is, it meant that even if I didn't buy drinks for me, there's always been drinks in the house and so... I drank that. I've finally convinced her that for financial and dietary reasons it would be beneficial to us to stop buying drinks for at home. For my own self, I know that if I don't have a drink around I just won't drink.
This works great but, I find myself lost and listless now! It's a frustrating feeling that I remember well from when I was quitting cigarettes, and I know I just need to work through those moments and keep myself busy otherwise. With the nice weather, I've been biking a lot more and spending more time outside with my kids. At night is when it's toughest - those times after everyone else is asleep and before I go to bed.
I'm not really looking for advice or anything, I just want to share somewhere my experience so far, because it feels good to write about it and express my feelings. Maybe it'll help.
Also if anyone has a suggestion for something to replace beer, I'd appreciate it. I don't like fruity, or soft drinks. Currently I'm getting by with enormous amounts of sparkling water but sometimes I want some flavor, but most drinks that aren't beer are cloyingly sweet and disgusting.
If you like ginger, there’s a whole array of ginger based drinks that give some kick without being really sweet. Of course you have your ginger ale and ginger beer, which are still sweet, but if you can get your hands on some quality concentrate and mix it with sparkling water.. the spiciness will warm you. You could probably make it yourself if you want.
If you like tea, you could probably find a blend that has a bitter flavor profile.
And depending on your locale, there could be some good tasting 0% alcohol beers.
Seconding tea!
We call our house the perpetual kettle we drink so much tea. I used to drink black tea, but because I use making tea as an excuse to take a break from work (kind of like a smoke break) I ended up drinking 5-10 cups of tea a day. In my mid twenties I started getting these weird stroke signs like my fingers would curl in on themselves if I wasn't paying attention and I learned just how much caffeine tea had. So I fully switched to herbal and decaf tea. I've had a stacked tea drawer for about a decade now with about 15 kinds of tea I buy in bulk: Decaf Earl Grey, Mint, Winter Fruit, Jasmin, Lemon peal and ginger, lemon grass... I think it might fulfill some of the "listlessness" you're talking about.
As a weird aside I started drinking chicken stock in the mornings. I get bad seasonal allergies and found that soup broth often cleared my system quite well and when I started swimming in the mornings it was quite a prize to come back to. Just a thought that you might be able to make this more of a fun thing, like "hmmm... what weird beverage am I craving" and turn it into a bit of a mission.
Can't say I'm a fan of ginger, and I feel like NA beer is cheating somehow... Also, still pricey.
In what ways do you find that non-alcoholic beer is "cheating"? Does it feel like you are cheating another person? Yourself? Something else?
What values would you like to adhere to when you make decisions about your consumption?
How would you evaluate alternatives to drinking in accordance with these observations about your natural inclinations and your stated values?
Cheating because I was telling my wife we're in it together, and while it's primarily about health there's also an aspect of "We'll save a bunch of money" to it.
It’s still a fair bit cheaper I think; my partner and I typically buy a 12 pack of 330ml NA beers a week for about 10-12£. Thing is you usually just have one at a time, so we don’t drink more than that. I think it has been quite effective, we would drink quite a lot before just casually, and end up spending a lot of money on it. There’s something about it being a kind of ‘adult’ drink that you drink slowly, after work, and has relaxation vibes I guess.
You can get into buying all kinds of fancy brands though, and some folks with severe addictions do describe them being a kind of trigger of gateway back to drinking, or something they can start to show obsessive or addictive behaviour towards of itself. Still probably worth trying though.
I still think non-alcoholic beer is your best bet. It is significantly more popular now then it was even 5 years ago, which means both craft and traditional breweries are making delicious beer that just happens to be non-alcoholic.
I wouldn't say that I drank as much as you, but I still drank more than I wanted. They started selling beer in grocery stores in Ontario and I accidentally picked up a case of non-alcoholic beer. I didn't realize until the 5th beer that I had accidentally grabbed the NA version of one of my favourite beers. This opened a whole world to me and I found that many of my favourite breweries were also making various NA beer. Over time I switched. First I drank a mixed amount, then mostly NA beer, now I barely drink either. I still am happy to enjoy some beers when out at a BBQ or a restaurant, but don't really keep any at home.
I'm not saying it is the only way or that it would work for you, but definitely don't rule out non-alcoholic beer.
To echo what the other comment says, I have pretty much switched to NA beer and find that even if the can is the same price as alcoholic beer, I spend less.
I generally am not a big drinker, but that is mostly due to my preeminent vice Laziness. I don’t want to make an extra stop at a liquor store just to buy one item. Hopefully they don’t start selling beer in grocery stores around here. But when I do go to the store and buy beer, I get a six pack or whatever and take it home. I open and drink one, and I find that one alcoholic beer is just enough to make me think I need just one more. And I finish the second because waste not want not. But these days, 2 6% IPAs is enough to make think I should drink another. Usually I’m in bed after three.
But with NA, I almost always feel much less likely to grab a second and not because of taste. I just am making better decisions. And when I’m out with friends it’s empowering to know I can drive home without the extra hassle or risk.
I only started to figure this out the last couple of years in my mid 30s. My body also can’t handle the level of drinking I did in college/early career.
tl,dr: NA beer doesn’t lead you to over spend on drinks
Same boat, same rapids.
I traded alcohol dependency with cannabis/delta8/THC A. It's NOT a great substitute, but at least there's no calories and it's saving my liver.
The trade is physical symptoms for psychological. I no longer know what is real. Hard to distinguish my thoughts from my feelings. I feel like one gelatinous blob of myself. Sure, I can hit the d8 vape and get numb and play video games and the day is over before I know it—i am feeling no pain—but after years of daily abuse, running from the alcohol, I'm just as dependent as an alcoholic. I can't not smoke at work. Sometimes I'll go a week without bringing the vape to work, but something will happen and I'm back to it.
I wish I had advice. But I am also looking for it.
I shook hands with my inner child at the turn of my 20s and agreed that I will always choose cannabis over alcohol. But finding myself feeling guilty for choosing a something more lateral than just facing my fears head on.
Anyone else feel the same?
Just an unsolicited thought from someone who spent about 5 years high from 18-22 until I was arrested for possession and legally had to change my habits. The drawback to getting high I don't think people often talk about is how it can stamp out ambition. I don't mean like "I want to be a high achiever" kind of ambition, just the basic "I want these small things in my life to happen" kind. Since I was about 24 or 25, any time I smoke weed I marvel that I have been able to accomplish in my life. I'm not talking about big things, but just living places I'd like or working jobs that I enjoy. I think of all the things coming up in my life that I need to do and I feel a sense of overwhelming and anxiety about them. They feel insurmountable, so like you say, I watch tv or play video games or find some distraction. It's easy to slip into that numb state. The next day I feel fine about everything and it all seems normal again.
It took about a year without smoking at all to really change my perspective on it. Initially I really wanted to rejoin my friends and get stoned. But those feels passed as I started finding value/solance in other things like my career and the sports I was doing - particularly rock climbing. These days, I don't intentionally limit myself to getting high every so often, but it's happened naturally because I don't like that overwhelming feeling. I've turned it into a ritual of sorts now. Either I wait for a nice sunny weekend, prep a bunch of nice munchies, crank the tunes, and clean the house/garden; or I wait until the evening, play some melancholy music and just lean into the feelings and try to appreciate what I have.
I think like most of the folks on here finding a replacement can be a good crutch. I've used exercise as my crutch since my early twenties and I think it's a pretty solid replacement. You still get the hit of endorphins - and it is a hell of a drug - but you don't get the negative side effects with it.
That's my 2 cents. It's had to transition away from something without a replacement, but the replacement doesn't always need to be a substance.
I see this a lot in friends and people I know and as a former Stoner, I know the feelings well. Heaps of people I know seem to just be stuck in life and really going nowhere; we're all entering our 40's now and their lives are largely indistinguishable from when we were in our 20's and it's kind of...not disappointing, as it's their life, but having quit 7 years ago now, I feel like I can see what they can't.
In those 7 years I've developed a huge amount of new hobbies, skills and dramatically improved other aspects of my life that I don't think would have happened if I was still that same stoner guy I was from my late 20's to my early 30's. Occasionally when I have time to myself, with no one around I think to myself, "Hey, I could get high." but then wonder why I would want to, because it just means entering a vegetative state, accomplishing nothing and having no real thoughts on what's going on around me or what I might be consuming. Then there's the anxiety that comes along with it as well and it just doesn't seem worth it.
Yeah, it's odd to see. I have 3 friends who never really transitioned out of that phase and interacting with them is like stepping in a time machine. For context we're all 35+. One works in an ice cream parlor and has a revolving group of friends from ~19 to 23 - you know people you might expect to work at an ice cream shop in a college town. None of them think his lifestyle is weird, because it's the same as theirs. But for us, when we get roped into group chats for his birthday and he's still talking about "hooking up the booze" it's jarring and kind of sad. He had a psychedelic induced mental break at 25 when he was already in this pattern and a bit behind; and I think that's the age he paused at. Many of us stay in touch but it's hard to have a normal relationship. I've given up broaching how things could be different and I'm still convinced if he just stopped smoking for like a month things could be different. But he doesn't want to hear it and I get that.
I quit smoking weed 7 years ago, because it was not possible for me to moderate and it became something that was absolutely all consuming. If I wasn't high, I'd be thinking about when I could next get high. If I was high, I'd be thinking about how much weed I have, when I can smoke again and wishing that I could be more high. It became this mentally exhausting cycle where I didn't have the brain space for anything else and while it wasn't that alone that encouraged me to quit entirely, it was a big portion of it.
At this point, I can't imagine ever going back to it. It certainly removes the tedium to some of life, but life is also about finding healthy ways to cope with tedium and boredom and weed is an easy solution, but ultimately an unfulfilling one.
Yeah I resonate with this a bit too - I've been using cannabis since I was 17. It's one of the only substances I feel I can have a healthy relationship with. It's easy to avoid it when I need to, I don't crave it, I just enjoy it occasionally. It also helped A LOT when I was getting over cigarettes.
I've actually found I want to use it less and less as I get older, but like you said, I'll always choose it over booze. I just wish I could get back to herb instead of vaping it - it's just that herb is so much more expensive, and it's smelly.
I don't really have advice for you either, just saying I totally understand how you can use one milder drug to replace another.
I feel some of that.
I love weed and think it is a net benefit in my life at this point. But I have developed a dependency, and have overused and abused it at times. It's something I have to be mindful of.
Here are some practical things that work for me:
I've set an arbitrary dosage of 1 gram of cannabis a week. I use actual flower and use a dry vape(mighty+ or dynavap). I also drew an arbitrary line against any of the synthetic or concentrated stuff. The closest I get is sprinkling in some of the keif from the bottom of my grinder sometimes.
Within those guidelines I give myself some flexibility to use it as needed. But I try to take at least 24 hours off every 2-3 days of usage. And a week off every 2-3 months.
I never use it at work (my job is potentially dangerous, it's not even a temptation for me). I also don't drive while high, which limits when I can use it a lot. I have a general feeling that I need to get all my important stuff done and then use cannabis to help switch into relax mode, where I get to destress and be curious and creative.
Not only do I need to get stuff done first, but I feel like I just need to spend most of my time in sober mode in order to fully enjoy and take advantage of high mode. Its like each mode recharges the other. Or like when you go back and forth between a cold pool to a hot tub. Its more enjoyable than staying in one for too long, at least for me.
I think it's an interesting and dangerous time for cannabis right now. Being somewhat legal in so many states in the US, and in Canada, means that a lot more people are using a lot more of it. Capitalism is doing it's thing and marketing as much of it as possible at people without any consideration of their safety. Because of its legal status I feel we have very little reliable information about the effects cannabis.
I really wish I could go to a psychiatrist or some other trusted professional, discuss the benefits and negatives of cannabis and discuss a way for me to use it responsibly. The same way people do with other meds. My understanding is that isn't possible in the US with current federal laws. Which is frustrating.
Yes, very much feel this. I have traded dependencies for other dependencies for most of my life. I am currently 38 and at the lowest level of substance use I've ever been at. I do still drink, infrequently, but struggle not to turn it into a binge. Putting effort into friendships with sober people has changed my life, instead of prioritizing friendships with people who will validate my alcohol urges. I still use cannabis (and always will) for its benefits, but it took me a really long time to even recognize the way I used it that weren't benefitting me. There is a threshold I'll pass where I'm not using it to help me sleep or help me focus, but using it just to be numb and dissociate.
I have done a lot of therapy, and have done some reading for helping me understand myself better. The book that stands out for me is called Self Therapy, and this method of self reflection is the only method I've tried that I feel like has lasted and felt like permanent changes were happening and I wasn't just denying a part of myself the right to exist.
As someone who quit drinking a 1000 times, the only way that worked and completely eradicated my desire to drink was by following the Sinclair Method.
That is taking a Naltrexone tablet 1 hour before drinking and then drink as normal, as long as you do that every time you drink then gradually your desire to drink will diminish to the point of not wanting to drink anymore. Plenty of people still drink following treatment but it is completely under control and not the other way around with alcohol controlling you.
Here’s a video about it https://youtu.be/6EghiY_s2ts?si=0dj9OW2e7g9BvOXG
An absolute miracle and infuriating how a medically proven way to reduce alcohol intake is not given more attention. AA is not for everyone, it certainly wasn’t for me.
Good luck, life is immeasurably better without alcohol
This is 100% exactly what my dad was saying, except it was about baclofene instead of naltrexone. From what I understand, both drugs have similar effects on addictions such as alcoholism.
He was a massive advocate of it. It didn't work, he stopped drinking when he died 3 months ago, and I rarely saw him sober. I miss the dad and grandpa he could have been.
I don't know you, and I truly hope that your alcohol consumption is under control, and if that drug helped you that's awesome. I'm sure it helps many people in ways I can't understand.
But please, don't say it's a miracle drug that will magically cure your addiction while allowing you to keep drinking. Such a drug doesn't exist.
Thanks for your comment and I am so sorry for your loss, the damage alcohol causes extends so far and I really do hope you are doing OK. I understand completely what you say and agree that the concept of still drinking while addicted feels like playing with fire.
I was ready to stop drinking and stayed 100% compliant with the Sinclair Method. The ability to carry on drinking while the drug did it's work freed me from the deprivation effect of not being able to drink, then slowly over the space of 6 months the desire to drink disappeared and now I don't drink at all.
If I was to have a drink again, I would still take the tablet and this is perhaps one of the drawbacks of the treatment is that of course you could slip back into old ways if drinking without Naltrexone as the brain can get re-addicted. But I simply don't want to.
I'm sorry for calling it a miracle drug based my own experience, but the long-term success rate in countless studies since the late 1970's is between 70-80% so the Sinclair Method really can work and I have no problem recommending it to anyone who is struggling or continually relapsing.
Wish you all the best, and once again I'm really sorry for what happened to your dad.
I'm doing fine I guess. I mostly mourn what could have been, I don't know if that's better...
I'm glad you're doing better, and thanks for your response and concern. Take care.
I didn't know of this drug before but I'm also a bit skeptical here. I understand from Christian's explanation that it blocks endorphins so you don't get a reward from consuming the addictive product. Coolio. But like.... what about the rest of the activities you do all day? It's not like the drug can block endorphin release for only your bad, destructive habits. Wouldn't it just lead you to depression?
I may have undiagnosed ADHD (questioning) and I'm thinking this thing would ruin me if I had a physical addiction and tried treating it like this. My dopamine baseline is already low enough that I struggle with most daily tasks ; if I had no endorphin either I might just end up lying on the floor all day
If you are drinking daily at the start of the treatment then yes there absolutely can be a decrease in pleasure from other things as well as alcohol. I was drinking every day and noticed it slightly but it really was not significant or anywhere near having no motivation to do anything.
I already had plenty of hobbies and things that I generally enjoyed doing (although often couldn't) and it is really helpful to then on days when you are not drinking (taking Naltrexone) to engage in activities that boost your endoprhins, exercise etc. Your brain will then begin to associate these with pleasure and fun whilst at the same time the Naltrexone is blocking any reward from alcohol. A re-wiring of your brains reward system slowly takes place and eventually the desire to drink disappears, that is what happened to me anyway.
Of course this is all done through a doctor so would take into account things that could hinder progress or make existing conditions worse.
For a moment, if you think from a spiritual perspective, all materialism is essentially addiction of some form or other.
Some are acute and intense (like cigarettes, alcohol and drugs) while others are long-term spread over effects (like want for luxuries and ambitions, better car and house, better career, more power and prestige in society, etc.). But it all comes down to achievement of these material add-ons or levels, and then your brain rewarding you with little bits of dopamine each time you achieve them. I call "little bits" because they feel very pleasurable but don't last very long. After a while, the effect starts waning and the withdrawal symptoms start pushing you towards the next level in the video game towards the next dopamine reward.
But there is little doubt that the acute and near term addictions are much worse in the sense that their withdrawal symptoms alter your brain and nervous system drastically, and clouds your judgment and makes you behave irrationally unless you consume the addiction you crave. It also worsens your health, smoking damages the lungs and respiratory system slowly whereas alcohol eats your liver if consumed too much.
I used to be a heavy smoker back in my college days, nicotine used to afflict my brain and cloud my judgment. What made me quit one fine day was not my meditation practice but the ultimate realization that all materialism is fickle, we haven't brought anything with us nor will we carry anything with us when we depart. Though meditation helps a lot in achieving that realization.
But everyone is different, this method may not suit to everyone, there are other ways of quitting addictions too. Whichever way you use, make sure you quit the intense addictions at least, because they only bring miseries from all aspects, be it physical, mental or spiritual.
I think you're underselling the physical dependency involved here -- alcohol withdrawal can literally be fatal if someone is physically dependent on it. While I think comparing the psychological factors of addiction more broadly can make sense, it's foolish to ignore the very real difference between substances that cause physical dependency as well and those that only cause psychological addiction. The "withdrawal" a shopping or gambling addict has if they stop shopping or gambling is not the same as the withdrawal someone with a physical dependency on alcohol or heroin will have if they stop those without medical help.
I don't get the impression OP had enough of an alcohol problem that the dangerous physical withdrawal is an issue for them personally. But I think it can be dangerous to offer advice that equates physical and psychological dependence like this, and even more to equate these things to things that aren't even psychological dependence.
Biking is my meditation. I'm not much of a spiritual person, a lot of it feels very woo-woo to me. But meditation is absolutely something I've had tangible benefits from. I used to do yoga, and loved that. I still use some techniques every day, but I don't practice daily yoga routines.
This is a bit of a rambling post. Thank you for sharing your experience.
I have friends who are alcoholics who don't think they're alcoholics, because they have good jobs, families, are generally responsible and so on.
The most illustrative point though is that many of them try to relate to me about "you know how when it's a long day and you're just craving a beer" or " you know how when you have a drink, it's so easy to just keep going and before you know it you've killed a six pack?" They're shocked when I tell them that no, I can't relate to either of those things.
I have that feeling with other things, things that I know I'm addicted to (caffeine mostly). I don't know how it feels to crave a drink, or to lose control of drinking and somehow intentionally drink six drinks and not know it.
I think if that's something you do identify with, you're addicted to alcohol, regardless of whether it's currently negatively affecting your life.
You might get into making mocktails, if you want some drinks that are not just water but non-alcoholic. With the amount of recipes out there, you can surely find some that suit your tastes. Since you don't like fruity drinks, you could err on the side of earthy, herbal, or spicy ones, e.g.:
Cucumber Sekanjabin Sharbat
Cardamom-Rose Bhang (contains cannabis, I think)
Chile Cucumber Agua Fresca
Just as examples, there are myriad options out there.
There is no shame in drinking N/A beer. If you're in North America, some I've enjoyed for the hoppy brewed flavors are Penn's Best, Coors Edge, Guinness 0.0 (it's darn close), and one Sierra Nevada has. Even O'Douls (both varieties) are solid. Athletic is pretty good too. I would go for hoppy styles like pale ales, over porters and stouts (except Guinness, they nailed it). I drink considerably less than I used to, and N/A beer gets me the same yeasty, malty and/or hoppy flavors I enjoy. Talk with your wife about it if you're worried about "cheating," even, sometimes you just want a certain flavor, and there's nothing wrong with responsibly endulging. I think of it like soda you need an ID for with a different flavor, and I find it scratches the itch well enough both for the flavor and the ritual.
Before bed if you want something, get some herbal tea. I became quite fond of chamomile which can be bought cheap online in bulk but tea bags are also cheap anyway, but there are so many brands and styles out there you will probaby find something you like.
I've struggled with being a legit alcoholic and this has helped me back off. I'm far from the extreme side of it, more seeing a habit build and pumping the brakes on it.
I am in active treatment for Alcoholism and Addiction, to give this context.
I want you to be aware that the general scientific consensus is that alcoholism is considered to be a 'progressive disease.' Meaning it will only worsen over time if you do not address it properly. I would also hazard a guess that the large majority of individuals who admit they 'might be an alcoholic' very much are, but are in the earlier stages of the disease. I went through that phase myself. Nobody wants to admit there is something "wrong" with them, especially when alcoholism and addiction are so fucking villainized and stigmatized in our culture.
The thing is, it slowly does alter your brain over time if you are predisposed to the disease, and there are no two ways about it. I had mostly kept my issues under wraps for 2 or 3 years after recognizing it had become a problem, but when I had some real trouble in my personal life and COVID hit, the proper relapse was much, much worse than before. Generally, every relapse is going to be worse than the previous one.
Nobody can make you seek help but you, or a judge. I will note that 7/10 individuals in my IOP group (Intensive Outpatient Treatment) are court-ordered. And they were in residential treatment for 6-12 months prior to this program, whereas I sought help myself and have never had any legal issues, so I got to move that part of the process forward a little faster than most.
Everyone wants to believe they can control it through willpower alone, but straight up the science says that is not how it works. It may work that way in the beginning when you are just starting to have alcohol, but at a certain point the disease takes over and starts influencing your decisions. And this is a slow, somewhat insidious process. Things you think to be conscious thoughts are really rationalizations to explain away any problems you notice, and justify the continued drinking, driven by the disease.
If you think you might be on that path, consider if chancing it is really what you want to do -- or would you rather cut it off at the pass?
If you are genuinely entertaining the idea of treatment -- which in your case, would probably be much less painful than most given you would be on the earlier ends of the disease -- I am happy to answer any questions about the process. I've only been in active treatment for a month now, and I already feel much better about myself than I have in 5 years.
Edit: If you have moved to drinking daily over a period of time, you are an alcoholic, straight up. You can look at the most commonly used assessment questionnaires, they'll be fast and might give you a little more appreciation for where you really are.
10 Questions, a little more discerning
4 Questions, 2 yes answers is 91% sensitivity for alcoholism
If you're looking for a beer replacement there are many non-alcoholic or extremely low alcohol beer options out there. I find the Heineken 0% is the closest one to tasting like actual beer and the calorie content isn't too high. Some of the traditional german brands make good non-alcoholic alternatives too. A lot of the other options on the market are a tad too sweet for me. My suggestion would be to try different types to see what would work for you. Best of luck on your journey!
We’re a big fan of Athletic Brewing Co NA beer and Lagunitas IPNA. Heineken NA is great as well. I love enjoying a beer without worrying about some of the side effects (high calories, reflux, intoxication, etc).
Thanks for the recommendations, I'll check them out if I can find some around here!
For beer replacement, you can try something like HopLark. They have teas and sparkling water that are brewed or created similar to beer. Very different taste than sparkling water or the likes. I enjoyed going through the sampler pack and trying the different options.
Oh I'll be looking into this thank you.
I think it's great that you're taking the time to think through your situation and even if it feels like all you've written down is a ramble/rant I think it still moves you forward in your understanding of your situation. It's ironic to me that addiction/habits are so strong yet they really get us in the most mundane moments like when we're bored. It's not some great struggle where we fight for our lives, it's just a constant pull.
Let me add another recommendation for tea to the pile. However, I specifically recommend gongfu tea. Gongfu is a style where you steep tea several times in small quantities and appreciate the flavor development through each steep. It's meditative, hands on, and rewarding to experience the different possible flavors. On flavors, the range is honestly incredible. Oolong teas can offer a strong mineral flavor with toastyness brought on from the roasting process or they can have none of those and be vegetal or even savory. White tea can be perfumey or floral or almost taste like honey. There are of course many other kinds and possible flavors. In gongfu, tea is mostly pure Chinese tea leaves which makes it much better than Western teas in terms of lower sweetness. A potential downside is obviously the caffeine. Apparently herbal teas are not a good fit for this style of brewing.
Highly recommend getting a DrinkMate; basically a Soda Stream but better, because the bit that goes in the drink is removable (for cleaning) so you can carbonate literally anything. I've been doing iced mate a lot lately, and my partner has been doing water with homemade spice tinctures like anise, clove, fennel.... All kinds of interesting flavors that are not at all sweet, but really good. So much cheaper than buying seltzer (or beer!) as well.
Do you remember which specific product you're referring to? They seem to have several, and all of them look like a pain in the butt to clean. But I'm willing to keep an open mind, just want to know which one you have so I can look into it further. I've replaced a lot of my drinking with flavored carbonated water, but I get cans, which, while cheaper than beer, are way too expensive for what they actually are: a can filled with like 3 cents worth of ingredients.
https://idrinkproducts.com/collections/at-home/products/sparkling-water-and-soda-maker-carbonates-any-drink-party-bundle
This is what we have, a quick rinse of the head is all it usually needs, and I don't see why you couldn't soak it if a rinse isn't enough.
Ah, it at first looked like the straw went all the way into the bottle, and I'm still not sure how the head works exactly, but I'll figure it out. Thanks!
The straw does go into the bottle, the head screws on like a cap and then slides into the machine. So, the head and straw are the only pieces that touch both liquid and machine, whereas a soda stream bottle screws directly into the machine.
Even if that didn't make sense, the whole thing is very intuitive and I have no doubt you'll figure it out.
I don't have too much useful to say. But I will state my own opinion on your two vices (from experience, not judgment):
Neither of these are good reasons for either.
I am also unsure of NA beverages, seems to me it's just better to go with water? Or maybe soda water (+flavor)? I guess you have to decide whether you actually miss the flavor of alcoholic beverages, or you're just trying to fake out your desire for alcohol.
Last year, I took a trip to visit my husband family and they drank every night with a meal. So when we got back to the states, we developed the habit of drinking often. Both of our family has a terrible history with alcoholism.
After the holidays, we ended up going cold turkey for about two months with one exception (a celebratory milestone). Purposely going cold turkey make us more aware what other choices are there outside of drinking. We are fortunate to live where we have some mocktails or NA beers. We gained a decent amount of clarity and our ability to say no. Honestly it was freeing.
We did eventually brought back some alcohol back, but it's more manegable. We have a few rules.
Hope this helps.
Thank you to all the contributors here! I've read through every comment even if I haven't responded to them all. I especially enjoyed the wealth of alternative drinks to try out, and will certainly be looking into some of them (especially the other grain based drinks brought up, you've gotten me curious).
I also appreciate the resources for those struggling with alcohol addiction. I may not necessarily need those in this moment, but maybe others will and this is a way to nudge them in the right direction. I've navigated the last few days without drinking with aplomb, and while I do plan to have some drinks this weekend at a family event, I don't plan to return to drinking daily.
Changes and challenges will come, but so far the only major issues I've had are listlessness (which I'm curing by diving into a new book I'm very much enjoying) and irritability (which I'm doing my best to manage).
I'm happy to let the topic continue going - there seems to be a wealth of discussion to be had on this subject.
You're not alone man, far from it. Alcohol is so readily enjoyable and so deeply ingrained in (western) culture and it makes you feel great for a bit. It's also very dangerous and harmful but that usually doesn't become apparent until later, I feel.
Keep an ear to the tracks of your own physical and mental wellbeing. Everyone is different and comparing yourself to others when it comes to alcohol dependence is not good - it's how I was in denial for so many years about my own drinking.
I'm now 2533 days without a drink. It took years before I truly started to feel content and OK and like I didn't still want/need to drink. I gave up smoking about a year before quitting the drink and now I vape weed now and again (which so really helped in the early days of quitting drinking).
Keep trying to be honest with yourself and with your partner. Keep trying to be happy. Thanks for posting and for encouraging others to share insight...!
Maybe this could help you? https://aa-intergroup.org/
You don't have to quit completely, but all these people have had struggles with alcohol that they overcame. If you find out how they quit, maybe you could find a way to cut back.
They have online meetings now, so you can attend one anytime without the intimidation of having to go in person.
https://smartrecovery.org/
It's basically AA+Narconon but science/evidence-based and secular, so without the religious baggage.
p.s. Also worth noting is that Narconon is run by Scientology, and they're sketchy AF.
Oh yeah whatever works for people. I think talking to people you can relate to is the most important part.
Would Def prefer something non religious. That being said, I don't have a problem just not buying it! That means I don't drink it either.
If we go out and I have a drink or two, that's fine by me. I just don't want to allow myself to drink daily again.
Ha, I'm in a similar spot - never been much of a drinker, but lately a) I got my first ever car so at a lot of events, I'm not drinking anymore (barely anyone in my friend group has a driver's licence so I'm the DD every time), and b) I bought myself a Garmin watch as I started running more, only to realise how even low alcohol intake absolutely wrecks my quality of sleep. I still drink sometimes, but only for special occasions and when it's drinks I really like (craft beers etc.)
My go-to alternatives are:
When out with friends, I usually go for mocktails or fancy iced teas.
i quit drinking completely for a few years. i switched to water and didn’t try to replace it with anything. i was totally clean for four years or so but now i have about one or two beers per week when i’m cooking… but when that can go any time.
it’s nice to be out of it, to be honest. parties and whatnot were weird at first, but you can always get water in a highball glass with a little ice. :)
Since you mention enjoying beer, you might enjoy exploring other grain-based beverages that aren't alcoholic?
For example, grain-based teas, like mugicha (roasted barley, no caffeine) or genmaicha (green tea with roasted rice). Or, maybe 'milkier' options like horchata. There's also the corn-based chicha morada of Peru (it is a bit fruity, but not overly so, and very spiced, smooth, and refreshing). I'm sure there are many other beverages along these lines I'm unfamiliar with.
Depending on your location, you'd have to make these, but that could help keep your mind occupied a as a new hobby during those moments when you're feeling listless.
A bit of a different response here, since you mentioned kids.
My dad was (and still is) an alcoholic. He destroyed one family before ours, and then effectively destroyed ours twice since my mom gave him a second chance. He falls under the "functional alcoholic" category, which means he's able to drive and mostly hold conversations while drunk. I spent a lot of my childhood not understanding why he sometimes lashed out without reason. One night I basically mourned his death because I knew he could drink one too many and get unlucky and crash the car and die.
I have a memory of getting a video game with my mom and calling him to thank him (since they both would be paying for it). He berated me, told me I didn't really deserve it, etc. He acted like a teenager in how petty he was during arguments. Even today he thinks he has the ability to push me around and deliver vague threats.
So I'm done with him. I'll talk with him a couple times each year and that's as far as I'm willing to go now.
One major difference is that he never admitted he's an alcoholic. He never wanted to get help.
So if for nothing else, do it for your family.
Oh yeah, one thing I'm keenly aware of is my family. I'd never let myself get to that point. My own father was absent mostly, and when I was with him it was the most toxic relationship. He lives far away, both in my thoughts and in general, and I like it that way.
I made a promise to myself I would never let myself be absent in my children's lives like my father was, and never be as toxic and manipulative as he was. I plan to uphold that. I think I'm doing ok so far; this is yet another step to improving myself for them.
Good for you. It's worth mentioning that addiction potential can be genetic, as well as other disorders that some people may address by self medicating in unhealthy ways.
So be patient and forgiving with yourself, because you may be fighting more than just your own experiences.
Thank you. I know I'll be able to overcome this, it just takes time and patience and willingness to change.
I've already completed my first steps - being aware - and taken my next steps, enacting change. Now it's time for the follow-through.
Thanks for your post!
I'm in a similar boat.
How would you feel if we checked in with each other on a monthly basis, to make sure we don't need to seek stronger treatment?
For me, my definition of success is simply me not buying booze for home.
Mine is too - if it isn't in the home then I can't drink it, can I? I recently bought some Chai mix instead and it's been amazing.
I'm really bad about remembering check ins, but I can do my best.
I will try to remember to message you in a month.
I don't know if daily stresses are a contributor, but I never drank regularly until I was under constant work stress. I'd steeped in Florida drinking culture long enough that it came to seem natural to have a glass (or two) of wine at the end of every working day to unwind and sleep. We'd been collecting wine for a long time, and there was always alcohol in the house. It rewarded both through the ease of tension and by tasting good. I never drank for the express purpose of getting drunk, trying to savor what was in the glass.
By the time I got out of that environment I was going through two or three bottles of wine a week. I knew it wasn't doing my health or my waistline any good. I cut back to a few glasses during the week, but then the weekends opened up to social drinking - again, still around 8 - 9 servings of alcohol per week. By then, I was struggling with chronic arthritis pain, and started to substitute drinking with cannabis for pain relief. I didn't like the intoxication from combining THC and alcohol, so started to drink less. I also noticed that I slept better without alcohol. I don't enjoy THC highs - it just makes me sleepy or irritable, so it wasn't a case of substitution.
However, taking a job in local wine industry meant that I was still exposed to social drinking triggers all the time, even without any work stress. I'd cut my intake to 1 glass most days, but never stopped altogether. Finally, I held back to weekends only. I still managed to put away a bottle of wine and more a week. I've paid attention to all of the public health studies on drinking and knew that it wasn't doing my cancer risks any good, but still couldn't reduce my alcohol consumption the way I wanted to.
So I paid for a subscription to Sunnyside, a coaching app for encouraging more mindfulness about drinking. I dropped to a well-considered 3 - 4 servings of alcohol/week, only on days I chose, and that seemed easy enough.
Trying to go a week without wasn't in reach, though. Finally, I wound up on an arthritis medication with strict alcohol restrictions. Anything more than a serving or two (i.e. one ounce of alcohol = 1 serving) per week definitely causes enough liver damage to show up on lab tests... And that's where I've been able to draw the line. Not quitting altogether, I can still enjoy a drink, but it's not a regular part of my life anymore. My spouse still drinks, and I can drink or not as I please when we're out socially. It's surprising how much socializing revolves around drinking, and it's just easier to politely refuse alcohol on medical grounds.
I did have a chance to try Athletic Brewing Company's NA Hazy IPA at a party last weekend. While it doesn't taste exactly like beer, it's very satisfying and refreshing. Caveat: I'd been gardening all day in hot sun, so anything might have tasted good. Mostly, I drink plain well water, coffee, or tea whenever I'm thirsty. Sometimes I'll add citrus-flavored electrolyte powder, but I'll say that my body is happiest when I'm ensuring that I drink enough unflavored, uncarbonated, uncaffeinated water.
I've never gotten into mocktails for the same reason I didn't care for cocktails - they're almost universally too sweet. Sour shrubs and unsweetened sumac tea (tastes like lemon without as much acidity) can be very good for my taste. I haven't yet found an NA wine that tastes as I expect, and stopped trying.
Can you schedule a once-a-week drinking party with your friends/family? That's what I do. Works great. Once a week, and no more. Ever.
I kind of feel this. Weirdly, I've had a good relationship with alcohol (probably because of how conscious I was about alcoholism in the family). I used to drink socially a lot but then tapered down by a mixture of choice and circumstance. But life without enjoying drinking is... hard. I get invited to something that likely involves drinking and all I have in my head is 1) alcohol costs money 2) hangovers cost time 3) isn't there anything earlier? Haha. I don't feel like my sober self is any less me than me with alcohol, but I feel like alcohol-self is better at handling the social aspects of being a person that I struggle with. It's apparently not an uncommon experience.
As far as replacements:
I am another one that benefitted from naltrexone and the Sinclair Method.
I still drink and take the pill 4 years later, but way less than ever. I was a huge binge drinker.
Now 30 pills of naltrexone covers me for a year.
I am a "functional alcoholic" which is just a fancy way of saying that I am an alcoholic without labeling myself with the hardcore drunks.
I love and I mean love beer. I love the taste, the feeling etc. there are times I will drink the entire 12 pack I brought home and not even realized I did until I go for my 13th. I don't black out, I will remember everything I did but drink those 12 beers and be very confused on how it happened. Hell I've drank a whole 30 pack and ended up drinking myself sober. Not proud by any means.
I always quit drinking one month out of the year. It gets picked randomly. Again I love the taste of beer, so I get non alcoholic beer for the month. It's nowhere near as good, and I've yet to find one that tastes like the beers I drink, but it helps. It's not the best but I can tolerate Stella 0.0.
Seems like you're pretty set on this being the way you want to live. I'd advise looking into NAC (N-Acetyl Cysteine) supplements. If you take them a little while before drinking, they help reduce the impact on your liver. I used them myself for a long time when I knew I was an alcoholic, and I just had my first physical in 5 years and my bloodwork said my liver is perfectly normal.
I very much relate to this post. Drink alternative suggestion, get a variety of teas to brew and then ice. This way you get to try different flavors, sweetness can be added but is optional. Tea can have depth of flavor that is interesting, and it's a nice little activity to make it that keeps my hands busy.. Drinks that require steps beyond just opening a bottle I guess.
I used to work at a teahouse! I haven't really found one that hits the way I want, but a good mint tea is always welcome in my house.